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Post #264,031 by bepatient 8/7/06 10:09:42 AM Reply	Better and I have already stated in this thread that I would expect the population of this board to be decidedly negative simply because of the bulk of folks here happen to work or be involved in IT. And hopefully, even they realize that expecting the 90s to continue (expecting the bubble not to burst) is a completely unrealistic expectation...even if we'd let Clinton have 2 more terms. Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry._{Adrian Belew}
Post #264,034 by drewk 8/7/06 10:24:48 AM Reply	Don't I wish I unfortunately got into the IT bidness in mid '98 with no (documented) experience or education. By the start of 2000 I had taught myself enough PHP to have gotten a new webmaster position in the same company where I had started on helpdesk. In 2000 I started at a .com startup as a web programmer. By the time I had the experience to chase better gigs, the whole game had gone tits-up. The fact that I'm now doing better has (IMO) little to do with the economy or the Bush administration, and everything to do with the fact that my IT career didn't start until 8 years ago. The extended periods of un-(and under-)employment along the way have blown holes in any long-term planning I might like to have done. I don't know that I'd have been smart and disciplined enough to skip the toys had I been raking in the bubble money, but I do know that I never got the chance to find out. === Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link\|http://DocHope.com\|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats]. [link\|http://DocHope.com\|http://DocHope.com]
Post #264,035 by boxley 8/7/06 10:25:53 AM Reply	IT did have a bubble that is well burst But construction is booming and wages are dropping here due to worker relocations, same in phoenix, florida and other booming places. Anomoly is Katrina reconstruction, wages are extremely up. Maybe up enough to offset lowering expectations elsewhere. thanx, bill Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 50 years. meep

Men dropping out of work force - (JayMehaffey) - (102) - July 31, 2006, 09:35:52 AM EDT

Of course it points that out - (bepatient) - (88) - July 31, 2006, 11:31:01 AM EDT

Exactly. - (mmoffitt) - (6) - July 31, 2006, 11:58:14 AM EDT

Ah, so its a GOD given right - (bepatient) - (5) - July 31, 2006, 12:09:10 PM EDT

Heh. - (mmoffitt) - (4) - Aug. 4, 2006, 09:50:37 PM EDT

Somehow I think you misinterpreted - (bepatient) - Aug. 4, 2006, 10:05:35 PM EDT

Oh, and another thing. - (bepatient) - (2) - Aug. 4, 2006, 10:18:51 PM EDT

You think people don't take pay cuts today? - (mmoffitt) - (1) - Aug. 6, 2006, 07:50:32 PM EDT

You are confused - (bepatient) - Aug. 6, 2006, 08:56:45 PM EDT

Wow, almost perfectly opposite impression - (JayMehaffey) - (80) - July 31, 2006, 12:04:23 PM EDT

Huh? - (drewk) - July 31, 2006, 12:12:04 PM EDT

Timing of publication and the publication itself. - (bepatient) - (78) - July 31, 2006, 12:13:24 PM EDT

Ferchrissakes. - (mmoffitt) - (77) - Aug. 4, 2006, 09:55:06 PM EDT

Apologist for whom, exactly? - (bepatient) - (76) - Aug. 4, 2006, 10:10:19 PM EDT

lowest unemployment in years, I agree - (boxley) - (75) - Aug. 4, 2006, 10:17:58 PM EDT

Saw this a while back - (bepatient) - (74) - Aug. 4, 2006, 10:39:56 PM EDT

crock o sommat - (boxley) - (4) - Aug. 4, 2006, 10:54:30 PM EDT

doesn't jibe with the figures - (bepatient) - Aug. 5, 2006, 01:54:00 AM EDT

It's the nature of averages... - (Another Scott) - (2) - Aug. 5, 2006, 09:52:34 AM EDT

