They don't have web access?

Post #304,120 by Another Scott 2/13/09 5:06:24 PM Reply	They don't have web access? http://www.thomas.go...rop/app09.html#h1 Hmm... Cheers, Scott.
Post #304,124 by boxley 2/13/09 5:28:38 PM Reply	when was it posted? not until after the quote was made
Post #304,125 by beepster 2/13/09 5:36:07 PM Reply	Bill was released last night around 11pm to the congresscritters. I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #304,126 by boxley 2/13/09 5:44:39 PM Reply	couldnt be true, it been on the intarweb forever
Post #304,127 by Another Scott 2/13/09 5:46:02 PM Reply	The point was... 1) We have unnamed sources saying that an unnamed lobbyists has something that (some) staffers don't. 2) We don't know the timing of the various actions. 3) We don't know if the timing is out of the ordinary. 4) We know that the information was posted on the web promptly, and it's reasonable to assume that people who needed access to the information had it sooner than Thomas did. (It takes time to post things, after all.) 5) It's a routine complaint in Congress that members and staffers don't have information as soon as they think they should. Every budget bill gets that complaint (and it's often a valid complaint, but often having the bill sooner wouldn't change the complainer's vote). 6) This bill was rushed for many, many good reasons. Given all that, it looks like Bedard is fishing for hits to me. YMMV. Cheers, Scott. (Who is not disputing the report, just the spin.)
Post #304,134 by beepster 2/13/09 7:38:43 PM Reply	Re: The point was... The bigger point should be: Congress voted and passed a 1073 page document today that was released last night at 11pm. How many of them do you think read it completely. Answer is likely 0. When you find out the crap thats in it...please come back to me about the "spin". I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #304,136 by Another Scott 2/13/09 8:12:49 PM Reply	It's nothing new. Do you ever think that there was a time in US history when the legislators had the time to read all of the text in a major bill? I'd be surprised. Major legislation is usually written under the strict control of the various committee chairs. Individual House and Senate members who aren't in those committees have little impact on the items in a bill. It's even less "democratic" in the Conference Committee - the members are chosen by the leadership. Members have to trust their leadership as to what's in the legislation. As such, the votes on this bill, like most bills, has almost nothing to do with the provisions in the legislation. The Republicans decided before January 28 that they weren't going to vote for it. Having a day or a week to read the final version wasn't going to change that. The Audacity of Nope: http://christyhardin...can-public-again/ Every major piece of legislation has crap in it. Film at 11:00. ;-) Cheers, Scott.
Post #304,144 by beepster 2/13/09 11:38:54 PM Reply	Did you just say that to >me?< I won't bow to special interests. I will make things transparent. I will give review periods for all major legislation. Any of the above sound vaguely familiar? I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #304,145 by Another Scott 2/14/09 12:39:28 AM Reply	Was Obama running for the House? I understand your point, but you seem to be continuing to lumping all the Democrats together. That's silly and unfair. You know that Obama doesn't run the House. You know that this stimulus plan was special because it needed to be passed quickly. You know that he's been in office just over 3 weeks. Obama said he would wait 5 days for public comment before signing legislation. He still intends to do that: http://www.politifac...before-signing-b/ "During the campaign, the president committed to introducing more sunlight into the lawmaking process by posting nonemergency legislation online for five days before signing it. The president remains committed to bringing more transparency to government, and in this spirit the White House has posted legislation expected to come to the president's desk online for comment. We will be implementing this policy in full soon; currently we are working through implementation procedures and some initial issues with the congressional calendar. In the meantime, we will continue to post legislation on our Web site for comment as it moves through congress over the next few weeks." That seems a reasonable compromise to me - an important bill that has been working its way through the system for weeks shouldn't need to sit on his desk for 5 days before he can sign it. BTW, that "promise" by Obama goes back to at least January 3, 2008 (the oldest version at the Wayback Machine) - http://web.archive.o...om/issues/ethics/ Nobody was thinking that the economy would be in free-fall when that was written. FWIW. Cheers, Scott.
