Post #111,063
7/23/03 12:53:21 AM
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Re: You. Would.
A few weeks back I was reproached here for being beastly to orion. I meekly backed off. No more. His contributions are so reliably witless that I now consider any responses, however nasty, to be rather in the way of spraying a caustic disinfectant on a persistent mold. Such relentless stupidity as Norm routinely displays deserves to be driven offline. He contributes nothing but noise to the political fora. Well, I was trying to stay out of this one, but honestly, I think it's extreme to say that every single thing any one person ever says is stupid. I think there have been posts by Norm that are good contributions at times. I'm just saying that generalizing about any one person is usually not the nicest thing to do, because no matter how stupid or dumb or witless anyone is, they aren't, as a rule, always stupid or dumb or witless. Nightowl >8# cordially, Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist. "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!"
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #111,067
7/23/03 1:16:34 AM
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Listen to yourself
Nightowl protests: I'm just saying that generalizing about any one person is usually not the nicest thing to do, because no matter how stupid or dumb or witless anyone is, they aren't, as a rule, always stupid or dumb or witless. 1. Nice is not what I'm attempting here. 2. An individual who is routinely "dumb, stupid and witless" doesn't have to be invariably dumb, stupid and witless in order to constitute a significant degradation--as Norman does--to the signal-to-noise ratio here. I actually posted a few halfhearted defenses of him against his more caustic critics many months ago. I'd take these back if I could. In the fora I follow he almost invariably contributes nothing but imbecility. impatiently, Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #111,069
7/23/03 1:24:45 AM
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Re: Listen to yourself
I wasn't protesting, just making an observation. 2. An individual who is routinely "dumb, stupid and witless" doesn't have to be invariably dumb, stupid and witless in order to constitute a significant degradation--as Norman does--to the signal-to-noise ratio here. I actually posted a few halfhearted defenses of him against his more caustic critics many months ago. I'd take these back if I could. In the fora I follow he almost invariably contributes nothing but imbecility. And I have this to say, and only this. Statements like that, about any individual, contribute to that individual's behavior and beliefs about themselves. I know, I was one who was left behind when someone took their life based on feelings like these. I'm thankful that I never said such things to them. I wasn't talking solely about Norman. I was talking about any person who has the right to exist, to interact, and to live, and to not be persecuted. That's all i was saying. Believe it or not, your words and thoughts and statements do impact the people who hear them. Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!"
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #111,070
7/23/03 1:26:00 AM
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Re: Listen to yourself
Anyone who would take their own life based on words on a web page is probably wading in the shallow end of the gene pool to start with.
Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #111,074
7/23/03 1:43:27 AM
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Re: Listen to yourself
Anyone who would take their own life based on words on a web page is probably wading in the shallow end of the gene pool to start with. I didn't say it was on a web page, it wasn't. And it's not relevant, because the gravity of what is said is based on the relationship with those who say it, regardless of on the web, the phone, in person, etc. If people regard your opinion highly, and your opinion of them is low, it doesn't matter where they hear it. Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!"
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #111,072
7/23/03 1:30:16 AM
7/23/03 9:50:01 AM
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Re: Listen to yourself
If my "words and thoughts and statements" serve in some small measure to discourage Norman's participation here--it's not necessary that he should actually expire in consequence of the comparatively mild abuse I send his way--I will feel that I haven't lived in vain.
cordially,
[edit: typo]
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
Edited by rcareaga
July 23, 2003, 09:50:01 AM EDT
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Post #111,130
7/23/03 12:11:26 PM
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I am not going away
no matter what anyone here says. Your words haven't discouraged me, and better than you have tried.
Your have a right to your opinion of me, call me stupid and witless if you will, I won't agree with your opinions, but I will defend your right to have one.
To me, stupid and witless is having a button that says "Suspected Terrorist" on an airplane after the 9/11 attacks. I equate that with, as someone elsewere stated for something else, as stupid and witless as shaking a wasps nest. Political Statement or not, it is just asking for trouble.
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Post #111,143
7/23/03 12:49:09 PM
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Re: I am not going away
To me, stupid and witless is having a button that says "Suspected Terrorist" on an airplane after the 9/11 attacks. I equate that with, as someone elsewere stated for something else, as stupid and witless as shaking a wasps nest. Political Statement or not, it is just asking for trouble. I tend to agree. Kinda reminds me of the situation where the guy tried to take a clock shaped like several sticks of dynamite and a fuse on an airplane. fortunately, he didn't make a fuss when they confiscated it, but still, taking something that looks like a bomb on board an airplane just a few short months after 9/11, well that seems like a pretty stupid thing to do to me. Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!"
