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New Clarification and Apology
As my Open Forum public apology posts make clear, I made a bad lapse of judgement in anger, frustration, and fatigue. Unlike a number of smaller persons here, I promptly and publicly apologized.


Yes you did. I commend you for that.

The constant refrain is "he was asked not to something ever again".

There's one slight problem with that story.

It's not true.

Nobody said "don't use the list address for website access registration".


After thorough review of all of the relevent documents, I agree. And since this is >my< read of the prior situation and largely the subject of my posts...

I apologize for my mis-statement of prior events.

What >actually< happened is Yaz was the first to respond in the Aberdeen incident in December. He did so >wrongly<, by hijacking the account until an explanation from Karsten was given.

The "Aberdeen Incident" as I shall call it, was the first time that the list was hit with a confirmation email...that the email address was being used to confirm enrollment for web content from Aberdeen.

And no...(note my apology)...in no following mail was Karsten directly asked to "not do it again". What were offered were 2 very simple suggestions...one from Brad and one from Peter. Both were extremely reasonable.

Brad's suggestion, use an alternate email address for this activity.
Peter's suggestion, ask first.

Fast forward 11 months.

The list is hit with 2 more confirmation emails. Obviously neither "suggestion" was taken....becasue the list address was used and there was no prior email from K saying "expect this".

============================================

There is the history.

============================================

Now I have read Karsten's reasons for doing what he did.

THANK YOU KARSTEN FOR THIS EFFORT.

While I am perfectly capable of signing up for my own content, the fact that you have taken your personal time to consolidate a list of available resources with common login procedures is indeed commendable.

It would have been nice if I had seen that explanation 11 months ago. Indeed, if you had stated that as your intention prior to the "Aberdeen Incident", perhaps the path could have been clarified and all of this could have been avoided.

What I have noticed in both incidents is that you lost your temper...both times.

And now I have a better understanding of why this happened. You honestly felt you were doing us a favor.

And again, I commend you for taking this initiative.

===================================================

What I don't understand is how this has morphed into som big deal about "slandering my good name" or "nobody asked me too" .

I was trying to interject a small not of sanity..."why not use an alternate email address".

Considering it was suggested once..and that you had access to these resources...I thought it would have been fairly simple. But, according to your supporters, I'm an idiot for even suggesting it.

And so, I suppose, I am.

I guess I'll have to live with that.




If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition

[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
New Small nit.
Hi Bill,

Fast forward 11 months.

The list is hit with 2 more confirmation emails. Obviously neither "suggestion" was taken....becasue the list address was used and there was no prior email from K saying "expect this".


Karsten did post a small note before the confirmations from Forbes and CNet:

Subject: [Iwe] Forbes registration just requested
Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2003 15:46:55 -0800

Confirmation should post to list shortly.

--


After what happened earlier, I was immediately surprised that he didn't run it past the list before signing up, but he did give some notice.

It's a terrible shame that it transpired the way it did. :-( I hope everyone can put it behind themselves so that we can get back to being one big, grumpy, family. :-)

Cheers,
Scott.
New Yes, we DO do grumpy well, don't we...;-)
jb4
"There are two ways for you to have lower Prescription-drug costs. One is you could hire Rush Limbaugh's housekeeper ... or you can elect me President."
John Kerry
New Imagine Thanksgiving with this group ... worse than family
===

Implicitly condoning stupidity since 2001.
New Prolly *STILL* better than *MY* family at Thanksgiving.
Since the Matriarch is Dead and Gone... Likely no longer will we be blessed to see each other.

Feh... I say good riddance to MY famibly.
--
[link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg],
[link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ iwethey
New thats famdamily you heathen :-)
I miss mine in Alaska. Huge Bird, lotsa neices and nephews, the wimmenfolk rush out the door to go to bingo, the men cleanup, feed fire in backyard, marshmellows etc and yarn until the wimmens return.
In floriduh we go to Shoney's its too fscking hot for a fire, and mow the lawn.
thanx,
bill
"You're just like me streak. You never left the free-fire zone.You think aspirins and meetings and cold showers are going to clean out your head. What you want is God's permission to paint the trees with the bad guys. That wont happen big mon." Clete
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
New Hey, with enough beer, it might actually work!
I can imagine worse....
jb4
"There are two ways for you to have lower Prescription-drug costs. One is you could hire Rush Limbaugh's housekeeper ... or you can elect me President."
John Kerry
New I can supply enough of that :-)
And have.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition

[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
New Ah...yes. Missed that...and apologize again.
My main issue.

