Hobbit is very different from LotR.

Post #5,826 by admin 8/19/01 11:05:10 AM Reply	Hobbit is very different from LotR. It was intended to be a children's book. On Tolkien's originality: yes, elves and halflings and goblins and such all came from earlier works. I sincerely doubt that anyone gave them the thorough treatment that Tolkien did (read the Silmarillion if you doubt me on this). And Tolkien was a true poet when it came to his prose. It's one thing to write about elves; it's quite another to generate the sense of wonder that Tolkien could with a few choice phrases. I've been reading LotR to my son for the past year or so (a few pages a night before bed), and he loves it. He read the Tolkien Biography to himself as well, and he really enjoyed it. I'm finding that reading the books as an adult I'm finding a good many things that I didn't notice as a child or teenager. Regards, -scott anderson
Post #5,833 by ChrisR 8/19/01 12:27:25 PM Reply	The Hobbit is a set up... Even though the Hobbit is a different style, I think you really need to read it first in order to appreciate the trilogy. I read all four books, for the first time, in my freshman year of college during a week long jag. I had a bad habit of going on such jags during that period of my life, skipping innumerable classes. Wish I still had that level of energy and concentration I did back then. I started on The Silmarillion several times, but have never really gotten much into it. It's still staring me in the face all these years later - reminding me that I have to get around to it one of these years. As for originality, Tolkien did a lot of research in Nordic mythology, so I think a lot of what he writes is borrowed - with Hobbits being his main edition to the lore.
Post #5,842 by Ashton 8/19/01 3:08:29 PM Reply	Yeah.. seems to have become fashionable of late, to add JRR to the deconstruction list. Razing edifices is ever so much easier than erecting; and the timed explosives give us a new form of explotainment too :-) Maybe it's the EngLit equivalent of DieHard XXII, or the attempt to remake Sabrina - without an Audrey Hepburn, a Bogie or a William Holden (!) all for the relative absence of much resembling Original talent, amidst today's noises. Above all.. JRR was a Master story teller! Should he have had to also invent a completely Original mythology with names never heard before? ('Course he sorta Did do some of that, though our friend the Gollum can conjure ideas of a Golem? Yesssss indeed.) OTOH for those lookin fer egalitarian philosophies executed flawlessly.. well, wouldn't that just be (a rather more entertaining presentation of) Agit-Prop? and soon devolve to preaching: to unrecalcitrant humanity..which Likes behavin like assholes and rationalizin that behavior - Often (?) And yes - reading JRR at different stages in your life - Is a different appreciation (or not, as the case may be). Hmmm might be time for me to haul out the Rings again.. My Precioussssss. Ashton the Unbiased
Post #5,843 by Another Scott 8/19/01 3:17:00 PM Reply	"of late"?!? This was in 1978! :-) Good points though.
Post #5,847 by Ashton 8/19/01 3:47:08 PM Reply	You mean.. they was a pickin at it way back then, too?
Post #5,853 by CRConrad 8/19/01 4:20:03 PM Reply	Heck yeah -- the translator who rendered it into Swedish,... ...Åke Ohlmarks, became thoroughly disillusioned and warned against its power to seduce youngsters into believing all that fantasy crap was real. Not without reason: He was being stalked for years by some whacko who called himself "Gandalf" or "Aragorn" or something, and apparently sincerely believed he was that character (whichever one it was) from the books. And this wasn't a case of an isolated nut-job, either -- "Aragalf" was only the leader of a whole "cult" of similar weirdoes. Ohlmarks had to get police protection, IIRC. Christian R. Conrad The Man Who Knows Fucking Everything
Post #5,868 by Ashton 8/19/01 6:27:37 PM Reply	Wow!.. heh, do we need any further proof then, that the rest of our er daily experience is ~ the same ..stuff that dreams are made on ?? or to revert to '50s Muricanadmania: *Which twin has the Toni* ???** (a brand of hair 'permanent wave' nostrum; ad showed ident. twins and, well-) :-\ufffd Now as to The Mac Jihad umm - how different is that actually, from.. never mind.
Post #5,892 by ben_tilly 8/19/01 8:44:12 PM Reply	Who cares if he borrowed? His stories speak for themselves. Want to know where he got his names from? Try the following list of Dwarfs in the Norse world given by Snorri Sturluson a few hundred years ago: Nyi, Nidi, Nordri, Sudri, Austri, Vestri, Althjof, Dvalin, Bifur, Bombor, Nori, Oinn, Mjodvitnir, Vig, Gandalf, Vindalf, Thorin, Fili, Kili, Fundin, Vali, Thror, Thrain, Thekk, Lit, Vit, Nyr, Nyrad, Rekk, Radsvid, Draupnir, Dolgthvari, Haur, Hugstari, Hledjolf, Gloin, Dori, Ori, Duf, Andvari, Heptifili, Har, Sviar, Skirfir, Virfir, Skavid, Ai, Alf, Ingi, Eikinskjaldi, Fal, Frosti, Fid, and Ginnar Any of those look familiar? But names are nothing. Their personalities are all Tolkien, the story-telling is all Tolkien, and if he learned from those who came before, it just shows that he knew that it is better to build on what is already known. In fact several of his official papers dove-tail very well with his popular fiction. The work he did as an academic told him better how to tell stories and vice versa. Speaking of which some day I will get off my lazy ass and buy my own copy of, "The Monsters and the Critics". But I still remember having read it in College, finally understanding why I liked Tolkien, Norse mythology, etc, and why I had been left utterly cold by the Greek myths. Cheers, Ben

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