OK, wrong again. I am *shocked*

Post #275,543

12/12/06 7:36:01 AM

12/12/06 7:38:23 AM

Then small tribes never existed, and island cultures are imaginary. The people alway die out, right? Riiiiight. We'll just ignore the idea that there are whole worlds that could be expanded into, so it needn't remain tiny forever, nor do the people need to be huddled together all the time.

Oh, let's see now. I talk about civilisation falling apart, and you wonder how infrastructure will disappear. And since moving supplies is so expensive, don't expect 'raiders from Earth, either. Duh.

You confuse science fiction with fantasy set in a technical background. Science fiction has a funny tendency to come true in one form or another. We WILL go to other worlds to live, despite your reactionary 'don't go! It's DANGEROUS out there' attitude. I truly hope that we do it fast enough to preserve us through what I think is to come. Your way, social collapse and the 'social evolution' (talk about fantasy!) preserves nothing and leaves the door to the death of humanity as a species even wider.

edit: damn that title was harsh

Imric's Tips for Living

Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.

Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.

Edited by imric Dec. 12, 2006, 07:38:23 AM EST

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Post #275,555

by Andrew Grygus

12/12/06 10:27:13 AM

The death of humanity as a species is a given.

Time is the only variable. You think our technology will extend that time - I do not. Current science and cosmology provide no practical way to expand even to the most nearby (and very hostil) worlds, and finding another that is actually habitable is entirely out of the question.

There may be a way out of here but it's not through technology. You'd need to come up with a whole new definition of how the universe works and demonstrate that it works that way.

The massive expenditure and depletion of resources you propose to set up one or two doomed colonies would be far better spent fixing problems here, and that would also avoid the severe damage to the upper atmosphere your project would cause.

As for your small tribes and island peoples - point me to one where power struggles and fits of jealousy were/are not a feature. They live in a highly resiliant environment that can absorb damage done, and for those who can't get along, there's the option of leaving. In your colony just one person with a grudge and suicidal frame of mind could easily destroy the entire colony.

And even if it did survive into a second or third generation, expecting the people there to adhere faithfully to your plan is simply absurd. They will have their own agenda.

Living as a tribe of Siberian nomads would be far richer and less dehumanizing than living in your underground moon base would be anyway.

[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]

Post #275,556

by boxley

12/12/06 10:44:43 AM

amen on your last sentence

Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 51 years. meep

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Post #275,560

by imric

12/12/06 11:09:30 AM

So - Let's sum up your points

Small colonies are impossible wherever they go, small groups are intriniscally non-viable. Expansion is impossible away from Earth.

It's cheaper to UNDO damage we've done, with unspecified technologies that do NOT exist, change all existing cultures, and it is safer to meddle further with an ecosystem we don't know how to manage now, than to plant seeds elsewhere. This is more viable than to improve existing technologies to go to places out of reach of the coming disaster as a backup. Above all, the attempt should be avoided.

A rocket adds so much more (on a global scale) damage to the ecosphere that extra-terrestrial (planetary/lunar) colonies would doom us all. Well, more doomed.

Humans having their own agenda is a bad thing. Central planning and control is all - their agenda would certainly have not include survival (the goal involved here).

Humanity would be better off with a nomadic/tribal lifestyle - after all it is idyllic and wouldn't have the problems you cite for colonies.

Imric's Tips for Living

Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.

Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.

Post #275,581

by n3jja

12/12/06 6:11:23 PM

"Mein Fuhrer, I Can Walk!"

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