Post #29,930
2/26/02 10:53:52 PM
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Forgot the most important...
The reason I side with you. The reason I left the Democratic party. She was an unpaid intern. She was abused by a sexual predator. She was given jobs that were not taken by deserving people. She was given the quid pro quo. She is the poster child for a HOSTILE WORK ENVIRONMENT. While good people still play apologists for this "man", and while the Democratically OWNED women's organizations were deafly silent, many of us poor working stiffs who would have been shitcanned immediately for such diversions, watched this man - the leader of the free world - a LAWYER, lie to the nation and to federal judges (again, prison for you and I). I don't know how to possibly explain that this man was STUPID and an embarrassment to not only his party, but his country, his gender, his "profession" , ad nauseum.
For the dumb fucks that still don't understand that this was not merely a puritanical inquisition, grow up. He was a poster child for the me generation of men, with all the foibles, adultery, self centeredness, liars, hypocrits... No wonder they can't see him for what he is. It would hurt them personally to be that honest about themselves...
I could be wrong...
Just a few thoughts,
Screamer
"I'll tip my hat to the new constitution, take a bow for the new revolution, smile and grin at the change all around, pick up my guitar and play, just like yesterday..."
P. Townshend
"Nietzsche has an S in it"
Celina Jones
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Post #29,968
2/27/02 11:02:56 AM
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Right on! And, very well said.
Alex
"Of course, you realize this means war." -B. Bunny
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Post #29,969
2/27/02 11:10:18 AM
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You're partially right.
For the dumb fucks that still don't understand that this was not merely a puritanical inquisition, grow up. Didn't Larry Flint do something or other to illustrate that it was a HYPOCRITICAL, puritanical inquisition? He was a poster child for the me generation of men, with all the foibles, adultery, self centeredness, liars, hypocrits... That's one way of putting it. Except this has been going on longer than the "me generation". Let me put it another way, tell me ONE thing that Clinton has done that hasn't been done by a politician before. No wonder they can't see him for what he is. It would hurt them personally to be that honest about themselves... I think Tom Tomorrow has put it far better than I ever could..... [link|http://www.salon.com/comics/tomo/1998/10/12tomo.html/|http://www.salon.co...12tomo.html/]
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Post #30,018
2/27/02 2:27:51 PM
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This is the last one, I promise...
Nixon got caught spying on the Democrats. Well, not true, he didn't even know about it until after the fact. Big crime there. He then villified and tried to discredit his accusers by misusing his power. He finally resigned in disgrace. HE RESIGNED. Not for the break in. He resigned because he got caught trying to cover it up. I was a teenager when this happened. I never trusted Republicans because of this man. Nixon personified all that was wrong with politicians. He was a LIAR. He got caught.
Fast forward. Bill Clinton, a lawyer, gets caught doing a stupid thing. For the time being, I'll put aside the ENTIRE ISSUE OF HER BEING AN UNPAID INTERN NEARLY 30 YEARS YOUNGER AND HIS FINDING HER JOBS USING HIS POSITION AS PRESIDENT THEREBY DISCREDITING THE CONCEPTS OF A HOSTILE WORK ENVIRONMENT, ETC..., and just talk about how he was a LIAR. He lied to me and you (A BLOW JOB COUNTS AS SEX, ASK YOUR WIFE!), he lied to a federal judge (or if you prefer, he intentionally mislead)... He even parsed the word "is" in front of a judge, for Christ's sake. HE COVERED IT UP. HE LIED. Now you can see why I have a little trouble understanding how I actually respect Nixon more than Clinton... At least Nixon had the decency for the republic to resign.
I'll compare him to one more stellar American for my last point. Remember Jimmy Swaggart, the preacher caught with a prostitute? Remember his "I have sinned" with all the crying... At least Swaggart paid the women... Did you defend him too?
I honestly believe that this is a problem with America coming to terms with who they really are. Clinton, the first baby boomer President, actually was just like us... It hurts, don't it.
Just a few thoughts,
Screamer
"I'll tip my hat to the new constitution, take a bow for the new revolution, smile and grin at the change all around, pick up my guitar and play, just like yesterday..."
P. Townshend
"Nietzsche has an S in it"
Celina Jones
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Post #30,026
2/27/02 2:59:45 PM
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That was my point.