Same error both sides - (bepatient) - (1) - Aug. 5, 2006, 11:59:11 AM EDT

Both sides are correct - (broomberg) - Aug. 5, 2006, 05:44:54 PM EDT

possible nit - (boxley) - (68) - Aug. 6, 2006, 09:48:08 PM EDT

other places too - (bepatient) - (66) - Aug. 6, 2006, 11:05:49 PM EDT

P1ss on that. - (imric) - (65) - Aug. 6, 2006, 11:16:47 PM EDT

I can finger just as many - (bepatient) - (64) - Aug. 7, 2006, 12:29:16 AM EDT

100% - (imric) - (63) - Aug. 7, 2006, 07:18:24 AM EDT

Let's take a poll: Better or Worse Worse - (imqwerky) - (62) - Aug. 7, 2006, 07:33:35 AM EDT

Better. - (imric) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 09:24:40 AM EDT

Considering Cost of Living even? - (bepatient) - (1) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:05:33 AM EDT

Yup. - (imric) - Aug. 7, 2006, 01:27:32 PM EDT

7/8 of what I was making in 1998 - (boxley) - Aug. 7, 2006, 09:29:24 AM EDT

Depends on what you mean by better - (JayMehaffey) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 09:33:48 AM EDT

Seconded - (drewk) - (1) - Aug. 7, 2006, 09:47:14 AM EDT

Thirded - (lincoln) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:10:25 PM EDT

Better - (bepatient) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:09:42 AM EDT

Don't I wish - (drewk) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:24:48 AM EDT

IT did have a bubble that is well burst - (boxley) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:25:53 AM EDT

Worse - (bionerd) - (9) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:38:34 AM EDT

By what measure then? - (bepatient) - (8) - Aug. 7, 2006, 11:07:39 AM EDT

While she considers herself better off, - (SpiceWare) - (1) - Aug. 7, 2006, 11:28:58 AM EDT

true nuff -NT - (bepatient) - Aug. 7, 2006, 11:34:16 AM EDT

It's a double-edged sword. - (bionerd) - (5) - Aug. 7, 2006, 11:36:31 AM EDT

Now wait just a minute - (bepatient) - (4) - Aug. 7, 2006, 11:44:48 AM EDT

Hold on there, babalooey. - (mmoffitt) - (3) - Sept. 5, 2006, 04:59:15 PM EDT

I didn't. - (bepatient) - (2) - Sept. 5, 2006, 06:38:07 PM EDT

Last on this. - (mmoffitt) - (1) - Sept. 7, 2006, 10:35:53 AM EDT

2 sides in every negotiation. Mgt caved. -NT - (bepatient) - Sept. 7, 2006, 12:04:46 PM EDT

Better - (SpiceWare) - (36) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:42:43 AM EDT

Which all begs the question - (drewk) - (35) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:51:47 AM EDT

Re: Which all begs the question - (bepatient) - (34) - Aug. 7, 2006, 11:06:24 AM EDT

I'll disagree on that - (drewk) - (30) - Aug. 7, 2006, 11:59:28 AM EDT

But we don't want pollution in our yard - (tonytib) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 12:14:13 PM EDT

That's where it gets tricky - (drewk) - Aug. 7, 2006, 12:32:53 PM EDT

It's not just NIMBY. - (Another Scott) - Aug. 7, 2006, 12:37:17 PM EDT

Doesn't solve core issue - (bepatient) - (13) - Aug. 7, 2006, 12:25:02 PM EDT

I definitely agree with one point - (jake123) - Aug. 7, 2006, 01:08:46 PM EDT

What would you train them to be? - (imric) - (11) - Aug. 7, 2006, 02:56:41 PM EDT

Welders, mechanics, operators (machine), butchers, bakers - (bepatient) - (10) - Aug. 7, 2006, 03:35:24 PM EDT

ROFL! Not what I meant at all! - (imric) - (6) - Aug. 7, 2006, 04:35:19 PM EDT

He forgot candlestick maker too :0) - (imqwerky) - Aug. 7, 2006, 04:40:45 PM EDT

Now this ought to be interesting coming from me. - (bepatient) - (4) - Aug. 7, 2006, 04:51:19 PM EDT

Problem with "earning a living" - (drewk) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:10:50 PM EDT

Been there, too. -NT - (Another Scott) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:19:28 PM EDT

