Barter doesn't work - that's why we have money.

Post #28,754 by Andrew Grygus 2/17/02 4:29:32 PM Reply	Barter doesn't work - that's why we have money. What is a fair exchange in barter goods or services for what you have to barter? So easy to get victimized when there's no "market price", and so much time negotiating a deal. Are you a good negotiator? What to do when you need food and nobody who has food happens to need Visual Basic programming just now? OK, that can happen even in a money economy, but it's a lot worse in a barter economy. Money is an agreed on token for units of value. It allows market comparison, and it allows you to deliver value to B, who wants your services, even though B has nothing you want and C is the one who has what you need. You exchange the tokens given to you by B for C's goods. I remember a big push for a barter economy in LA, back in the 70's. The glaring inadequacies became obvious pretty immediately, so one group came up with a fix. In the money economy, we call it a "Debit Card", but they thought the concept was pretty revolutionary. They even came up with a way for new participants to get into the new economy, even though they didn't yet have anything in their account. In the money economy, we call that a "Credit card", but they thought it was a really amazing concept. Unfortunately, computers were not yet universal, so they had no way to keep the accounts straight and the concept died on the vine. Saved them all from the inconvenience of going to jail for running a bank without a license. [link\|http://www.aaxnet.com\|AAx]
Post #28,759 by nking 2/17/02 5:43:16 PM Reply	Coupons! Instead of money give out coupons, good for one whatever, or product or service. Then someone can buy, sell, or trade the "30 hours of VB Coding" coupon I gave out for that DVD player to someone who needs it. ys you are correct, it was tried before they kept accurate computer records. I wonder if it would work in today's economy and technology? "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
Post #28,775 by Ric Locke 2/17/02 9:52:10 PM Reply	Yeah! Coupons! Hey, I've got this great idea! We'll make the coupons out of paper, about six by two inches or so. To make it hard for people to pretend they have coupons when they don't, we'll print a really complicated design on them, including a picture of some old fart nobody knows about any more. What color should they be? Well, green would be nice... Regards, Ric
Post #28,776 by nking 2/17/02 10:04:20 PM Reply	Not realy I was thinking more of a three inch by three inch design, black and white, with a barcode on it that any "Cuecat" or barcode reader could read. The barcode will contain a serial number, and the person taking the coupon can scan it to check if that serial number was used already or if it is valid. For under $200 you could have a PalmOS based unit to read the coupons. "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
Post #28,777 by Andrew Grygus 2/17/02 10:12:30 PM Reply	So, I guess you're going to run right out . . . . and spend $200 so you can take coupons instead of $20s? If you're woried about the $20s, they have these little brown pens costing a dollar or so . . Now these serial numbers - I presume they'll be cleared through Microsoft's passport servers? Or do you have another national service in mind? [link\|http://www.aaxnet.com\|AAx]
Post #28,781 by Ashton 2/17/02 10:49:28 PM Reply	Her Wryness the LRPD sez: "Escape from the prison planet."
Post #28,782 by nking 2/17/02 10:53:37 PM Reply	Cheaper than a cash register POS system plus there is no need to use a server to store serial numbers on. If I issue X Visual BASIC coupons, I already know the serial numbers on the coupons I issued and stored them on the PalmOS unit. They PalmOS unit can read them and verify them. If someone decides to photocopy the Coupons, then I'll know it when I scan one and it tells me that the serial number has already been used. It is sort of like, I Norman, promise to give the bearer of this coupon 30 hours worth if Visual BASIC programming. They can come back to me to get the work done, or trade/buy/sell it to someone else. With the PalmOS unit I can go to their site, scan the coupon and then code in Visual BASIC for 30 hours on their computers. If the coupon is a dupe or the serial number is not in my database then I'll know it was a fraud, and I wouldn't have to do anything except report it to the Police or something, find out where the bogus coupons came from. "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
Post #28,788 by Andrew Grygus 2/18/02 2:14:44 AM Reply	Holes you could drive a planet through. Where there's opportunity for fraud, there will be frauds. They'll gather like flies on a dead possum. Now, just suppose Visual Basic programmer Melvin issues a coupon for 30 hours of programming. Well, the guy that received them couldn't use them and didn't know anybody who could, so he sold them on eBay. The buyer calls Melvin in. Melvin pushes the magic button on his Palm Pilot. "Jeez man, I don't know where you got this coupon, but it's serial number has already been cashed in. Sorry, no programming. I ought to call the cops, but I'll let you off this time." Coupons have just become high risk, thus a 30 hour coupon has to be grealy depreciated, which means nobody wants to take coupons. Norm has to issue 90 hours of coupons instead of 30 hours to buy food. Here's another. George needs Visual Basic programming to modify his software. He sees somone trying to sell some Visual Basic programming coupons, but those are Norm's coupons and his program was written by Melvin. It'll take a long time for Norm to figure out what Melvin has done, so those coupons are nearly worthless to George. On the other hand, a stack of $100s would buy time from any programmer George wanted to use, so he doesn't buy coupons, so coupons become more difficult to sell. And here's another. Norm needs his car fixed, but the mechanic can't use any Visual Basic programming, so he'll have to trade or sell the coupons. This takes time and involves risk, so Norm has to give him twice as many hours of programming as the mechanic work is worth to cover the overhead. Of course, the guy who ends up with the coupons wants the full face value from Norm. It would have cost Norm only half as much to get his car fixed if he'd paid in $20s. I could go on and on, but I have some programming that needs to be finished tonight. [link\|http://www.aaxnet.com\|AAx]
Post #28,803 by nking 2/18/02 10:22:30 AM Reply	Forget it then! Nothing I can do is good enough. I think I'll just move my wife and son into an apartment she can afford, and then join Desitter living under a bridge somewhere so we can talk about how messed up the world is. "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
Post #28,807 by Simon_Jester 2/18/02 10:51:35 AM Reply	Norm...you do realize... that every great idea, at the time, was considered totally idiotic. One businessman went so far as to check with people regarding his idea....if they didn't tell him he was crazy, the idea wasn't far-out enough.
