Post #125,901
11/16/03 11:25:53 AM
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Building the $400 computer
I got the replacement parts back in. I haven't built systems in a while and my skills are rusty. I am not sure if I did something wrong last time or if I just had a bad part or parts.
Is touching a live power supply good enough to discharge static electricity? Should I try and get a wrist strap?
That grey material on the AMD CPU cooler, is it cooling material or do I need to buy some? Instructions say not to use thermal grease, but what about premium silver compound?
The CPU fan fit too tight last time, not sure if this is normal as I never did an AMD XP or Athlon processor before. I did an AMD Thunderbird before and I don't recall the CPU fan being tough to strap down. The CPU cooler is from AMD and came with the CPU.
Any hints that can help me? I want to make 100% sure I am doing it right before I begin again.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #125,915
11/16/03 3:01:51 PM
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Re: Building the $400 computer
Definitely don't use "premium silver compound". It's conductive enough that if even a trace of it gets on circuitry, and there is circuitry on the top side of the CPU, it's a big problem.
On the other hand, I don't trust the stuff on the bottom of the fan, it's thick. It may thin down enough over time, but immediate result is a hot CPU. I scrape it off and clean up with solvent, then put the tiniest dab of traditional white grease on the center square only. The objective is to use the absolute minimum that will fill any air gap, and with an Athlon CPU, that's a very tiny bit because the active surface is only 1/4" by 1/2" and extremely flat.
The fans fit tight. Make sure the heatsink ledge is aligned with the high side of the socket, hook the heel end (opposite the ledge) and use a wide flat bladed screwdriver to push the ledge end of the clip down until it snaps in place. Careful, you're pushing hard, so don't let the screwdriver slip or you may damage the motherboard.
Static fears are sometimes overblown, but do work in a non-static environment. If you have a static problem, hit the floor area with a light spray of water, maybe the table top too. Some Downey fabric softner in the water will prolong the effect, and work in bare feet. Rolling chairs are bad static builders on some surfaces.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #126,029
11/17/03 10:56:22 AM
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PH34R MY L337 N3KK1D 5K1LLZ
[link|http://www.megatokyo.com/index.php?strip_id=070|http://www.megatokyo....php?strip_id=070]
===
Implicitly condoning stupidity since 2001.
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Post #126,744
11/19/03 5:01:43 PM
11/19/03 6:08:35 PM
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Whoo hoo! Yeah!
It didn't work, only came up once, and refused to video on again.
So I took a break from it, said a prayer to God, came back and powered on and then everything worked! I am now installing XP Pro on it as we speak and getting ready to switch it for my 700Mhz Celeron once it is done installing all the software I need on it.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
Edited by orion
Nov. 19, 2003, 05:12:23 PM EST
Edited by orion
Nov. 19, 2003, 06:08:35 PM EST
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Post #126,756
11/19/03 6:29:46 PM
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Re: Whoo hoo! Yeah!
Just goes to show it never hurts to pray. :)
I'm glad it got working, Orion!
Nightowl >8#
"The difference between being immature and child-like is that one is what you are, and one is what you choose to be."
Comment by Nightowl {O,O}
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Post #126,765
11/19/03 8:01:30 PM
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Re: Whoo hoo! Yeah!
This sounds like mismatched components (timing errors). It ain't over yet I'm betting. You have indeterminism showing up in a determinisitic thing, so it has to be timing.
-drl
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Post #126,767
11/19/03 8:30:50 PM
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How do I correct that?
No expansion cards are attached to the system, everything is on the motherboard. It reports an XP2000+ CPU, which is correct.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #126,771
11/19/03 9:10:31 PM
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My guess is wrong memory for that board/processor
Try turning off ECC correction in the BIOS.
-drl
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Post #126,778
11/19/03 10:22:41 PM
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It is the memory that Scott suggested for the board
also the CPU he suggested as well. From that $400 computer post.
I will turn off ECC checking if it is on.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #126,796
11/19/03 11:59:36 PM
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Re: It is the memory that Scott suggested for the board
Also try ramping down the processor speed.
-drl
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Post #126,804
11/20/03 12:33:12 AM
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Athlons and "lowest price" memory don't mix.
Athlons work memory hard. I've had clients tell me my memory prices were too high, then find out they were much better than "the exact same thing for a lot less" that didn't work.
