Thank you for the effort of lucid commentary. I'll ponder several of the IF..THEN..s you have raised. We seem to be in the same chapter, mostly. Concur with (that which I omitted--the sub-category of ethics-free Bizness needing attention similar to NSA. OK maybe even sooner, as: I trust many Govt. Agencies quite over any corporate-speak, on any serious topic.
I think you've convinced me--not that NSA's potential mischief isn't vast, or that they are ever to be presumed innocuous--but that, looking today: some other dis-USA issues, while much more diffuse, are more urgent than cutting NSA's BW back from infinity (overseas, that is: given that the entire species would have to reach adulthood before any tribe could trust any other tribe.)
Apparently, not this millennium either.
[Wouldn't you just Hate It, to be forced to a conclusion that: your very-own species! shall never reach Adulthood? almost identically to the basic plot of Blade Runner? (but with a wry twist: We are the Replicants!. The issue is not 'pre-programmed-death-times' but maybe [I say: surely] worse: pre-programmed perpetual adolescence! ]
Think about the trade-off: does it really matter if you exit life at year-X? (always unknown, also subject to the Laws of Chance) -vs- realizing that you'll never experience what, say, Being an Authentic adult human! ... might have been like! :-/
At home, however--logistics of scanning everyone/all-the-time, being too expensive anyway--your argument prevails re encryption back-doors and {sigh} much of the ugly (J. Edgar?) Hoovering of jillions of 99.999% useless messages. BUT.. only ever: via, even redundant-Overseers reliably catching each other's oversights--is that even possible?:
If I've learned anything from IWE troops, it is that Anything in digital-storage-form Can be hacked; merely can the difficulty be made huge via eternal vigilance against a constantly innovating antagonist. So there Will be some costs, and we can merely hope that Protectors remain forever ahead-of their nemeses. Probabilities again.
Overall, then: I take your arguments for forebearance? to be logical and reasonable-enough: but only under the rubrics of Probability, Risk-Reward, ROI; categories (such as, coincidentally (??) drive bizness decisions: where every Thing and non-Thing is "monetated".)
I'm unsure what that means (especially the ROI category: as is the final Decider (!?) on the scope of future digital intrusions into all natural Life on the planet. (That which we dominate, have plundered and only consider Seriously after it has bitten-us-on-the ass, or is clearly about-to, soon.)
[Reluctantly, I have been forced to the conclusion that: V-capitalism's koans have permeated from mere culture-related artifacts, into areas quite more important than, who can conspicuously consume-More than the next guy? thus into the 'framing' of matters involving humans, which are much more important to our innate-humanity, where different values should apply. Were we more sane, generally. V-capitalism may just prove to have been the single-most-easily identifiable cause of our failure to become more humane, less crass and more really-social creatures.. as used to be considered a sign of Progress. (Not a digression)
Thus your rationale--for all its logic and small-r reason--concerning behavior which I deem to be bat-shit-craziness on unprecedented-Scale: fails to convince me that I need to re-examine-away, that which I cannot: that it IS bat-shit-craziness and that 'our' tolerance of that confounding-reasoning is really aberrant behaviour of the ilk: "..just the way things are and-we-can't-change-that because it's just-what-we-must-do."
The Bizness parallel I take to indicate that neither my instinctive nor emotional centers are broken: but the above doggerel IS broken (It's doggerel only because it is circular) and sadly.. circular justifications for many hideous next-actions/reviews-as excuses-for previous hideous ones, are today not uncommon. (Cause or Result? Stimulus or Response?--as they query students in Aberrant Psych 201)
(Are you getting this down or do I need to make it longer/shorter or more legible?) I guess we aren't quite-Done with this topic, except near-term. No sarcasm intended in my agreement with many of your deductions, nor do I accuse you of facile-think: your methodology is certainly clearer--always-- than the abysmal-norm of disingenuous Pol-speak with which we are daily inundated.
Guess I'm not clever enough to parse the Idiocy down through the Id, Ego, Super-ego (and that oft-absent Conscience-function?) We still don't have the foggiest 'where' Consciousness 'resides'--really, the boffins concur--We Don't! But to whatever degree I possess any Consciousness: this rampant Super-spying is as Serious an unwanted-techno-driven ... Regression for humanity, as was the first Used-nuke. (It just doesn't make any fireworks in the sky.)
Again, thanks for your clarity--I think it has evoked a few other realizations re the dimension of self-delusions behind perpetual religio-warz-across-Centuries and.. about the current disintegrations across-the-board locally--as surely tells us: that (and why?) our very-own Winner-Takes-All bizness mindset needs quite more Attention than--whether liff begins at Zygote-stage? or whether it be true that, He who is not One-up is.. One-down. [Yep, it's a Play! ya Takes-home what ya can Get-out (of it.)