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #111,146
7/23/03 1:12:28 PM
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Exactly
I tend to agree. Kinda reminds me of the situation where the guy tried to take a clock shaped like several sticks of dynamite and a fuse on an airplane. fortunately, he didn't make a fuss when they confiscated it, but still, taking something that looks like a bomb on board an airplane just a few short months after 9/11, well that seems like a pretty stupid thing to do to me.
Security has to investigate anything suspicious, having a "Suspected Terrorist" button raises a red flag as much as an alarm clock shaped like several sticks of dynamite.
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Post #111,227
7/24/03 7:48:11 AM
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Red Flag?
Security has to investigate anything suspicious, having a "Suspected Terrorist" button raises a red flag as much as an alarm clock shaped like several sticks of dynamite. /me affixes to Norm a button that says "Suspected Idiot".
Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
Suspected Terrorist
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Post #111,258
7/24/03 10:57:58 AM
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ICLRPD (new thread)
Created as new thread #111257 titled [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=111257|ICLRPD]
| [link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg] - IT Grand-Master for Anti-President | | [link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry/|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] |
THEY ARE WATCHING YOU. The time has come for you to take the last step. You must love THEM. It is not enough to obey THEM. You must love THEM. PEACE BEGETS WAR, SLAVERY IS FREEDOM, STRENGTH IN IGNORANCE.
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Post #111,259
7/24/03 11:00:43 AM
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Must be the "Purloined Letter" theory of covert ops...
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #111,315
7/24/03 4:59:55 PM
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or cf the movie, "Charade" - for the non-reader.
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Post #111,334
7/24/03 6:26:28 PM
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Re: the movie, "Charade"
Playing on the big screen at the Paramount in downtown Oakland Friday night. I'll be there. (Flashback to 1993: I'm housesitting for prosperous elder brother in nearby Piedmont; not-so prosperous younger brother comes to visit. "Charade" is showing that evening on local PBS station; younger brother has never seen; we watch. Halfway through, following some particularly sparking exchange between A. Hepburn and C. Grant I turn to YB; am about to say "Boy, they don't write 'em like this anymore," when YB brutally bursts my bubble, saying, in a voice dripping with scorn, "I can't believe moviegoers ever sat still for this stilted, corny dialogue. Who wrote this shit?")
cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #111,337
7/24/03 6:30:18 PM
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Oh me oh my...
You know you are getting old when stuff like that happens... Either that or your are FAR more civilized than your younger brother.
Maybe both heh?
| [link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg] - IT Grand-Master for Anti-President | | [link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry/|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] |
THEY ARE WATCHING YOU. The time has come for you to take the last step. You must love THEM. It is not enough to obey THEM. You must love THEM. PEACE BEGETS WAR, SLAVERY IS FREEDOM, STRENGTH IN IGNORANCE.
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Post #111,340
7/24/03 6:48:23 PM
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Re: Oh me oh my...
As to the younger brother's level of civilization...well, that was a decade ago. Since then he's acquired an advanced degree, a profession and a great gig (his job is, in broad outline and in several particulars, including actual employer, the job I expected eventually to land thirty years ago); has turned forty and then some; has had several life-changing experiences, including having his heart broken by a fucking expert--I sense that the lad has been seasoned. The test, of course, would be to sit him down in front of the film again and see if he behaves himself any batter.
cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #111,379
7/24/03 11:35:53 PM
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Well Kate was the poster child for Zappa's Dynamo Hum
you always got the feeling that a pair of zircon encrusted tweezers etc. would cook that lady. As far as older flics that show heat with crap dialogue(not my opinion but general american opinions) was Taylor and Burton in "the taming of the shrew" Few actors had the absolute devilment Burton could emote, steamed to the gills or not. Taylor was a pretty thing who could take direction. I have always suspected that Bill Murray "might" be able to do Burtons role well but against who as fair lead? As for Grant, he was a lighthearted, quick with a delivery, and siotabe charm. Father Goose was good (of course I enjoyed "the road" movies as well)
thanx,
bill
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #111,351
7/24/03 9:12:58 PM
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Good story. He was right!
-drl
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Post #111,353
7/24/03 9:16:45 PM
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Re: Good story. He was right!
