As I've often said...

Post #222,383 by ben_tilly 9/1/05 10:28:29 PM Reply	As I've often said... When programmers communicate, they tend to be both precise and ineffective. What is said is precise and sufficient. But since very few listeners will analyze what is said carefully enough, they fail of the goal of actually communicating. The extra long-windedness that others have are like a series of checksums in a communication channel that is assumed to be very lossy. When dealing with non-programmers, their assumption tends to be correct. Cheers, Ben I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
Post #222,391 by broomberg 9/1/05 10:43:51 PM Reply	Disagree At least for myself. I tend to reflect back what someone said in detail to ensure we both understand someting the same way. But long winded speeches merely obscure the meaning and give people escape hatches to deny a specific interpretation. These people are not trying to communicate, they are merely enjoying the sound of their own voice.
Post #222,393 by ben_tilly 9/1/05 10:55:49 PM Reply	I think we just demonstrated the "lossy" part. :-) I said that when trying to communicate with non-programmers, their assumption tends to be correct. You are a programmer, and hence do not serve as an example either way on that assertion. You point out that often people are talking for purposes other than communication. I agree, but consider that tangential to the question of why people are long-winded when they are obviously trying to communicate. And a final point of irony. Being long-winded only works in some contexts. For instance those who deal with journalists learn to avoid long-winded answers. Journalists are masters of taking snippets of an answer out of context and using it to portray the illusion of an intent to communicate where there was none. And journalists will not bother repeating anything that they think will lose their audience. You don't own a TV station of a newspaper. You will never get to explain yourself once you've been misunderstood. Cheers, Ben I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
Post #222,395 by static 9/1/05 11:02:52 PM Reply	Experiences language teachers know it, too. Though they don't think of it in the same way. My Japanese teacher pointed out several times that we shouldn't worry about understanding every word - many can be figured out from context or even completely ignored. Wade. d-_-b

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