Dupe (How'd that happen?) -NT - (Another Scott) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:20:28 PM EDT

Nah - my point - (imric) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:44:14 PM EDT

Butchers aren't happening either... - (hnick) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:10:52 PM EDT

Actually not as bad around here - (bepatient) - (1) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:32:29 PM EDT

Well, it's 2 out of 3 of the dominant chains here. - (hnick) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:43:37 PM EDT

I'll second that - (imqwerky) - (12) - Aug. 7, 2006, 01:24:32 PM EDT

You are. -NT - (bepatient) - (11) - Aug. 7, 2006, 01:49:37 PM EDT

I beg to differ. - (imqwerky) - (3) - Aug. 7, 2006, 02:03:28 PM EDT

Beg all you like - (bepatient) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 03:09:39 PM EDT

No, I won't - (imqwerky) - (1) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:19:07 PM EDT

You may want - (bepatient) - Aug. 7, 2006, 05:28:14 PM EDT

And so are you. - (folkert) - (6) - Aug. 7, 2006, 02:31:23 PM EDT

:-) - (Another Scott) - Aug. 7, 2006, 02:42:34 PM EDT

Which goes to the point I made to Drew -NT - (bepatient) - Aug. 7, 2006, 02:44:17 PM EDT

"All-American" content is not smart - (tonytib) - (3) - Aug. 7, 2006, 04:00:50 PM EDT

Actually, iirc - (bepatient) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 04:04:03 PM EDT

No, public company on the NASDAQ - (tonytib) - (1) - Aug. 7, 2006, 04:18:34 PM EDT

ok. thought it was - (bepatient) - Aug. 7, 2006, 04:33:43 PM EDT

The gains made by the few bring the averages up. -NT - (imric) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 02:50:50 PM EDT

Thats what the other link was for - (bepatient) - (1) - Aug. 7, 2006, 03:26:03 PM EDT

No? - (imric) - Aug. 7, 2006, 03:59:29 PM EDT

Depends on your take of the situation... - (Yendor) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:57:00 AM EDT

Worse. Much worse. -NT - (Silverlock) - Aug. 7, 2006, 12:17:18 PM EDT

Worse - (tuberculosis) - (2) - Aug. 7, 2006, 06:24:18 PM EDT

That's not a realistic metric - (tonytib) - (1) - Aug. 7, 2006, 07:34:23 PM EDT

Just makes it worse - (tuberculosis) - Aug. 7, 2006, 10:24:22 PM EDT

Funny that I know so many in NJ - (imric) - Aug. 6, 2006, 11:08:57 PM EDT

Ah, now I see where this is going - (JayMehaffey) - (12) - Aug. 3, 2006, 04:06:00 PM EDT

Matters not. - (imric) - (6) - Aug. 3, 2006, 05:37:14 PM EDT

You got that right. -NT - (imqwerky) - Aug. 3, 2006, 05:38:03 PM EDT

you forgot the outlaws -NT - (boxley) - (4) - Aug. 3, 2006, 05:46:38 PM EDT

True. -NT - (imric) - Aug. 4, 2006, 01:15:20 AM EDT

And the lawyers ... or is that redundant? -NT - (drewk) - (2) - Aug. 6, 2006, 10:33:02 PM EDT

CAN they be 'outlaws? - (imric) - (1) - Aug. 6, 2006, 11:17:50 PM EDT

Think about it - (drewk) - Aug. 6, 2006, 11:33:06 PM EDT

I wish the NYT didn't make you pay for access - (lincoln) - (1) - Aug. 4, 2006, 05:28:53 PM EDT

The Smirking Chimp has it. - (Another Scott) - Aug. 4, 2006, 05:39:48 PM EDT

That Brooks is a talking head-up-ass on PBS - (Ashton) - (2) - Aug. 4, 2006, 06:04:18 PM EDT

Isn't about 95% of that piece tongue in cheek? - (Another Scott) - (1) - Aug. 4, 2006, 06:23:14 PM EDT

It could be his idea of subtlety, I suppose - (Ashton) - Aug. 4, 2006, 08:20:12 PM EDT

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