Yeah, exactly

Post #231,346 by jake123 10/28/05 12:19:15 PM Reply	Yeah, exactly 'Course, being from Europe, Pete probably has no experience in real wilderness. Pete, when I started talking about bush lore, I was talking about a situation where you have an accident (say, someone falls into the fire) and you're a week in on a canoe trip, and the only way out is via six lakes and eight portages. Going very hardcore, one can cover perhaps 40 km in a day (and that is going very hard indeed, dangerously so) and you're 100 km away from the nearest phone. No cell phones up there, guy's going into shock, what do you do? Yes cooling the wound is the first priority, but there is more to deal with than getting the wound cool and calling in the pros; you have to go get the pros (or better) take the problem to them if possible. --\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca \n [link\|http://consultron.ca\|http://consultron.ca] [link\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] \n Kingston Ontario Canada [link\|news://news.consultron.ca\|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
Post #231,356 by Another Scott 10/28/05 12:48:08 PM Reply	These days if you're that far out you prob want a sat phone. You've no doubt heard the stories on the CBC about the guys that are using just their muscles to go from [link\|http://www.vancouvertomoscow.com/\|Vancouver to Moscow]. Cheers, Scott.
Post #231,397 by pwhysall 10/28/05 3:44:37 PM Reply	And how many people is that going to apply to? Very bloody few, is how many. My advice is applicable to 99.99% of the readers of this board, for 99.99% of the time. People who are out in the wilderness can work this shit out for themselves, I wot. Peter [link\|http://www.no2id.net/\|Don't Let The Terrorists Win] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Home] Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
Post #231,403 by jake123 10/28/05 4:22:28 PM Reply	Re: And how many people is that going to apply to? Well, that may be true, but knowing what to do if that's the case can certainly help one's confidence a great deal any time one has to give first aid, whether help is close to hand or not. Also, I've been in the situation many times, though without incident. That situation is actually a fairly common one where I come from, though with the growing spread of wireless communications, much less so than it used to be. Let's say you're on the TransCanadian between Thunder Bay and Kenora, or going up to Timmins; no cell phone, most people up there don't have sat phones. You just have to know what to do. Canoe trips are but one way one can find oneself out of reach of telecom systems in Canada; the land is vast and very thinly populated. Another Scott: about the satellite phone: where you going to charge it up? My longest trip was just shy of two weeks. There was certainly no fear about going out on long trips like that without comm tech when I was young, and I can't see why one would necessarily need it now. Far more important is the knowledge of how to deal with the situation; when do we try to move them to help? When do we send out a fast canoe (this refers to the people in it, not the canoe itself) to bring help here? How do we maximise the chances of making the trip with the injured party, or how do we do our utmost to keep them alive while waiting for help to arrive? What does one need to take to maximise speed on the two to three day trek out that's required from the deepest parts of the Algonquin, Killarney, or Temagami regions without unduly risking the people making the race? It's not the same here as it is there. If you have the knowledge on handling things like burns under these conditions, then scalding yourself with hot spaghetti sauce is going to be easy to handle without panic while minimising harm and danger to oneself. --\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca \n [link\|http://consultron.ca\|http://consultron.ca] [link\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] \n Kingston Ontario Canada [link\|news://news.consultron.ca\|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
Post #231,408 by Another Scott 10/28/05 5:03:16 PM Reply	Good points. Yes, there are limitations in communications even with satellite phones and even though they're not tremendously expensive, they aren't cheap and are outside the financial resources of the vast majority of people who might be out in the woods or away from cell phone towers. You're right that one should know what to do in emergencies even if there is technology to help. As we've discussed here before, advanced technology breaks while things like pencil and paper and sextants are much less fragile. But it does help to be prepared. That means knowing how to give yourself first aid, but also taking reasonable preparations to allow communications in an emergency, letting people know where you're going and when, etc., when possible when traveling. If I were that far from civilization, it would be on a vacation. Part of my planning would be making sure I knew what to do in an emergency and seriously thinking about having a sat phone (with lots of extra batteries and/or a [link\|http://www.haimei.com/mobile_phone_accessory/manual_charger.htm\|crank powered charger]). Cheers, Scott.
Post #231,405 by drewk 10/28/05 4:48:09 PM Reply	More than you'd think We've got lots of places without cell coverage. We've also got lots of places you can be a day's walk from the nearest electricty, not to mention improved roads. As a comparison, you could put all of Ireland inside Yellowstone National Park, and from lots of that area be more than a day's hike from anything approaching modern conveniences. Remember, this place is big. === Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link\|http://DocHope.com\|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats]. [link\|http://DocHope.com\|http://DocHope.com]
Post #231,439 by jake123 10/28/05 7:22:27 PM Reply	Yeah, and up here is even bigger, and a tenth of the people You're going to be out of cell coverage at some point on any highway in Canada outside of the Windsor-Quebec City corridor. Windsor to Quebec City is further than London to the Scottish border. It takes 24 hours to drive through just Ontario. Etc etc etc. That said, I do understand the point about having a sat phone; I'm just pointing out that sat phones are a luxury outside the reach of most people in Canada's North. Nothing like living in a frozen desert to really limit the size of a population, and therefore an economy. --\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca \n [link\|http://consultron.ca\|http://consultron.ca] [link\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] \n Kingston Ontario Canada [link\|news://news.consultron.ca\|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------

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