What will happen when ordinary people realise this?

Post #330,592 by warmachine 8/1/10 12:09:00 PM Reply	What will happen when ordinary people realise this? I've always thought the US is held together by the Great American Dream, which is a delusion. When enough people realise staying afloat is bone tiring work and upward mobility is near impossible, I don't think it'll be pretty. -------------------------------------------- Matthew Greet I'm not prejudiced. I hate everyone equally.
Post #330,593 by folkert 8/1/10 1:54:39 PM 8/1/10 5:04:59 PM Reply	You get people that are at the top... misguiding people in the middle. Sort of like the Tea Party. Glenn Beck or Paul Rand are "Middle Class American"? Yet they are rallying the cry again the "to re-distribute the wealth" so called agenda... who has this wealth? The top 1%. Not the bottom 90%. Go figure. edit: Crud I left out a few words there. Edited by folkert Aug. 1, 2010, 05:04:59 PM EDT Expand All History
Post #330,594 by Another Scott 8/1/10 1:55:53 PM Reply	Someone independent will have to push it. I think one of the reasons Clinton was able to do as much as he did was that Perot scared the federal establishment. Continuing PAYGO, raising taxes, etc., to reduce the deficits probably wouldn't have been possible if Perot hadn't pushed them and hadn't received nearly 19% of the vote in 1992. Once people are elected to national office, too often their focus becomes trying to appeal to enough people to get re-elected while not rocking the boat too much. When things are going well, that makes some sense. But with as many problems as we have, and soon will have, we don't need a continuation of the status quo... Someone with power and at least some credibility would have to lead the charge for the middle class because a great many powerful interests don't want change that benefits the bottom 95%. We can hope that Obama would lead the charge, but it's up in the air whether someone from the far right will try to grab the reigns instead.... The upcoming redistricting of congressional districts may have a big impact on how little or how much things things change in the 2010s, depending on how they're drawn to support existing incumbents. Cheers, Scott.
Post #330,595 by beepster 8/1/10 2:28:05 PM Reply	Always supporting "the one" it won't come from Washington. They are all in the 1%. I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #330,597 by Another Scott 8/1/10 2:46:41 PM Reply	Always seeing things as binary. Obama didn't come from Washington. ;-) I dunno who will lead the charge. As I said. Cheers, Scott.
Post #330,602 by beepster 8/1/10 5:52:49 PM Reply	He's there now and from the looks of it, assimilating quite nicely. I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #330,611 by boxley 8/1/10 6:50:05 PM Reply	what was his prior job? not from washington my ass
Post #330,618 by Another Scott 8/1/10 8:48:02 PM Reply	Compare Obama to McConnell and Boehner....
Post #330,622 by beepster 8/1/10 10:07:08 PM Reply	They appear to be able to hold a job. nudge I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #330,623 by Another Scott 8/1/10 10:15:55 PM Reply	<rolls eyes> ;-)
Post #330,626 by boxley 8/1/10 10:33:15 PM Reply	they were able to get re-elected?
Post #330,628 by Another Scott 8/1/10 10:40:37 PM Reply	Obama won't have any trouble in November 2012.
Post #330,632 by boxley 8/2/10 7:41:35 AM Reply	same question I posed to lincoln 12 states have passed resolutions requiring candidates to prove eligibility, is there enough electoral votes without him appearing on the ballot in those states for a win or will he have to produce the long form certificate and weather out what ever storm he is hiding from?
Post #330,633 by Another Scott 8/2/10 7:47:30 AM Reply	The courts have addressed that. There's no there there. The birthers are blowing smoke and the courts haven't fallen for it. http://www.snopes.co...rthers/carter.asp Cheers, Scott. (Who can't imagine that Box is really a birther.)
Post #330,634 by boxley 8/2/10 8:28:10 AM Reply	not yet they havent http://www.thepostem...duced-in-georgia/ to get on the ballot in these states obama will have to provide the long form version showing details of his birth. He has spent a lot of money to ensure that it is not released to the public. If hge cant/wont get on the ballot of these states is there still enough electoral votes for him to win without them? Georgia is a swing state http://www.270towin.com/states/Georgia obama is a natural born citizen by definition because his mom is a usain. However he is hiding something or he wouldnt be spending all of that money fighting the release of the documents. I wouldnt be surprised if he didnt scam Uni's by applying for benefits and grants pretending he was a foreign kid, thats something I would do myself. Gonna be embarassing when it does come out.