Hmmm...you look older in your photos.
cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #111,357
7/24/03 9:34:00 PM
7/24/03 9:35:47 PM
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Re: Good story. He was right!
Yes.
For some reason, I soured on Cary Grant. I'll still say North by Northwest is in the top 5. I can't watch The Philadelphia Story. As for Katherine Hepburn, well, I lost interest a long time ago. She was great in Guess Who's... and On Golden.. though.
And as for A. Hepburn, never had even the faintest clue what the deal was with her.
-drl
Edited by deSitter
July 24, 2003, 09:35:47 PM EDT
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Post #111,365
7/24/03 10:07:31 PM
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Well.. about Audrey I could tell you.
But I won't.
K. Hepburn - to grok her! you'd have to become intimately acquainted with the Murican social mores of about a 40 year span. So yours is kinda like another, "I don't like Bach" thing, y'know?
Odd you hadn't even noticed the subversive little digs which - in those days, She Alone! could get away with, because she was just so damn Brilliant. And I mean that literally: nobody else could have gotten away without Churchly Sermons from the lugubrious Ashcrofts du jour. And she was smart enough not to get locked-in to some ego-maniacal-Male Studio Czar for "permissions". (She also made a spate of bad movies - from which she had to climb out, all on her own. She climbed.) She had/has! no peer.
Some social stuff your fevered brain just ain't wired to Get. Oddly enough, at times you seem to realize this disconnect - then you forget :-)
Ashton
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Post #111,366
7/24/03 10:14:38 PM
7/24/03 10:29:42 PM
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Re: Well.. about Audrey I could tell you.
No Ash, I think I've just had it with bitchiness, and long instead for Dorothy McGuire or Donna Reed. When I was REALLY young, I had a huge crush of Dorothy McGuire. All the brilliant raving in the world from Kate can't encompass one radiating warming smile from DM.
Alas, I threw over Dorothy for Veronica Lake.
(edit: fact just discovered on IMDB - she's from my home town...)
(edit2: oops she died in my home town on 9/13/2001)
(edit3: Dorothy McGuire)
[image|http://www.movieforum.com/people/actresses/dorothymcguire/images/dorothymcguire.jpg||||]
-drl
Edited by deSitter
July 24, 2003, 10:16:04 PM EDT
Edited by deSitter
July 24, 2003, 10:17:41 PM EDT
Edited by deSitter
July 24, 2003, 10:29:42 PM EDT
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Post #111,371
7/24/03 10:42:26 PM
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Audrey? *Bitchy*?
What color are the laws of physics in your cosmos?
gape-jawed,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #111,378
7/24/03 11:31:45 PM
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Re: Audrey? *Bitchy*?
Ah. You were alluding to the other Hepburn. But, y'know?...I've got one of those myself. She doesn't have the jaw, but she's absolutely fearless, seldom discouraged, rushes in where angels fear to tread and, while occasionally infuriating in her brashness, routinely takes me out of that tendency in myself that my ex-wife witheringly dismissed as "old-lady"-ish. Try it sometime, if you have the opportunity.
cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #111,401
7/25/03 7:46:18 AM
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Re: Audrey? *Bitchy*?
Yes, she DEFINED the type, in BaT.
KH also help create the type - Desk Set etc.
-drl
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Post #111,368
7/24/03 10:17:34 PM
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My brother, a movie addict, named one daughter Katharine.
Alex
A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul. -- George Bernard Shaw
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Post #111,369
7/24/03 10:24:55 PM
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Philadelphia story was a damn good movie AND play.
We watched it in tribute a few days after she died. Stewart won an Oscar for that role.
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #111,370
7/24/03 10:25:54 PM
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Geez! Where to begin?
I mean, Cary Grant never rang my chimes either (I guess I'm just not wired that way), but you take the sixty- and seventysomething Kate Hepburn over the insolent, magnificent-jawed creature of The Philadelphia Story? And, sweet Jesus, you are impervious to the charm of the Hepburn at the other end of the war-of-the-sexes spectrum, female division, the exquisite Audrey? What color is the sky (blue bars and white stars on a red field apart) on your planet?
