That wasn't what I said

Post #24,921 by nking 1/19/02 1:35:14 PM Reply	That wasn't what I said I didn't say that Red Hat owned Linux, but that the AOL contributions would be going back to the Linux groups. That means that any Linux based on the Red Hat source (IE Mandrake) will get contaminated. Mozilla is a good product, but I thought they open sourced it before the AOL buyout? Notice that Netscape 6.2 is more bloated and buggier than Mozilla 0.9.7 is. Mozilla is great, because AOL programmers are not doing the bulk of the coding, the open source community is. Netscape 6.X is based on Mozilla code, but AOL adds all those gee-gaws and other crap that make it bloatware and majorly buggy. Which is why some people stick to a 4.X version of Netscape, one that won't crash their browser if they fart too loud. Counter Platform? Are you forgetting Apple, Amiga, Sun, Palm, Sony, and IBM? Any of them could make a counter platform to Microsoft's. Even TVIO can be turned into a counter product. It is, after all, based on Linux. Why is AOL all of a sudden, our savior against Microsoft? "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
Post #24,928 by Andrew Grygus 1/19/02 2:36:51 PM Reply	Counter platform? Lets see your list: Apple: Markets to the choir; run by a techno ego-maniac control freak who is, nontheless, beholden to Microsoft (Office for the Mac, Internet Explorer) who wouldn't dare challenge the Redmond giant on anything important. Billy keeps Stevies balls conveniently at hand for squeezing. Amega: No nothing. Sun: No consumer products. No name recognition. No credible ambition outside the corporate realm. No experience whatever in entertainment business. Palm: Destined to be a super cell phone. Getting pounded by Microsoft for anyone who wants PC type capabilities. No money. Will not market Be OS because no resources. Sony: Only credible challenger to Microsoft in extended game consoles, but insufficient in scope. Microsoft is well on the way to building an integrated environment from bottom (games) to top (control of Internet) with total control of home environment in between (XBox home controller, later this year (PCs too - why do you think XP has UPnP turned on by default, and why do you think it's so hard to turn off?)). Too tightly controlled by foreign corp to get much support. IBM: That's spelled "International Business Machines". No presence in home / entertainment market, not planning to get into home / entertainment, not interested in home / entertainment market. Supports Windows on the desktop as a lucrative generator of support revenue. Does not support Linux on the desktop. Tivo: "Jose's 3rd Street Tacos" has a better chance of taking on McDonalds in a world wide revenue battle and winning. The name of the game is "Marketing, Marketing and Marketing" and only established giants with consumer marketing prowess, money and technology to back it up - and an unflinching will to win, need apply. Sorry, AOL is about all there is. They are now buying technology and development skills they desperately need to survive. Further, AOL will keep the interest of many in the Linux community who are interested in games and entertainment. They will get a lot of free development supporting their platform while the rest of the Linux community concentrates on servers. [link\|http://www.aaxnet.com\|AAx]
Post #24,949 by nking 1/20/02 12:59:08 PM Reply	Counter Counter Platform Apple: while run by an ego-manic, and beholden to Microsoft. They once had an idea named Pipin, plus they once had the Newton PDA. They also have the marketing, look at all that iMac and OSX hype. All they need to do is break the chains with Microsoft after the DOJ settlement and buddy up with the MicroApps part that gets broken off with MS. Amiga: The Amiga One platform is still in development. They used to have an CD32 Game Console based on the Amiga plus a CD Drive. [link\|http://www.amiga.com\|Amiga.com] is still up. AmigaOS is a full multimedia OS. I'd give more but my wife is screaming at me to go to the mall with her, my son, and my two nephews. Later! "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
Post #24,956 by nking 1/20/02 5:31:42 PM Reply	Continued, Post-Monster Kids Amiga: they have the games, the multimedia, and could review the CD32 unit with a PowerPC processor to run AmigaOS 3.9, and port StarOffice and other programs. Just add a keyboard and you have a set-top console computer. Amiga has the old Commodore experience with home computers and consoles. It is a pity that Gateway sold them, as Gateway was supposed to make an Amiga based WebTV clone system. Gateway fumbled the ball here when they sold them. If someone, like 20th Century Fox, were to buy Amiga. They could pump some more R&D into it to make an alternative platform. IBM: OS/2 and eCS, nuff said here. IBM or an OS/2 OEM could bundle OS/2 and Lotus Smartsuite onto a set-top device. It could be WINTEL based, ala XBox, use a DVD drive, etc. IBM has the marketing, if they are smart enough, to pull this off. Sun: They still have that Network Computer and Javastation. They could license the JavaOS to companies who want to build their own Internet Appliance. StarOffice also could be used here. They have all the peices, they just haven't figured out how to put them together. Palm: They could turn PalmOS with BeOS/BeIA into a consumer device. A brick computer with a flat panel LCD screen for use in the kitchen or living room. Didn't 3Com already make a device like this? Sony: The