Post #330,641 by Another Scott 8/2/10 10:02:30 AM Reply	... http://en.wikipedia....nspiracy_theories The Obama campaign released a 2007 certified copy of his birth certificate (in this instance referred to as a "Certification of Live Birth") that states Obama was born in Honolulu, Hawaii, on August 4, 1961. Frequent arguments of those questioning Obama's eligibility are that he has not released a photocopy of his "original" birth certificate, and that the use of the term "certification of live birth" on the document means it is not equivalent to one's "birth certificate". These arguments have been debunked numerous times by media investigations, every judicial forum that has addressed the matter, and Hawaiian government officials, a consensus of whom have concluded that the certificate released by the Obama campaign is indeed his official birth certificate.[8] Asked about this, Hawaiian Department of Health spokeswoman Janice Okubo stated that Hawaii "does not have a short-form or long-form certificate".[9] Moreover, the director of her Department has confirmed that the state "has Sen. ObamaÂs original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures".[10][11] There's no there there. It's noise to get people riled up, like the Vince Foster conspiracies. EOT on this subject. Cheers, Scott.
Post #330,642 by boxley 8/2/10 10:28:51 AM Reply	from wiki? rofl why wont he release a copy of this? http://www.wnd.com/i...0728birthcert.gif would shut everyone up wouldnt it? Wait, he would need to provide that to get on the ballot in some states so he will produce one or not get on the ballot. We will see. thanx, bill
Post #330,652 by lincoln 8/2/10 1:00:19 PM Reply	"would shut everyone up wouldn't it?" No it wouldn't. If he released that, then all of the whacko extreme right wingnuts will find something else to bitch about, because they're afraid of the "scary black man" in the White House. "Chicago to my mind was the only place to be. ... I above all liked the city because it was filled with people all a-bustle, and the clatter of hooves and carriages, and with delivery wagons and drays and peddlers and the boom and clank of freight trains. And when those black clouds came sailing in from the west, pouring thunderstorms upon us so that you couldn't hear the cries or curses of humankind, I liked that best of all. Chicago could stand up to the worst God had to offer. I understood why it was built--a place for trade, of course, with railroads and ships and so on, but mostly to give all of us a magnitude of defiance that is not provided by one house on the plains. And the plains is where those storms come from." -- E.L. Doctorow
Post #330,643 by beepster 8/2/10 10:39:17 AM Reply	Its not going to matter if things don't dramatically improve, the list of candidates being bantered about on the R side have a couple of names that could work. (and no, Mrs Palin is not one of those names that would work). I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #330,644 by boxley 8/2/10 10:50:08 AM Reply	new suspects or the usual?
Post #330,653 by beepster 8/2/10 1:11:14 PM Reply	Some old, some new Romney apparently is back, the Huckster of course...but Pawlenty is in the mix..and had he been made VP candidate, Obama may not have won, Perry from Tx, and they may be able to get Mitch Daniels to run too. Daniels and Pawlenty aren't carrying alot of baggage in with them...which would help. I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #330,683 by Another Scott 8/2/10 10:31:44 PM Reply	Basil marceaux Sr. all the way! http://politics.free...ceauxforgovernor/ :-/ Cheers, Scott.
Post #330,684 by boxley 8/2/10 11:43:29 PM Reply	ooh, drewk someone needs yer services!
Post #330,690 by drook 8/3/10 8:32:22 AM Reply	Dear lord, is that for real? -- Drew
Post #330,685 by beepster 8/3/10 12:13:10 AM Reply	That would make for some interesting fundraisers! I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose freewill.
Post #330,635 by boxley 8/2/10 8:30:21 AM Reply	note that judge carter isnt the brightest crayon in the box 69 million popular voters dont mean shit, shrub vs bore proved that electoral votes count, people dont
Post #330,598 by warmachine 8/1/10 3:30:38 PM Reply	You think the US public is that stupid? Admittedly, considering the healthcare debate, you're probably right. -------------------------------------------- Matthew Greet I'm not prejudiced. I hate everyone equally.