Maybe I was told but don't remember...of Karstens overall intent...essentially recreating the aged cypherpunks/cypherpunks login with an iwethey/iwethey login at various sites and keeping them listed at twiki.

Not being a regular twiki guy I never saw it. Nor had Karsten put together an explanation of the type he did just prior to yanking all his logins.

Seems more prudent..and really seems to be the congenial thing to do to just run that by folks and see if anyone has an issue.

I would have preferred to use an iwethey.org address for those that require email...because it would be easier for the group as a whole to remember that. (Not everyone has iwe at doggie vtluug org memorized. (I've been on since it started and it doesn't exactly flow off of my fingers even now)

And, unfortunately I guess, I know that it would have only required his asking for that email address to be created and for him to have been granted complete access to it.

If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition

[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
     Signoff - (kmself) - (65)
         Come back soon. You're an important part of the crew. -NT - (Another Scott)
         WTF is going on? - (deSitter) - (15)
             Trust me Ross.... - (folkert)
             Kangaroo Court in session - (Ashton) - (13)
                 His admin right was forfeit... - (bepatient)
                 What Bill said. - (admin) - (7)
                     Re: What Bill said. - (deSitter)
                     I didn't miss that. - (Ashton) - (5)
                         Re: I didn't miss that. - (pwhysall) - (4)
                             Honestly said. - (Ashton) - (3)
                                 Re: Honestly said. - (pwhysall) - (2)
                                     Some people like Surprises. - (Ashton)
                                     Some take a long time learning that - (FuManChu)
                 Ashton Ashton Ashton... - (static) - (3)
                     I thought we were an autonomous collective? -NT - (ChrisR) - (2)
                         Altogether now.... - (pwhysall) - (1)
                             Re: Altogether now.... - (deSitter)
         'mon back - (broomberg)
         I need you to keep me honest -NT - (deSitter)
         take a breather - (cforde)
         Re: Signoff - (rickmoen) - (30)
             This is all very fscked up - (deSitter) - (20)
                 This is sort of reason why OLMRs were good. - (static)
                 Personal response to Ross - (jb4) - (1)
                     Re: Personal response to Ross - (Nightowl)
                 Werd. -NT - (pwhysall) - (1)
                     'Nother werd -NT - (drewk)
                 The way I see it - (orion) - (14)
                     ummm... well... I... err... hmm... amaz... - (folkert) - (13)
                         Re: ummm... well... I... err... hmm... amaz... - (Nightowl)
                         Dude... - (jb4) - (6)
                             I owe it all to my college class - (orion) - (5)
                                 bloody Good Show, Norman! - (Ashton)
                                 Well done Norm - (Silverlock)
                                 Starting from scratch? - (drewk) - (2)
                                     I have an Associates Degree in Data Processing - (orion) - (1)
                                         Thanks, may try to work it into my schedule -NT - (drewk)
                         Irony alert - (rickmoen) - (4)
                             Irony... - (folkert) - (3)
                                 Irony, indeed. - (rickmoen) - (2)
                                     Nope... I am not making an attempt. - (folkert) - (1)
                                         Re: Nope... I am not making an attempt. - (rickmoen)
             Clarification and Apology - (bepatient) - (8)
                 Small nit. - (Another Scott) - (7)
                     Yes, we DO do grumpy well, don't we...;-) -NT - (jb4) - (5)
                         Imagine Thanksgiving with this group ... worse than family -NT - (drewk) - (4)
                             Prolly *STILL* better than *MY* family at Thanksgiving. - (folkert) - (1)
                                 thats famdamily you heathen :-) - (boxley)
                             Hey, with enough beer, it might actually work! - (jb4) - (1)
                                 I can supply enough of that :-) - (bepatient)
                     Ah...yes. Missed that...and apologize again. - (bepatient)
         Guess you won't see this. - (Meerkat)
         Don't go. Really. -NT - (imric)
         Bummer - (tuberculosis)
         You guys are all . . - (Andrew Grygus) - (1)
             Amen -NT - (bepatient)
         I have 2 things to say. - (Steve Lowe) - (1)
             ObAOLMeToo. -NT - (inthane-chan)
         Team Conflicts (new thread) - (orion)
         Kristos crucios - (jake123) - (2)
             All I can say is... - (ChrisR)
             Not way too seriously . . - (Andrew Grygus)
         Re: Signoff - (admin) - (2)
             Speaking of leadership - (rickmoen) - (1)
                 all one can say is "wow" -NT - (bepatient)

dude...?
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