Post #44,724
7/8/02 7:42:06 AM
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Ironic
You accurately explain why I think that people should not presume to explain what God's Will is.
And then you proceed to state that a particular thing, imposing your beliefs about God's Will on others, is a sin. But stating what is or is not a sin is stating something about God's Will, contrary to what you said that humans cannot do. And you are also trying to impose this belief about God's Will on others (or at least on Norm).
In other words you just tried to do what you explained humans should not presume to do, and your act is exactly what you just pontificated is a sin! :-)
Cheers,
Ben
"... I couldn't see how anyone could be educated by this self-propagating system in which people pass exams, teach others to pass exams, but nobody knows anything."
--Richard Feynman
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Post #44,727
7/8/02 8:30:30 AM
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Doth the gentleman protest too much?
Only ironic if one missed a likely intention.
Must irony always be explained to an imagined LCD, lest it ever might.. be taken for the literal? (And.. who decides?)
Or was yours.. ironic-literalness too? Oooh - triple entendre!
Ashton
PS the word sin, last I heard, IS an only-Christian conception (most often heard in the Original Sin\ufffd form, as in 'born that way'; Catch22)
Analysis can get so confusing, once we parse to the gluons :-\ufffd
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Post #44,730
7/8/02 9:02:05 AM
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There lies a problem
if we are not to know God's Will, how are we to do God's Will? Am I using The Force or something? Doing God's Will without knowing God's Will? Therefore without knowing it, I am doing God's Will by posting in favor of God. Or maybe I know just a small part of God's Will and it has somehow driven me a bit crazy? :)
I am free now, to choose my own destiny.
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Post #44,739
7/8/02 10:25:50 AM
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Re: There lies a problem
You got it!
The best we can hope for is Man's interpretation (no..that's not right, either...not "Man's interpretation", but rather, "a man's interpretation") of God's Will.
Meditate on that, Grasshopper, and you may come to understand the utter futility of Organized Religion, and instead promote yourself to Faith instead.
(A journey of 1000 miles begins with pointing yourself in the right direction before taking hte first step
jb4
"I remember Harry S. Truman's sign on his desk. 'The buck stops here.' Strange how those words, while still true, mean something completely different today." -- Brandioch
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Post #44,744
7/8/02 10:53:26 AM
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God would have no problem communicating his will.
The problems come when other humans take it upon themselves to tell other humans what "God's Will" is.
What is God's Will for you does not necessarily equate to God's Will for me.
Think of building a house.
You won't get too far if the plumber converts everyone on the job site to Orthodox Plumbing.
You still need carpenters and masons and so forth.
The path you find that is right for you is right for you. But it isn't necessarily the path that EVERYONE should follow.
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Post #44,754
7/8/02 11:21:46 AM
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Brandi...how ironic!
You still need carpenters and masons and so forth. You could, of course, have been trying to be ironic... jb4
"I remember Harry S. Truman's sign on his desk. 'The buck stops here.' Strange how those words, while still true, mean something completely different today." -- Brandioch
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Post #44,755
7/8/02 11:22:32 AM
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Brandi...how ironic!
You still need carpenters and masons and so forth. You could, of course, have been trying to be ironic... jb4
"I remember Harry S. Truman's sign on his desk. 'The buck stops here.' Strange how those words, while still true, mean something completely different today." -- Brandioch
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Post #44,783
7/8/02 1:26:05 PM
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:) *smirk mode: on*
I cannot help myself. :)
It's in my blood.
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Post #44,737
7/8/02 10:13:43 AM
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Sin is defined by God?
Personally, I'm pretty sure it's defined by man, since I've seen no signed and sealed statements from God that define sin, or Sin - so I'm stating my interpretation - not God's (unless I'm God, which is another matter entirely).
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #44,742
7/8/02 10:42:12 AM
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Sin is defined
as disobeying God and his laws.
Let me give you an example:
The Perfect World (Garden Of Eden) Adam and Eve were told they could do anything, except eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. What did they do? They disobeyed God and ate it anyway, in doing so, they Sinned. God did this to show that people will sin even in a perfect world, and that his other creations (Angels, Fallen Angels) would interfer even in a person world (taking the form of a snake).
Perhaps you forgot the Ten Commandments written by God onto stone and handed to Moses? You know, the ones saying a lot of "Thou Shalt Not", etc. Like "Thou shalt not steal" "Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultry", etc, the ones that people ignore anyway. Breaking these commandments is a sin. Then there is Mosaic Law, etc. Without these, people are lawless and become b*tches and b*stards and the world becomes Hell.
I am free now, to choose my own destiny.
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Post #44,830
7/8/02 8:19:10 PM
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"as" versus "by"
I agree with you that our conception of sin is defined by man.
But it is defined as something that is contrary to God's will.
There is no contradiction, because lots of men presume to understand God's will. And lots more are willing to blindly accept, eg, the Judeo-Christian mythology.
Cheers,
Ben
"... I couldn't see how anyone could be educated by this self-propagating system in which people pass exams, teach others to pass exams, but nobody knows anything."
--Richard Feynman
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