What I've always wondered

Post #49,539 by SpiceWare 8/15/02 9:37:24 PM Reply	What I've always wondered Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness Seems to me that mary jane falls under tpoh, as found in The Declaration of Independence. :-) Darrell Spice, Jr. [link\|http://home.houston.rr.com/spiceware/\|SpiceWare] - We don't do Windows, it's too much of a chore
Post #49,540 by Ashton 8/15/02 9:42:35 PM Reply	Document rendered obsolete.. in practice.__ Recently.
Post #49,556 by cwbrenn 8/16/02 9:03:42 AM Reply	It doesn't bother me that "Ellen" might be a stoner chick. It bothers me that so many potheads are idolizing her when she is clearly a dumbass. "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #49,559 by orion 8/16/02 9:47:40 AM Reply	How did she become a dumbss? From smoking too much MJ, or was she like born that way? [link\|http://games.speakeasy.net/data/files/khan.jpg\|"Khan!!!" -Kirk]*
Post #49,570 by imric 8/16/02 11:02:47 AM Reply	MJ doesn't make you dumb.... It CAN however, make you forget you were smart. Stupidity is certainy not limited to potheads - and a number of the most intelligent people I've ever known smoke the stuff - like my one buddy who went to Cal Tech on a free ride, who's teacher was Feynman himself. He was SO smart, that Feynman sent his HS Physics teacher (my father) a thank-you note for sending him to Cal Tech. The man works has worked as a successful physicist and mathemetician since. I know many talented and productive programmers and admins that indulge, too. Personally, I believe the stuff is like anything else - excess has negative side effects. If you are stoned all the time, if being stoned is all that matters to you, if your life is focussed on that kind of self-indulgance constantly, it's a bad thing. It's always easy to focus on negative images. Imric's Tips for Living Paranoia Is a Survival Trait Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised... Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
Post #49,581 by cwbrenn 8/16/02 12:52:59 PM Reply	It's not the drugs They just focused on an idiot as their new media icon... I guess they're going with the "any port in a storm" mentality, but all I can say is... bad choice. Like, and it was all beep beep beep, and like, the paper was gone... it was a good paper too... shudders uncontrollably "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #49,583 by imric 8/16/02 12:56:29 PM Reply	Part of thier market? ROFL I wouldn't think that many potheads could afford Macs... Or maybe 'if a pothead can use it, surely YOU can' is the message they are trying to get across... Imric's Tips for Living Paranoia Is a Survival Trait Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised... Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
Post #49,596 by orion 8/16/02 2:18:54 PM Reply	Apple is trying to appeal to new markets. They figure in that even a Pothead Student can apply for a loan to get a Mac. The whole point is trying to get people switched from a PC to a Mac. Ellen fits that Teenager market that can tell their parents what computer they want them to buy. She is the student that is getting ready for college, and most college students have experimented with drugs (Not me, but I assume most have at some point?) and if they can get someone in that demographic to appear to be stoned (She may be wearing contact lenses with redness in them and acting like she is stoned?) it might appeal to other stoners in that age range? Of course they also could have gotten "Cheech and Chong" or "Jay and Silent Bob" to endorse Macs, but they would have cost more. :) *[link\|http://games.speakeasy.net/data/files/khan.jpg\|"Khan!!!" -Kirk]*