So yes, you may well have a memory problem. The memory may work just fine in another machine too. Easiest way to find out is to swap it out. Another is to try [link|http://www.memtest86.com/|MemTest-86] which makes a bootable floppy which does a very thorough memory test. Their documentation states "Don't buy cheap memory and expect it to work with an Athlon".
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #126,829
11/20/03 11:35:08 AM
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Re: Athlons and "lowest price" memory don't mix.
I am running Memtest86 3.0 as I type this. So far, no errors.
Funny thing happened, I burned my documents to a CDR and while copying from the CDR the blue screen comes up with a Stop 8E error on some random system file. I did it three times in a row and each time it was a different system file it had a problem with. Could it be the IDE drivers having the problem, as it is a copy from the CDR which is on an IDE CD-ROM.
I know that others have bought the exact same parts from NewEgg on here, so I ask them if they have had any problems like that with the hardware.
Last thing I want to do is spend more money on this money-pit. My wife got mad at me for spending on it what I already spent.
I'd update the BIOS; however, Shuttle's file has an error extracting on all four sources for the MN31N Motherboard BIOS Update from their web site. Fbog! If someone has that BIOS update and can email it to me, please do. ngking at sbcgloabl.net is my address.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #126,832
11/20/03 11:45:18 AM
11/20/03 11:48:18 AM
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Did you run the CD that came with the board?
It has updates for IDE, video and other. I presume you have the hard disk and CD on separate IDE cables.
Oh, and another thing - especially if all the memory tests pass. I've had a number of Windows installs act strange with odd errors in places you don't expect them. It has generally been the CD-ROM drive doing it. CDs drives can read bad without knowing it.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #126,848
11/20/03 2:10:28 PM
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yes the Shuttle CD that came with the board
and after I had problems, the Shuttle Updated Drivers from the Shuttle web site.
Yes Hard drive is on one IDE controller and CD-ROM on the other, both single drives set as Master with no Slave.
Memory test passed with flying colors.
CD-ROM I am using is an older one, as my main system has the CD-ROM and CDR drive still in it. I thought it was a good one, but could be bad? Used drive I got from my brother after I had some bad CD-ROM drives of my own.
I can either take the CD-ROM out of the main system and put it into the New one and RRR, or I can buy a new CD-ROM? I've just wasted two days already trying to fix these issues.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #126,850
11/20/03 2:13:18 PM
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Stupid question... probably
What does RRR mean?
Reformat, Reinstall??? ???????
Curious owl.
Nightowl >8#
P.S. Norman, CK replied to you on PA.
"The difference between being immature and child-like is that one is what you are, and one is what you choose to be."
Comment by Nightowl {O,O}
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Post #126,854
11/20/03 2:18:56 PM
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RRR the three R's of fixing Windows computers
RRR = Reboot Reformat Reinstall
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #127,014
11/21/03 9:21:51 AM
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Similar to issues I've had:
1) Freezes upon heavy IDE access between two different drives.
2) Freezes upon heavy USB -> drive access (large color scans).
Memtest showed nothing as well. The other two solutions I've considered:
1) Needs two banks of RAM, not one. Apparently there are some issues with the nVidia built-in card conflicting with memory access.
2) Replace the built-in video card with a stand-alone.
Have you actually replaced the memory with the XMS so that you know the solution is good?
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #127,046
11/21/03 10:37:13 AM
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I talked to Shuttle
they reconmended XMS or TwinX memory from Corsair, they said the ValueSelect memory is not certified for use on AMD CPUs or their Motherboard.
I'll get a refund from NewEgg on the ValueSelect and order the XMS and post the results here.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #127,049
11/21/03 10:41:00 AM
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Yo Normy
Are you available today?
I need some things from the net. Can stop by when convenient.
-drl
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Post #127,055
11/21/03 10:55:33 AM
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Really busy today. Father's birthday
Celebating my Son's birthday Saturday (His is actually Monday) and a friend is having a birthday on Sunday. Busy weekend.
Email me what you want and I'll try to get it. I've been busy with college and building this new system so I haven't gotten a chance to burn the SuSE SRC directory to CDRs yet. Sorry.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #127,061
11/21/03 11:02:01 AM
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Re: Really busy today. Father's birthday
Don't need that - need Win2k SP4 on CD. Can you mail it?
-drl
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Post #127,118
11/21/03 3:26:21 PM
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Email me your address
and I'll see what I can do.