[I'd made it to about 34 or 35 without ever seeing The Philadelphia Story. I used to have a tiny TV (13 inches? eleven?), at that time my only appliance of that nature, parked on the kitchen table. Then newly-divorced, I was preparing a solitary evening meal, and switched on the tube for distraction. As it came to, we were about five minutes into what proved to be The Philadelphia Story. Cool! I watched for about half an hour until the local station broke in with a voice-over apology for the misunderstanding--apparently the advertised feature was The Philadelphia Experiment, a preposterous low-budget sci-fi yarn--and switched to the scheduled movie, advanced to the 40-minute mark. I think it was 2000 or 2001 before I finally cancelled out that episode of cinema interruptus by renting the 1939 production.]
No accounting for tastes...
(shrugging),
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #111,391
7/25/03 1:12:05 AM
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PS re the Other Hepburn
Composer of Moon River (Breakfast at Tiffany's) - too lazy to look him up: I heard discussing his various songs some years ago. He rattled off a number of Mega stars who'd sung this cute ditty and said.. ~"of all of those, the rendition of this song which I feel captures the spirit I had most in mind, and my personal favorite - is, Audrey Hepburn's." He then added, "..despite her non-training as a singer yada yada".
Ah well, I am of course prejudiced beyond all argument - for having met the little sweetie, alone and for maybe 8? minutes which seemed-like-an-hour at stage-door {first crush on an Older Woman}. It was at the precise moment Before she became Famous.. forever. This for my having seen a (rare) sneak preview of Roman Holiday, in Pasadena - then coming home for a break - to find that Audrey was playing Gigi in SF! And I Knew with what-passes-for Certainty.. what had to happen next.
{I'm still not sure.. if she had more than an inkling - of the reception to come ? Being modest or - standard actor's uncertainty?}
Nobody knew who 'she' was, obviously; She! was surprised that 'I Knew' anything. Which is why I was alone at the stage door and, instantly mesmerized by her innate and unmistakable charm; aura is no exaggeration - and her sincere interest: she had never seen! the final cut. She had Questions! of insignificant moi.
I almost succeeded in her acquiescing to my returning her to her hotel via Lambretta motor scooter (a Vespa in the flic!) until . . .
:( BUMMER:
some Yahoo appeared at doorway, to see why she was being so long and..
Sic Transit Gloria Mundi.
I. experienced. that. latin. Fully. :(:(
Days? few weeks? later: Everyone Knew. It-all was quite {another word abused fatally} extraordinary, her reception and all which followed. Whatever it is 'she was' - it was Different.
(And I Loved The Fact of her having such tiny breasts - for all those others who do and did. And especially for demonstrating just how irrelevant and stupid was/is the largest mammary-fetish boobocracy Of All Time. She transcended the boobocracy.)
Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle..
And she was elfin because - she was! and had damned near starved to death in WW-II Holland - and she was trained as a Ballet dancer. Nothing at all about auto-starving For Effect. No doubt she possessed her share of quaint personal foibles.. which I Was Robbed! ever of divining, by cruel Kismet.
RIP Audrey - you went out with Class, too.
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Post #111,392
7/25/03 1:18:56 AM
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Re: PS re the Other Hepburn
An extraordinary and touching story--but I've just raised my estimate of your likely age by five years.
cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #111,393
7/25/03 1:37:46 AM
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BTW - Audrey's US postage stamps are out!
[Heh.. everybody likes Mysteries - for the clue solving. Why, I am older than time.]
And I have a few panes to start with - it's a later more svelte, impeccably polished Audrey. Just a tad Too-perfect for my preference. Foolishly, they didn't ask me.
Seeing one who has just removed stage-makeup - now There's Honest Beauty. The kind that creates permanent memory in us susceptible mortals -- kinda glad I didn't have a camera; they lie.
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Post #111,395
7/25/03 1:53:03 AM
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Re: BTW - Audrey's US postage stamps are out!
Yep, we bought them already. :)
Nightowl >8#
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!"
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #111,406
7/25/03 9:11:10 AM
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34 for me...
Video tape - no interruptions. ;-)
She wrote a good many of her lines for that film as well. Quite impressive.
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #111,412
7/25/03 9:29:37 AM
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Ok, that's the tangent limit people
Please please PLEASE take the next tangent to a new thread, the right-shift is getting ridiculous.
===
Implicitly condoning stupidity since 2001.
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Post #111,474
7/25/03 3:15:09 PM
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Oh..
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Post #111,475
7/25/03 3:16:35 PM
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Oh..______Kay..______then
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Post #111,477
7/25/03 3:29:55 PM
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Belings in Politics, Man Ejected Off Plane for Button (new thread)
Created as new thread #111476 titled [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=111476|Belings in Politics, Man Ejected Off Plane for Button]
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