Post #49,618 by Ashton 8/16/02 5:09:20 PM Reply	Your inexperience with 'pot' or potheads is evident and suggests that you don't see the much more prevalent dumbth under the Other (taxed) dopes: alcohol for just one. Then throw in the drugged 'active' kiddies and the psych-altering er tranqs, which millions use in one form or another bored outta their skulls by rote 'learning' = drug the tykes to keep em anchored to that desk.. 2 hours at a time. For society's comfort and convenience, not theirs You're merely buying that level of propaganda as got 'hemp' proscribed for purely $$ reasons -- and which ludicrously has gotten it categorized with (even) di-acetyl morphine ie heroin! BTW - those users of heroin who make a steady income (taxi drivers, for one) manage quite well over decades! of use; they can cope with daily work quite indistinguishably from other folks. [no, not the ones whose only aim is to stay stoned forever -- the many others who indulge but also have other interests]. It is the artificial illegality which forces the addict to do bad things to Get the stuff: which is the food for the stereotypes about 'heroin users'. As you well know - many appear to need some escape from the idiocy of very many 'jobs' (as these are currently 'managed') and from the homogenized environment of our most self-indulgent- culture ever. And that is what drugs do - as they have done for eons - provide some internal escape from an (to the user) oppressive daily environment. What Else is: the daily diet of shoot-em-up Tee Vee, movie, Game fare than - YAN escape? Mental-drug / chem drug: take your pick. You 'think' you have "druggies" neatly categorized as - abberant? dumb? - and nothing to do with You << Hah.. check the labels on those meds bottles. And maybe begin noticing that, most of the propaganda about drug-use and the character of the users is just that, propaganda; largely about - keeping an entire populace sufficiently homogenized and complaisant so as to be controllable. And that manipulation - most often also means profitable for the few. ie the topic of "drugs" just ain't the simplistic one you apppear to hold - black/white. YOU are a 'druggie' as much as any heroin user - our entire culture ARE a bunch of OTC or HMO (or street) DRUGGIES. We handle this contradiction as we handle so many others, because: we love euphemisms a Lot, and these help us to disguise the hyocrisy of the entire imaginary Drug Warz scenario. HTH, Ashton
Post #49,625 by cwbrenn 8/16/02 5:54:39 PM Reply	Which underscores my point Why the hell is NORML so happy that this chick is Apple's face of stoned america? Why not push for Abbie Hoffman in a Think Different commercial instead? "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #49,638 by orion 8/16/02 9:15:19 PM Reply	It is ironic that Dell uses the Dell-Dude which appears to act stoned, and this Ellen Feiss girl on Apple's ad also appears to act stoned and also seems to have red eyes and other signs that she is on drugs. Does it make me happy? No. But it does make me laugh. Also her story about the PC eating her homework makes me laugh as well. Another laugh is that many people have rallied around her and made web sites about her, and her commercial wasn't that great to begin with. It makes me laugh in the same way that the "Airplane" movies made me laugh. You just cannot create that type of cornball humor without basing it on real life situations unless you are really really creative if you know what I mean. Oh yeah, if "Airplane" is too old, consider the "Kung Pow: Enter The Fist" movie. Comedy so stupid and silly that it makes you squirt your drink out of your nose while you watch it. :) Some of the funniest stuff wasn't supposed to be funny, but it is anyway. *[link\|http://games.speakeasy.net/data/files/khan.jpg\|"Khan!!!" -Kirk]*
Post #50,177 by jb4 8/22/02 2:19:54 PM Reply	Heh... Why not push for Abbie Hoffman in a Think Different commercial instead? Heh...because Abbie Hoffman really does Think Different! Which presents two problems for Apple: 1) Bad Q: The target market just ain't Abbie. 2) Truth in Advertising: We wouldn't really anyone to really Think different, would we? Tends to cause people to question their sheep-like addiction to things (like Apple computers?) jb4 "About the use of language: it is impossible to sharpen a pencil with a blunt axe. It is equally vain to try to do it with ten blunt axes instead. " -- Edsger W.Dijkstra (1930 - 2002) (I wish more managers knew that...)