Playstation 2, already has add on parts to turn it into a small computer. As their user base grows, they can start to get developers for applications. Maybe with a PC Emulator, they can run Windows and Linux stuff. There already exists a Linux for the PSX2. With an add-on hard drive, keyboard, mouse, and Ethernet/Modem adapter, the PSX2 can be turned into a PC that uses the TV screen as a monitor, and/or optional LCD screen. Sony keeps on growing. Sega: I hadn't thought about this, but someone did port Linux to the Dreamcast. Sega could license the Dreamcast BIOS and hardware to other companies that can add on the keyboard, hard drive, and other features. Also slap on a DVD drive, and MP3/VideoCD player. Call it the Dreamcast 2, and put in faster video, audio, and CPU chips. TIVO: Their user base is still growing, they are expanding into the DirectTV market with units that can run TIVO and DirectTV services. I was thinking of getting one before I got let go by my company. With TIVO I can record two programs at the same time on the DirectTV system. Many are moving away from Cable to DirectTV because of the price difference. For $6 more, local channels can be added to the DirectTV subscription. DirectPC is about to take place, which will offer broadband over the Satelite dishes. Another blow for Cable TV, if they don't reduce the Cable rates, more people will flock to satelite services. Dish network is about to merge with DirectTV. Cable companies: Many are working on their own OS or a Linux or BSD based OS that will turn digital cable boxes into home computers with a minor upgrade. Slap in a hard drive, update the BIOS, and switch on the connections to areas in the house. Charter Communications is leading the way for this, other companies are following. Maybe in the next few years we will see something come out of it. "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."*
Post #24,988 by jb4 1/21/02 9:17:56 AM Reply	OT: 5 hrs. at the mall Norm? Sheeesh! jb4 (Resistance is not futile...)
Post #25,001 by nking 1/21/02 11:48:41 AM Reply	Nope, 15 minutes at the mall, 4 hours at Grandma's house making snowmen and having the kids slide down the hill on sleds. The rest was driving time. They misbehaved at the mall, at the children's indoor playground there, so we took them to Grandma's house. First snowmen of the year made due to all the snow. I was supposed to be given 15 minutes of break time to use the computer to check email and messages. It was cut short to 5, due to the kids wanting to go to the mall so bad. Just enough to fix my hosts file, log onto ZIWE and make a short, interrupted, post. "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
Post #25,014 by Andrew Grygus 1/21/02 3:24:29 PM Reply	Errrr . . Norm? "All they need to do is break the chains with Microsoft after the DOJ settlement and buddy up with the MicroApps part that gets broken off with MS." Norm, the Shrub DoJ surrendered, grabbed defeat from the jaws of victory. There will be no MicroApps, just the one huge monolithic Microsoft we know so well - exactly why AOL is making a move. So Amiga has a Web site. I have a Web site. Britney Spears has a Web site. Big deal. It has no market, no money and no future outside a very small niche. All the platforms you mention in this and subsequent post have a serious to fatal lack of resources except Sony. Sony (and all the others) lack what Microsoft and AOL have - Internet infrastructure and a huge base of on-line users. That would be extremely expensive and difficult for anyone else to acquire. In other words, none of the others are in the game at all. Microsoft has control of the PC (even Intel is now locked out of the design spec) and will soon be the dominant manufacturer of what passes for home PCs and devices (XBox out now, XBox home controller out later this year, Secure PC and others in the works). Microsoft has every intent of seizing control of the Internet and is well on its way to that goal. AOL has a strong desire to survive. To do that, they MUST cut themselves free from Microsoft, and MUST prevent Microsoft from making the Internet its own private preserve. To do that they MUST have their own platform, perhaps not a PC platfrom - an appliance platform will do if properly marketed. Linux has a good track record in apliances (including a couple you mentioned), but AOL needs a top notch development team - right now. Red Hat has that. Sure, some developers will leave, but money talks - most will stay. AOL will tell them of all the good they'll do for Linux on the desktop, since most of their code will be GPL'd by necessity. Since AOL is the only credible counter to Microsoft, with money, an Internet infrastructure, and on-line users, this deal needs to be real and it needs to go through - unless you pefer the "All Microsoft Future". [link\|http://www.aaxnet.com\|AAx]
Post #24,930 by Andrew Grygus 1/19/02 2:45:36 PM Reply	Netscape and Mozilla Yes, Netscape "open sourced" their code before the AOL buy, but as a desperation measure on their way to the scrap yard - a vain hope for get free development work since they could no longer afford it themselves. The Mozilla team judged Netsape's code too bad to salvage and pretty much started over, which is why it's taken so long. If Andresen could have keept his mouth shut, Netscape might have lived, but seeing the lion asleep, the monkey yanked it's tail, with predictable results. [link\|http://www.aaxnet.com\|AAx]

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