I trust that we can declare this marathon enlightenment interlude a Success: both ~Win (?)
I think you've convinced me--not that NSA's potential mischief isn't vast, or that they are ever to be presumed innocuous--but that, looking today: some other dis-USA issues, while much more diffuse, are more urgent than cutting NSA's BW back from infinity (overseas, that is: given that the entire species would have to reach adulthood before any tribe could trust any other tribe.)
Apparently, not this millennium either.
[Wouldn't you just Hate It, to be forced to a conclusion that: your very-own species! shall never reach Adulthood? almost identically to the basic plot of Blade Runner? (but with a wry twist: We are the Replicants!. The issue is not 'pre-programmed-death-times' but maybe [I say: surely] worse: pre-programmed perpetual adolescence! ]
Think about the trade-off: does it really matter if you exit life at year-X? (always unknown, also subject to the Laws of Chance) -vs- realizing that you'll never experience what, say, Being an Authentic adult human! ... might have been like! :-/
At home, however--logistics of scanning everyone/all-the-time, being too expensive anyway--your argument prevails re encryption back-doors and {sigh} much of the ugly (J. Edgar?) Hoovering of jillions of 99.999% useless messages. BUT.. only ever: via, even redundant-Overseers reliably catching each other's oversights--is that even possible?:
If I've learned anything from IWE troops, it is that Anything in digital-storage-form Can be hacked; merely can the difficulty be made huge via eternal vigilance against a constantly innovating antagonist. So there Will be some costs, and we can merely hope that Protectors remain forever ahead-of their nemeses. Probabilities again.
Overall, then: I take your arguments for forebearance? to be logical and reasonable-enough: but only under the rubrics of Probability, Risk-Reward, ROI; categories (such as, coincidentally (??) drive bizness decisions: where every Thing and non-Thing is "monetated".)
I'm unsure what that means (especially the ROI category: as is the final Decider (!?) on the scope of future digital intrusions into all natural Life on the planet. (That which we dominate, have plundered and only consider Seriously after it has bitten-us-on-the ass, or is clearly about-to, soon.)
[Reluctantly, I have been forced to the conclusion that: V-capitalism's koans have permeated from mere culture-related artifacts, into areas quite more important than, who can conspicuously consume-More than the next guy? thus into the 'framing' of matters involving humans, which are much more important to our innate-humanity, where different values should apply. Were we more sane, generally. V-capitalism may just prove to have been the single-most-easily identifiable cause of our failure to become more humane, less crass and more really-social creatures.. as used to be considered a sign of Progress. (Not a digression)
Thus your rationale--for all its logic and small-r reason--concerning behavior which I deem to be bat-shit-craziness on unprecedented-Scale: fails to convince me that I need to re-examine-away, that which I cannot: that it IS bat-shit-craziness and that 'our' tolerance of that confounding-reasoning is really aberrant behaviour of the ilk: "..just the way things are and-we-can't-change-that because it's just-what-we-must-do."
The Bizness parallel I take to indicate that neither my instinctive nor emotional centers are broken: but the above doggerel IS broken (It's doggerel only because it is circular) and sadly.. circular justifications for many hideous next-actions/reviews-as excuses-for previous hideous ones, are today not uncommon. (Cause or Result? Stimulus or Response?--as they query students in Aberrant Psych 201)
(Are you getting this down or do I need to make it longer/shorter or more legible?) I guess we aren't quite-Done with this topic, except near-term. No sarcasm intended in my agreement with many of your deductions, nor do I accuse you of facile-think: your methodology is certainly clearer--always-- than the abysmal-norm of disingenuous Pol-speak with which we are daily inundated.
Guess I'm not clever enough to parse the Idiocy down through the Id, Ego, Super-ego (and that oft-absent Conscience-function?) We still don't have the foggiest 'where' Consciousness 'resides'--really, the boffins concur--We Don't! But to whatever degree I possess any Consciousness: this rampant Super-spying is as Serious an unwanted-techno-driven ... Regression for humanity, as was the first Used-nuke. (It just doesn't make any fireworks in the sky.)
Again, thanks for your clarity--I think it has evoked a few other realizations re the dimension of self-delusions behind perpetual religio-warz-across-Centuries and.. about the current disintegrations across-the-board locally--as surely tells us: that (and why?) our very-own Winner-Takes-All bizness mindset needs quite more Attention than--whether liff begins at Zygote-stage? or whether it be true that, He who is not One-up is.. One-down. [Yep, it's a Play! ya Takes-home what ya can Get-out (of it.)
I trust that we can declare this marathon enlightenment interlude a Success: both ~Win (?)