What would you train them to be?

Post #264,101

8/7/06 2:56:41 PM

IT? Other technology?

Middle management?

Top management?

Imric's Tips for Living

Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.

Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.

Post #264,108

by bepatient

8/7/06 3:35:24 PM

Welders, mechanics, operators (machine), butchers, bakers

cabinet makers, etc.

There is life outside of corporate and computers. Quite a bit of it, actually.

Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry._{Adrian Belew}

Post #264,114

by imric

8/7/06 4:35:19 PM

ROFL! Not what I meant at all!

Manufacturing positions?

Producers of luxury goods?

Ron is a welder - he makes $15/hour. Not enough to make it by himself. MiG, Tig - heavy, light.

Ross is doing carpentry. He also does not get enough work to get by. And this is in a place where the economy is relatively good.

Machine shops? Big demand, I guess - building the machines that keep our industrial base humming along.

Mechanics? Ok - you have me there. As fewer people can afford to buy new cars, and have to keep the older ones going, that's gonna be a 'growth' industry.

Bakers? OK. Working in large bakeries at minimum wage to produce the cheap bread that the bulk of the people can afford, or higher paid bakers providing luxury items? Limited demand for the latter.

I repeat. Train them for what, exactly?

Imric's Tips for Living

Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.

Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.

Post #264,115

by imqwerky

8/7/06 4:40:45 PM

He forgot candlestick maker too :0)

We're gonna need a lot of them when we start taxing the power grid.

Smile,
Amy

[link|http://kevan.org/brain.cgi?Amy%20Rathman|Pics of the Family]

Post #264,116

by bepatient

8/7/06 4:51:19 PM

Now this ought to be interesting coming from me.

Are either of those 2 gents in the related union for those services?

I got mid 20's boys here laying carpets and earning a living. Home Depot will match Ron's 15 and give him benefits.

So you still contend that the only way to "make it" is to go corp or IT. (I know this isn't the case...but that seems to be the conclusion from the posts).

And, btw [link|http://swz.salary.com/salarywizard/layouthtmls/swzl_compresult_national_SC16000075.html|Ron's underpaid]

Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry._{Adrian Belew}

Post #264,120

by drewk

8/7/06 5:10:50 PM

Problem with "earning a living"

The thing about climbing the ladder is that the it only passes overhead every so often. If you don't grab that bottom rung and start up, it may be years before you get another chance to move beyond just "earning a living".

I think that's why a lot of the people mentioned in that article way up in this thread have dropped out of the game. They know that once they accept a job that allows them to "earn a living" they're ineligible for getting back on the ladder.

Okay, the metaphor is getting clunky. But the reality is there were times when I was unemployed and I didn't even look at the listings for the entry-level positions. Sure, I could have earned a living doing them. But it would have set me back years in my career. It's perverse, but it's more acceptable to have a several-month gap on a resume than it is to have a period of underemployment.

===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]

Post #264,123

by Another Scott

8/7/06 5:19:28 PM

Been there, too.

Post #264,124

by Another Scott

8/7/06 5:19:35 PM

8/7/06 5:20:28 PM

Dupe (How'd that happen?)

Edited by Another Scott Aug. 7, 2006, 05:20:28 PM EDT

Expand All History

Post #264,131

by imric

8/7/06 5:44:14 PM

Nah - my point

is that all the training in the world isn't gonna fix the economy if the paying jobs aren't there in the first place. We'll just have desparate, highly trained underemployed and underpaid people.

Further - training for management jobs is a dead-end, too. Eventually, as the ability for the masses to consume dries up, the industries that cater to our market will also dry up.

And - Unions? Like it or not, most of THEM are useless anymore. Regardless of how much you may want them to be a whipping boy. Talk to Riiich about THAT one. They take dues and bend over for management, most of the time.

And as for Ron being underpaid? Perhaps he shouldn't take the only jobs he can find, and instead should sit around doing nothing and wait for a magic job to appear that's on that chart?

Imric's Tips for Living

Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.

Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.

Post #264,121

by hnick

8/7/06 5:10:52 PM

Butchers aren't happening either...

The trend around here, anyway, is to get rid of the local meat workers (they make too much money) and centralize to one meat packer. The stores get plastic wrapped meat, which IMO is inferior to that we used to get. I still go to fish and meat mongers, so I don't buy that stuff from supermarkets. It's only a big deal to me because my wife's aunts and uncles largely worked in the meat departments of local supermarkets and got downsized or early retirement. When I knew the guys in the meat dept. by name, I used to buy from there, incidentally.

My wife now, used to be the heavy hitter in the income department for the family. She was vice-president for trading in a Cleveland company. She quit to take care of her parents at the end of their lives, and now is looking at going into retail sales in hopes of making over 25K again. She used to make about 100K over that before bonuses and wot not. We are just old and if I lose my job, I'll probably never work in tech again either.
Rising economy my ass, to coin a phrase...

my 0.02 while I can afford them.

Post #264,127

by bepatient

8/7/06 5:32:29 PM

Actually not as bad around here

Maybe in the grocery stores...south Philly has the food distribition and packing area that is doing pretty well...and growing. Possibly at the expense of the store employees...that I couldn't say.

Most of the folks there I knew though..have skipped...preferring to not work in the winter conditions in July. (couple reconsidered that position after last weeks 120's, though. :-))

Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry._{Adrian Belew}

Post #264,130

by hnick

8/7/06 5:43:37 PM

Well, it's 2 out of 3 of the dominant chains here.

Top's and Marc's both unload and stock with min wage help. I guess I just don't have enough of a high level view of things to see the wonderful economy.

The lrpd is appropriate

The simple fact is that we cannot find enough qualified people in Cleveland (the world's dumbest leper colony) to do all the work we need done.

Welcome to IWETHEY!