From my post: Let me put it another way, tell me ONE thing that Clinton has done that hasn't been done by a politician before. You say he lied and that was the bad thing. He lied to the entire nation. I honestly believe that this is a problem with America coming to terms with who they really are. Clinton, the first baby boomer President, actually was just like us... It hurts, don't it. It doesn't hurt me. I've learned that most people would react just like Clinton did. Which is why the public wasn't as outraged as Starr thought they'd be. At least Swaggart paid the women... Did you defend him too? I'm not defending Clinton. I'm pointing out that he didn't do anything NEW! Everything he did has BEEN DONE BEFORE. ...ENTIRE ISSUE OF HER BEING AN UNPAID INTERN NEARLY 30 YEARS YOUNGER... ...(A BLOW JOB COUNTS AS SEX, ASK YOUR WIFE!)... At least Swaggart paid the women... Like I've said before. It's about sex. Which is why Flynt was so successful against any Republican's trying to hang Clinton. They were both adults and they were both willing. And that is why Clinton got away with it. The vast majority were tittilated by the reports, but it was the stuff of comic routines and barroom jokes. No one >CARED<.
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Post #30,479
3/2/02 6:11:15 PM
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Re: You're partially right.
> > Let me put it another way, tell me ONE thing that Clinton has done that hasn't been done by a politician before.
> Signing the prosecution papers for a Federal sexual harassment case while getting his hose honked by Monica under the desk. Acting as the existential definition of "sexual harassment" while weaseling along about how "woman-friendly" his administration was. Oh, and graciously accepting the kudoes of the (supposedly) feminist organizations, every one of which would have killed and buried any non-Democrat found in a similar position. Regards,
Ric
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Post #29,984
2/27/02 12:13:00 PM
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Isn't this the same woman who said ...
She was taking her presidential kneepads with her to the whitehouse? Just who was the predator here?
With this much manure around, there must be a pony somewhere.
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Post #30,108
2/28/02 12:28:04 AM
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Problems with your characterization.
Was there sleaze? Of course. Was Clinton the 'predator' or was Lewinsky ?? You are doubtless aware of the countless factoids which entertained the Nation endlessly. Was this any more admirable than its daily replay in countless exec. suites? Rhetorical Q. Leave the 'Democrat' party? Why not sever all ties with bizness, then (?)
This was no ingenue seduced by the Big Bad Predator! - this was someone merely demonstrating one more time - as with Dr. Kissinger and a FUCK of a lot of others: power is an aphrodisiac !!
(especially in a nation still Puritan-obsessed about every natural function from excretion to copulation to death and dying). This was one horny pair of similar emotional age - and with legions for company (check out yer Tee Vee sitcoms).
If you want to draw the parallel of Clinton's behavior to some National Average: no argument there! We *ARE* a nation of adolescents esp. as regards anatomy and sex: little boys rarely become adult men - especially in That area - but just older little boys. And it shows. Just notice the Boobs fascination and the double standard as has never gone away: He's a normal randy guy. She's a slut. We are a nation which sees no distinction between the erotic and the pornographic! but our pop theology sees much that is pleasurable as Wrong. While doing it anyway. Schizo.
QED yet?
That Circus was about showing one group of hypocrites (the oft-randy Senators) attempting to Politically Assassinate: a President who was elected TWICE; an effort to remove him despite the decision of the (remaining, small) voting population. It was (both) all about sexual aberration as the Norm in Murica + Political hypocrisy being the Norm in Murica.. nothing more profound than that.
Oh.. AND: it was about Muricans' fav pastime, whether re the OJ Circus or this one - voyeurism. aka "living vicariously Other's lives" (maybe cause one's own is so dull?). Again, check the popularity of Soap Operas for verification.
Nixon resigned because, via his own intransigence and hubris (even He could see that, finally) he had backed himself into a corner from which he was inextirpable :-\ufffd It had nothing (little?) to do with a capitalized-Integrity - can you even have that, if you are as psych. wounded as later we saw: he had been (?)
Sorry but.. Bill C's sexual immaturity, his self-indulgence (however odious, taken in isolation) is a Murican Norm, esp. for folks of his generation: the most self-indulgent Me-Me-Mes Ever! As Brandioch mentioned - THAT's why the mass response was ... Ho ... Hum, another witch-hunt. Oooh let's watch these phony congresscritters in full bombast about crap they often do, making consummate Asses of selves. We watched. They did.
Ashton
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Post #30,171
2/28/02 1:00:17 PM
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Nah! Maybe it was that way for you.
I didn't then and don't now care if Clinton had sex with O.J.
My problem was Clinton saying "I didn't have sexual relations with that woman. Ms. Lewinsky" to the public and even more so to the courts. This is the president, for crying out loud. The chief law officer of the land committing perjury!
All he had to say was "Yeah, so?" and I would have simply continued to count the days left to his presidency.
Alex
"Of course, you realize this means war." -B. Bunny
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