Post #25,420
1/24/02 2:36:19 AM
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You were the one who brought up Buddhism
Ashton just assumed that you knew about it and reminded you of the textbook Buddhist dogma on the root cause of suffering. It is not central to Buddhism, but most Buddhists believe in rebirth, and so you cannot even relieve your suffering by dying, you get reborn and are still stuck in this world.
As for having a choice or not, various kinds of Buddhist meditations are supposed to help you realize at a gut level the connection between attachment and suffering, and through self-knowledge, achieve a release from suffering. If you lack this awareness, you will not see that you have choices because you cannot tell when you made the decisions (again) that lead to suffering. (Note, I am not saying here that I agree with this - I don't - I am just laying out the belief system.) Once you have this awareness, you can choose. One with complete awareness achieves the Great Release (from suffering) at which point one is enlightened and is a Buddha.
Based on what Ashton said, he is almost definitely a Buddhist. His answer is certainly a classic Buddhist answer. Namely that if you know about Buddhism, then you should know that suffering may be universal, but it is a disease with a cure, and that cure is to achieve a release from the attachment that leads you to misery. It isn't an intellectual cure, you need to really not be attached.
Now whether or not you are a Buddhist, there is no question that their meditation techniques have helped many people deal with depression and stressful circumstances.
Cheers,
Ben
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Post #25,628
1/24/02 7:32:33 PM
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I am Not a Buddist, but my wife was
I did study up on it, but not fully. Not all Buddists follow their paths 100%, just as not all Christians do, etc.
I strive to be a better person than the rest of the human race, I do what I think is best and what I think is right.
I tried meditations, but I am not a master of self awareness or whatever. I could not get relif from my depression. It may be biochemical, and genetic, as doctors have said. If that is the case, meditation will not work, and if I die and get a new body the chances of the new body not having the biochemcial imbalance might be better.
Speaking of reincarnation, my son claimed that when I was younger he was my father. Which is odd, as my father is still alive and with my mother. He told his grandmother that he used to take care of her when he was a man, and now he is a boy and she takes care of him when he visits her. Is he just day-dreaming, or can he be my father when my father is still alive? Can reincarnation transcend time and space so that when one dies, they can go back in time to be re-born?
"Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
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Post #25,643
1/24/02 9:00:07 PM
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What I described was pretty basic
For Buddhists that should be about as basic as, say, it is for Christians that God sent His only begotten Son Jesus Christ to us, who died on the Cross that we might receive Salvation.
As for meditation and depression, I have heard from people who suffer from the latter and practice the former that it helps, but doesn't stick. That is, you go and meditate for a month and you are in good shape, but get back to normal life and in 3 months you are back where you were.
And about reincarnation, people can be found with beliefs all of the way from our having many lives, which do not need to be in chronological order to this one is it, and you don't live after you die. There is nothing that I know of to indicate that any of them are more likely than the others. (There are some that I consider less likely, but that is another story.) So your son's belief is not something I can disprove.
OTOH I think there are more obvious possibilities for why your son might have said that that than his actually being your father in another life. (Not everything that people say they think necessarily happened.)
Cheers,
Ben
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Post #25,830
1/26/02 12:46:42 AM
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My comment was based on yours.
By now I'd imagine you might have gleaned some idea of my attitude toward 'evangelism' (re Anything) - persuading people who are not I.. to 'believe' metaphysically as I might or might not? appears to me to need no detailed analysis for ethical and practical flaws.
No. I am not a Buddhist. Either. That says nothing of my respect for its possibilities. But then too.. Buddhism is not a 'religion'; it postulates no Godheads, not even The Buddha as such: he was merely a One who became Enlightened. It appears that at any time, there are n Enlightened Ones about. None has any reason to.. proselytize - but some will answer questions. You have to ask. After you find one. (Whether or not this is fact - is of course of interest only to those.. for whom it is of interest.)