Post #28,811 by boxley 2/18/02 11:19:25 AM Reply	dont forget to email me which bridge you and doc are under so I can bring liquid refreshments and gummint cheese. thanx, bill Mike Doogan "Then there's figure skating and ice dancing and snowboarding. The winners are all chosen by judges. That's not sports. That's politics. And curling? If curling is a sport, pork rinds are a health food."
Post #28,867 by nking 2/18/02 9:09:39 PM Reply	I will do that Me and D are not that bad yet that we have to live under a bridge. But if we do, I'll see if I can pick out a location and a few alternates in case the cops move us or something. I've seen a lot of homeless near the Metrolink station stops, I imagine one of them will wonder near the tracks sometime and squish, one less homeless person on the streets. I may just camp out downtown in an area that my ex-coworkers walk nearby, holding a sign that says "XXXXXXXX XXXXXXXX, LLP made me homeless" and see their reactions. :) Replace the X's with my former employer's name. But I have a plan, if I have some money left, I can rent a storage cube and live in that. If I can, I'd get on a library computer and email you the location of the cube. I learned from the Boy Scouts how to make a burner element from a coffee can, a tuna can, a ton of candle wax, and some cardboard. Should be enough to fry some handburgers and other stuff if I can afford it. Just melt the wax into the tuna can, put the cardboard into a coil shape, let it set, and then light the son-a-btch when you want to cook and place the coffee can over it making sure to cut three or four airholes on the side of the can. Then to turn it off, just put the coffee can that has the lid on it over the tuna can. "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."*
Post #28,824 by altmann 2/18/02 1:48:41 PM Reply	Ya know. If your wife and son can afford an apartment on thier own, don't you think maybe they'd "let you" hang around and contribute your $9/hr to the household, cramped as it may be? You could sleep in the closet or something? I'm sure the family would appreciate the company rather than worrying about how your self-imposed exile is going. Also, I'd bet all the good bridges (near the 'Y' and such) are already taken. -- Chris Altmann
Post #28,866 by nking 2/18/02 9:00:47 PM Reply	It is not about that it is that I am embarrassed that all I can find is A $9/hr Helpdesk job with all of the experience and qualifications I have. I feel like Marvin the Depressed Android from HHGTTG, "Here I am, brain the size of a planet, and they have me answering calls at a helpdesk...." Not only that, I have to limit my abilities so that I do not outshine the others, because once one person tells a customer how to fix a problem, they expect the others to do that as well. So no registry tweeks, no shortcuts, no advanced configuration of home networks, nada ziltch. Just get them online with one modem (or network card), one machine, and a Windows or MacOS operating system. Try to keep calls under 30 minutes (20 at best) and follow their script and use their logical path and hope that someone in an orange vest doesn't come over and tap me on the shoulder and ask me to put the customer on hold and take a walk with them. "Will code Visual BASIC for cash."
Post #28,802 by SpiceWare 2/18/02 10:20:10 AM Reply	Norm - here's your idea in action From Time's site - [link\|http://www.time.com/time/asia/features/changed_japan/yufu.html\|No Yen? No Problem! - Small town bartering] Recession-ravaged residents of this tiny hot-springs town found a way to improve their standard of living. Stuck with low-paying and seasonal tourism-related jobs, Yufuin's citizens solved a chronic yen-flow problem by boosting the local monetary supply: they print their own currency. ... Every yufu user is required to sign the notes they issue. Ultimately they will be called upon to redeem those notes by performing a service for the bearer. The specter of weeks spent washing other people's clothes after a yufu spending spree at the sake shop effectively limits the money supply. The moral: being your own central bank isn't so much fun when the yufu stops here. Darrell Spice, Jr. [link\|http://home.houston.rr.com/spiceware/\|SpiceWare] - We don't do Windows, it's too much of a chore

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