Post #49,646 by deSitter 8/16/02 10:00:10 PM Reply	Re: Your inexperience with 'pot' or potheads Cabbies on heroin? Holy shit you couldn't drive a cab on heroin. I've never had to concentrate so hard on any job. There are live people in the back who might rob or kill you, or you're fighting traffic, or fatigue from long hours. I knew a lot of cabbies in Denver. One day we were all sitting around at the bus station on a very slow day, and the conversation fell silent. The senior driver (30+ years) blurted out "Shit! If I was a junkie I'd go get high!" and we all busted up. The last thing any of us would do is narcotics. -drl
Post #49,651 by Ashton 8/16/02 10:33:11 PM Reply	Know whatcha mean.. Apparently the maintenence dose is minimal - how long they wait before driving I didn't hear. 'Treat' is after work hours. When you're not scratching around continuously for JUST the-next-dose: you live differently than the stereotype. (Yes I know what H. feels like) Ashton
Post #49,660 by orion 8/17/02 12:56:44 AM Reply	My experience with 'potheads' they called themselves "Burnouts" in Junior High and High School. They picked on me all the time (I was your typical Computer Geek or Nerd or Dork, whatever they decided to call me) and were very violent and paranoid. When one of them got busted smoking a joint in the bathroom, they would blame kids like me for narcing on them, even if he didn't narc on them. Why? Because we refused to share a joint with them or even try one out. So regulary they picked fights with us, did damage to our stuff, and asked for "protection money" or else they would be back to do more of the same. Bullies, most of them were. The school refused to do anything to them, except assign them detention or suspend them for a week or two, and then they were back. When they came back they got mad at us again, and took it out on us. I always thought that maybe they got stupid from smoking the stuff, but now I see that it could be all the time that they were suspended from school and missing classes? *[link\|http://games.speakeasy.net/data/files/khan.jpg\|"Khan!!!" -Kirk]*
Post #49,671 by Ashton 8/17/02 5:08:15 AM Reply	Ahh.. Nasty stuff. I was referring to the larger (more nearly 'adult') population and not the inevitable problems of babies [trying Any kind of stuff because it's In]. IMhO that is more about immaturity made worse by dope - including plain ol deadly nicotine, beer etc. Marijuana is hardly a drug of choice for acting out aggressions, despite your experiences with this bunch of jerks. But BTW the same sort of utter misuse - is occurring with MDMA / Ecstasy, and apparently for the same sheep-like reasons: While it is an amphetamine hybrid, it was never meant to be mixed with alcohol / other stuff + atavistic music stimulus (just as psych-active as chemicals). It is about producing a calm state, which it does, in pure form and without deliberate other stimuli added. Note that amphet. given to now many children, indeed produces the opposite effects (calming too) to the popular 'speed' behaviour -in many children.. Maybe just one difference between small children and adults. Teen-age? Who knows what the hormones add to the mix. Chemistry. Your experience demonstrates that marijuana, whatever its common use: doesn't stop really stupid people from acting out. I assert only that - that stupid shit Isn't "caused by the marijuana" per se! Clear? (And obviously - the m. can't prevent! those acts) Ashton
Post #49,964 by mmoffitt 8/20/02 8:57:09 PM Reply	Disagree. that stupid shit Isn't "caused by the marijuana" per se! Nonsense. Every bit of experimental evidence belies this. I will grant that all of this hinges upon one's definition of "stupid", but the brain clearly processes information differently under the effects of even a minimal amount of THC. And THC remains in the brain much longer than most foreign stimulants/depressant. I suspect my anecdotal experience is common. Of the people I know who have smoked dope, they are VASTLY intellectually, academically and as logical thinkers, dramatically inferior to those folks I know who have never smoked dope. For the moment on the Right Wing Box, Mikem
Post #49,997 by Ashton 8/21/02 3:55:20 AM Reply	Nil data. Never seen this vastness you speak of. Could cite some who ceased being neurotic twits, via an occasional toke - but I don't know anyone currently, who has regularly used m. over many years - whose peformance I might imagine to measure. Personally I found it to be not attractive, so I can't even 'test' myself. :-\ufffd Acid I have had some slight experience with, and I wouldn't dream of affixing a good/bad label to it; I know of some extremes of results - and it appears no one has bothered to find out since: how to predict umm 'cui bono' ? A few had their lives altered quite for the best - in their opinion. I take their word on that. I found out a couple things too - mainly about the fearfulness of the mass. Part of the problem of assessment of both has been / remains - the unwillingness to do any sufficient and trustworthy studies; Puritanism Doesn't Want to Know: It Judges. All current 'official' judgments are purely Religious, with only a smattering of small more nearly 'objective' ones. I trust none in this climate of allopathic medicine and stubborn resistance to honest enquiry. (cf. stem cells - deja vu) Muricans will allow Fundamentalist dogma to limit ... too much to describe. People whose chronic pain is relieved - have to fight an AG, even after passing laws in their own State. Dogma. I won't argue with your personal observations, nor be convinced either. Ashton
Post #50,031 by deSitter 8/21/02 11:30:56 AM Reply	No Connection Getting high started happening a few hours after the first breath, the first boink, and the first meal. As humans have always instinctively known, reality sucks and moreover is incomprehensible. Therefore altered states and the desire to experience them have and always will be with us. Zippo connection with intelligence - although personally, I'd say straight arrows are not only more boring (less interesting) than indulgers, they are also duller and less imaginative. -drl
Post #50,059 by Ashton 8/21/02 4:49:24 PM Reply	{snort}________:-\ufffd
Post #50,220 by orion 8/22/02 7:46:28 PM Reply	Interesting fact while I was a teenager, and in a mental hospital for a few times, I was the only teenager at that time that didn't smoke pot. Everyone else I talked to in the hopital told me that they did smoke pot at one time at least. They had asked a question about who did smoke pot and those who did raised their hands, everyone raised their hands but me. *[link\|http://games.speakeasy.net/data/files/khan.jpg\|"Khan!!!" -Kirk]*
Post #50,418 by mmoffitt 9/4/02 4:12:23 PM Reply	You're not the Lone Ranger ;-) I turn 43 next week and I am probably the only person that age who can look his/her kids in the eye and honestly say, "I never did". I guess that makes two of us now, eh? ;-)
Post #50,436 by inthane-chan 9/4/02 5:15:55 PM Reply	Got ya beat. I attended The Evergreen State College in Olympia, Washington for about 3.5 years - and I was probably one of three people in the entire history of the school who managed to avoid ingesting ANY drugs of any sort while I was there. Believe me, this was quite a feat. End of world rescheduled for day after tomorrow. Something should probably be done. Please advise.