As to effects of 'meditation' upon depression: Ben offered one person's comment on effects he noted - and the duration. I have no more extensive experience than a few, and those aren't relevant to your comments. I'd opine merely - calmness achieved by most means - never hurts; for some it cures.
It appears to me that there is an epidemic in America of depression, a vague other one called stress -- and a plethora of ready-mix Pharm-Chem products to sell. Having myself, near-no 'faith' in the ideas of causality rampant in AMA circles, and little more in the popular psych mantras - my view is biased accordingly. It is a simple one, though:
Our culture and the physical environment 'it' has created for/by us IS making us all sick, to various degrees depending on our personal chemistry and attitude about our life. I believe that cancer is the most prominent symptom and our War on It is as inept as our other Wars. It derives from blinkered linear thinking - just like the other Wars.
Whether or not my diagnosis is valid, I (try to) behave as if it were: eschewing most all AMA attention except (if need be) diagnosis. (Trauma repair - is where AMA medicine is unsurpassed.) I have found other approaches for the occasional distemper or annoyance as bodies develop - but even if these work for me - so what? Same deal re proselytizing.
I've taken your comments to be some sort of desire for hints, not a request for advice (which I couldn't give in any case). Hints, then FWIW -
I think you have a 'good heart', and that that matters a lot more than most of us suppose. You seem often surprised when some next homo-sap behaves like an asshole (!) I believe that's an asset overall; never mind pop-psych 'explanations' - I don't.
I know of people who had body complaints ~ to some you've mentioned; also some with some mental glitches ditto. A few managed complete symptom-free health via not mere 'diet' (as in, in Murica: Lose Weight yada yada) but in improved nutrition and with herbologist advice re certain compounds that seem to match certain symptoms. Even acupuncture has been an adjunct. These have worked for some. That's all I 'know'.
If you are feeling as rotten as ever, and you've exhausted the PDR rote list (Phys. Desk Ref.) of serial remedies - it remains possible that these other approaches to the whole idea of body/mind health could prove (shockingly! effective - as one observed). You'd have to make time and pay actual attention for any serious trial. 'Attention' is another very large idea, etc. You can't (apparently) drop your body off for service, with mind on vacation. I guess they are connected somehow (?)
Of course if you have some std. med coverage and 0-coverage beyond AMA-Brand? this might seem inconvenient. But maybe you have at least the time to investigate, currently - pretty free. Generally - if paying own bills? - 'alternate' just Can't approach cost of a $50 aspirin in a hospital! Y'know?
[advice]
If all else fails: flip coin about deciding.?. to look at something different, unfamiliar. Or not bothering.
[/advice]
Luck,
Ashton
Sometimes Norm, ya gotta point yer BSA at Snotty Hill and gas it in 2nd! with feet solidly on the pegs.. May not know how ya got over the clay dog-leg - but it feels Great at the top!
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Post #25,886
1/26/02 3:05:56 PM
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My comment on your comment
Yes I agree that there are things in the USA that make us sick, depressed, and stressed out. Too bad we cannot sue our employers for stressing us out, and making us depressed. If I could, I may be able to get some serious cash for them making my illnesses worse.
I do have a good heart, but people take advantage of me when they learn that. Then some backstab me, or make things hard for me, because they know I have a good heart and they are not as good hearted as me. I am not sure why, but this happens almost everywhere. Like you called them, Assholes. I call them jerks and jerkettes. They are at every workplace. If they cannot find something bad to say about me, they make something up. They are the ones starting hurtful rumors, and when management believes those rumors even if there is no evidence or proof that they are true, then I get the shaft. it seems to have happened to my previous job. Those are the type of people I'd like to see tossed into that firery place in the afterlife. Or get reincarnated as a rat or fly.
I've tried many things to treat my depression, but they have all failed. Meditation, Yoga, getting a hobby, exercise, doing a Stewart Smalley, taking a vacation, etc. Maybe my depression is deeper than all of that?
"Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
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