Post #304,152 by beepster 2/14/09 9:47:34 AM Reply	I see so regardless of the message those words convey, he's going to get a pass every time the democratically controlled legislature sends him something to sign..regardless of the fact that he initiated the call for it and is directing it through the process? Just checking. I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #304,156 by drook 2/14/09 10:01:01 AM Reply	Wrong argument Try this one: You don't get to ignore your own rules just because "this time it's an emergency." That's how we got the PATRIOT Act. That's why I disagree with the position that this bill was an exception. Now as far as posting the stimulus bill ... Was there infrastructure in place that would make it possible to do that before Obama took office? Are there House procedures in place to make it available with that much lead time? Is Obama allowed to dictate the policies and procedures of the House? The ship of state is not a rowboat. It doesn't change course on a dime. I'm willing to give this administration a little time before coming to conclusions. What I can say is that so far they seem to be steering in a better direction. Ask yourself this question: Have liberals attacked Republicans by saying, "They're no better than the Democrats"? That seems to be a distinctly conservative attack. And it strikes me that "he's as bad as I am" isn't really a rousing defense of your own position. -- Drew
Post #304,157 by beepster 2/14/09 10:20:08 AM Reply	Don't get me wrong all of those elements are there... this is politics as usual, however, nothing different. I'm sure that about 50%-75% are willing to give him the benefit of the doubt... We have added a few T to the national debt this week, however...and while it may have been an "emergency", a few less B's in there could have been managed with the process that He promised. To my eye, doesn't look like the rudder has moved an inch...steady as she goes I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #304,158 by boxley 2/14/09 10:32:06 AM Reply	my main objection is that this is not a stimulus bill the dems have wanted to spend on programs listed in this bill for a long time. No objection per se, they won and they are trying to pass what they always wanted thats how it works in America A bill laden with democratic bridges to the airport is not a stimulus bill or an emergency, that is why I am complaining about the method. thanx, bill
Post #304,165 by drook 2/14/09 1:00:43 PM Reply	Then what should they spend on? Stimulus bill means get some kind of economic activity going. The Democrats have a whole list of things we should have been spending on anyway. Should they not do anything they've been calling for, just because they thought of it before the previous administration wrecked the economy? -- Drew
Post #304,171 by boxley 2/14/09 4:10:36 PM Reply	nuke plants, building thereof, Not DV grants and endangered species relief $75 million for "smoking cessation activities and the like.
Post #304,180 by Ashton 2/15/09 1:19:20 AM Reply	Complex; highly debatable -- many years to any production, by which time many other approaches Not-needing hugely expensive decommissioning may well render that approach antediluvian (like so much in the minds of the sci-illiterate Class, especially MBA-suits: the major contributors to Congressperson-purchases.) (And no need to cite France as 'blazing the way'; their decommissioning expense -- if they can afford it THEN -- shall be as useful a litmus as anywhere.) We have yet to touch most of the egregious isotopes everywhere around Hanford, Oak Ridge and numerous smaller sites, none of which ever get to MSM. Most readers (and 'reporters' + Editors) can't pronounce radionuclides, let alone discuss their relevance.
Post #304,138 by boxley 2/13/09 8:45:58 PM Reply	you have named sources obama, I will wait 5 days before signing important legislation so the public can view it pelosi: I need to get to rome for an award, pass the damn thing now nother: thats the way it always works, although I bitterly complained when the republicans did it I now realize that any reasonable person expects this sort of stuff and I find it unfair that beep keeps harping on it just because the democrats are doing it.
Post #304,139 by Another Scott 2/13/09 9:31:25 PM Reply	Disagree with that characterization. But you knew that. ;-) We'll see how things turn out. In other news... http://www.huffingto...ppo_n_166875.html "When I came back to the cloak room after coming to the agreement a week ago today," said Specter, "one of my colleagues said, 'Arlen, I'm proud of you.' My Republican colleague said, 'Arlen, I'm proud of you.' I said, 'Are you going to vote with me?' And he said, 'No, I might have a primary.' And I said, 'Well, you know very well I'm going to have a primary.'" So much for "Country First!", huh. They couldn't vote for it because they were afraid of a primary opponent... Cheers, Scott.

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