Post #50,451 by mmoffitt 9/4/02 6:07:38 PM Reply	I dunno.... I grew up in Southern California. I attended Bancroft Junior High School (the one that was on 60 minutes for having a per capita drug abuse statistic higher than any educational institution in the state - and that includes Berkley!). Then, I went to high school at Lakewood Senior High School (home of the "Spur Posse" that made news in the '80's). I was a teen-ager in the 70's in Southern California, surfed, scuba dived, etc. and didn't use drugs (okay, well, except for alcohol, and then only beer, and then only after I graduated high school, and then only to excess ;-).
Post #50,498 by orion 9/4/02 8:54:04 PM Reply	The Three Amigos! We three, who never did drugs. Except maybe in college when we smoked cigarettes or drank beer/booze. But that doesn't count, as those are legal drugs. I don't drink or smoke anymore. Not for a long time. I am just a little bit insane and I get my highs from life and having fun with my friends and video games and other stuff. *[link\|http://games.speakeasy.net/data/files/khan.jpg\|"Khan!!!" -Kirk]*
Post #50,526 by inthane-chan 9/4/02 9:57:26 PM Reply	The 'green... At the time, this was the College that Kurt Cobain 'n crew were hanging out at, dreaming about hitting the big time, holding massive dorm parties practically every weekend. This was the college where the teachers served tea made out of some rather interesting mushrooms for the senior tea. The second most common item on campus (after clothing) was a water bong. They practically issued them to the dorm rooms - every dorm had at least one, including the so-called "drug-free" apartments. Now, admittedly, I can't touch your pedegree as far as your experiences prior to college, but Evergreen was pretty much the Land of Eternal Munchies. I never even so much as drank a beer while I was there. End of world rescheduled for day after tomorrow. Something should probably be done. Please advise.
Post #49,652 by Andrew Grygus 8/16/02 11:10:11 PM Reply	Hey, wait a minute . . Don't dopers all use Apples already? All the ones I've known did (don't know any dopers right now). This may be just one of those "feel good" preaching to the choir ads like the auto companies do so often. "Yes, I made the right choice!" [link\|http://www.aaxnet.com\|AAx]
Post #49,659 by orion 8/17/02 12:50:44 AM Reply	Uh, yeah, maybe? Apple markets mostly to the Educational and Creative (Artists, Web Designers, Hollywood Script Writers, etc) markets, which also seem to have the highest drug use out of most of the markets. So why not put an obvious "Pothead" on one of their "Switch" ads? They are now marketing to the teenage girl student market with Ellen, who also seem to smoke pot and use other drugs? *[link\|http://games.speakeasy.net/data/files/khan.jpg\|"Khan!!!" -Kirk]*
Post #49,664 by tuberculosis 8/17/02 3:24:27 AM 8/21/07 5:53:54 AM Reply	Raised in American Pop Culture Uh like, you know, at the mall. I am out of the country for the duration of the Bush administration. Please leave a message and I'll get back to you when democracy returns. Edited by tuberculosis Aug. 21, 2007, 05:53:54 AM EDT Expand All History

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