Post #330,621 by mhuber 8/1/10 9:37:40 PM Reply	Yes. --------------------------------------- I think it's perfectly clear we're in the wrong band. (Tori Amos)
Post #330,711 by Another Scott 8/3/10 11:31:27 AM Reply	Elizabeth Warren wants the job. http://www.alternet....eat_middle_class/ Elizabeth Warren: My Mission Is to Restore America's Great Middle Class At Netroots Nation, Elizabeth Warren spoke about how to make the new Consumer Financial Protection Bureau help protect the U.S. economy. August 1, 2010 Editor's note: The following is a speech delivered by Elizabeth Warren at Netroots Nation 2010. [...] (via AngryBear) Cheers, Scott.
Post #330,714 by beepster 8/3/10 12:22:56 PM Reply	She's gonna have to do more.. ..than talk about how great consumer protection is. manufacturing drove middle class. where productivity and wages start to diverge just so happens to be the same time horizon as where the US began losing its manufacturing base. Sure, understanding today's complex world of the future is a little like having bees live in your head. But...there they are.
Post #330,716 by Another Scott 8/3/10 2:18:58 PM Reply	She addresses that, and much more. It's a good piece. Here's the whole thing on one page - http://www.alternet....lass/?page=entire Lots of things built the middle class - not just manufacturing. [...] You see, my grandmother was born into the world of boom and bust, boom and bust, as it had been from 1794 until the Great Depression. But my grandmother also lived in a world of economic transformation. Because coming out of the Great Depression, just three laws fundamentally altered the course of America's history. The first one, FDIC insurance, made it safe to put money in banks. The second one, Glass-Steagal, tried to separate the risk-taking on Wall Street from your local community bank. And the third one, SEC regulations, provide some cops to watch the robbers. And so, out of that, what we got was 50 years of economic peace. No financial panics, no meltdowns. And during that 50 years, we built a strong and prosperous middle class in America. Now, my grandmother, when she died in 1970 at the age of 94, had been part of that. She owned a little house, she had plenty of groceries in the cupboard, and she had some cash in the bank. She was part of the growth of middle-class America. As were her children and her grandchildren. But shortly after my grandmother died, within a few years, we began unraveling that. Part of it was on the regulatory side. We hadn't been clever about regulations. They stayed ossified. The regulations put in place in the 1930s had not been updated. They had not adapted to a new world. And along came a new group of people who said, "Let's just get rid of the regulations. What are they there for anyway? They just cost money. Dump the regulations." And so the regulatory framework, or the "cops," who were on the beat began to disappear. They lost their effectiveness. [...] So let me wrap this back around. Is this going to save the middle class by itself--the consumer agency? I've written about the middle class now for two decades--and if you want to give me another couple of hours I could bend your ear about all that's happened here--and the answer is no. There's frankly too much that's broken. We've got to have change in labor policy, we've got to have change in health policy, we've got to have changes in education policy. That's what it will take to restore a middle class. But we also have to have changes in consumer credit policy. And the new bill is a big step in that direction. So, here's what I want to say: One way or another, I'll keep pushing for the middle class. I hope you will too. She's a great advocate. Cheers, Scott.
Post #330,737 by beepster 8/3/10 5:30:17 PM Reply	i would think (I read the piece)...that the jobs that drove the income would be a major factor..and yes she >mentioned< labor policy...but that was not core to the piece. she mentions deregulation as a bad thing while at the same time saying the regulation itself was a bad thing, etc... its a nice speech but there weren't alot of concrete examples of changes she would recommend. In that, she may have some...they just weren't part of the speech. Sure, understanding today's complex world of the future is a little like having bees live in your head. But...there they are.
Post #330,832 by jake123 8/5/10 10:23:07 AM Reply	Well, gee I mean, she's talking about her area of expertise and the area she can do some work in, while mentioning the other major fields that also require work. That's terrible... just terrible. How can we trust her?
Post #330,852 by beepster 8/5/10 4:45:40 PM Reply	Did I say... she was not to be trusted? No. In fact, I said it was a good speech. But if I'm going to award her the job (as nother put it in his title of she wants the job of rebuilding the middle class) then I would hope she has more concrete suggestions in the areas mentioned in addition to the consumer protection act. Sure, understanding today's complex world of the future is a little like having bees live in your head. But...there they are.

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