Would a day of the week be better for you, or just the weekends?
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #127,167
11/21/03 7:36:47 PM
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Re: Email me your address
I can drive up any time it isn't raining. I'd rather do that because it's a fun ride :) Get to go by the airport and park under the planes for a few, at least until the rentacops run me off...
It's gonna be raining or snowing early in the week and I'm going to Atlanta for N days, N>=7, so I'll email my digits and letters.
-drl
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Post #127,176
11/21/03 8:09:01 PM
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Re: Email me your address
I can drive up any time it isn't raining. I'd rather do that because it's a fun ride :) Get to go by the airport and park under the planes for a few, at least until the rentacops run me off... Hmmmmm I didn't know you liked to play in my neck of the woods, Ross. ;) Nightowl >8# "The difference between being immature and child-like is that one is what you are, and one is what you choose to be."
Comment by Nightowl {O,O}
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Post #126,933
11/20/03 7:57:09 PM
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Wrong memory type
It is Corsair ValueSelect RAM, not certified for the board. D'oh! I clicked on the link that Scott gave, either they sent me the wrong one, or it wasn't checked out when Scott selected it.
Get the Corsair XMS or TwinX series.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #126,939
11/20/03 8:15:47 PM
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Re: Wrong memory type
Will they exchange the wrong memory for the right memory if you send it back?
See if they will do that!!!!
Nightowl >8#
"The difference between being immature and child-like is that one is what you are, and one is what you choose to be."
Comment by Nightowl {O,O}
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Post #126,942
11/20/03 8:19:20 PM
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Corrected $400 Upgrade parts (new thread)
Created as new thread #126941 titled [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=126941|Corrected $400 Upgrade parts]
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #127,057
11/21/03 10:58:16 AM
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Close as they can come to it is this
We actually do not do exchanges, per se. If you the item you purchased is still within the refund warranty <[link|http://www.newegg.com/app/faq_product.asp#27>|http://www.newegg.co...q_product.asp#27>] coverage and you wanted to do an exchange, we would request that you authorize a return for refund by clicking here <[link|https://secure.newegg.com/app/Login.asp>|https://secure.newegg.com/app/Login.asp>] (all returns must be pre-authorized). Then, simply place a new order for the item you desire on our website. Once you have your new Sales Order number, just give us a call or send us an email with the new SO and your RMA (return merchandise authorization) number and we'll waive the restocking fee for you. You may view this as an exchange.
If you have any further questions or concerns, please visit our FAQs <[link|http://www.newegg.com/app/faq.asp>|http://www.newegg.com/app/faq.asp>] page or just drop us a line and we'd be happy to assist you.
Thanks for writing and have a pleasant day. Kindest regards.
So I request a refund for the ValueSelect RAM, place an order for the XMS RAM, and then email or call them with the new SO and the RMA Order and avoid a restocking fee. I'll let everyone know the result. I agree with Gryus here, the cheaper RAM can cause problems.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #127,009
11/21/03 9:10:25 AM
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Might explain a few issues I've been having.
Freezes when the memory is being worked hard. I had thought it was the built-in video card interfering with memory, but now I'm not so sure. Thanks for the info.
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #128,020
11/28/03 6:09:36 PM
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Corsair XMS DDR works like a champ on $400 Computer (new thread)
Created as new thread #128019 titled [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=128019|Corsair XMS DDR works like a champ on $400 Computer]
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #127,080
11/21/03 12:02:54 PM
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For memory, I always go with Crucial.
[link|http://www.crucial.com|http://www.crucial.com]
Cheaper than Newegg, and they have EXCELLENT memory. I've never had problems with their sticks.
I have a red sign on my door. It says "If this sign is blue, you're going too fast."
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Post #126,768
11/19/03 8:37:14 PM
11/19/03 8:38:12 PM
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DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL
Got that error a while ago, right after I made the last post.
Stop 0x00000001 (0x0000045, 0x0000002, 0x00000000, 0xF5C7B7BE)
I had gotten updated drivers from Shuttle, and was doing a Windows Update when the blue screen popped up.
Edit: Restarted and got an error, Windows Error Reporting reports it was an error caused by a Windows Driver, but won't say which one. D'oh!
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
Edited by orion
Nov. 19, 2003, 08:38:12 PM EST
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Post #126,770
11/19/03 9:10:00 PM
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Re: DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL
Windows will say just about anything about an error - by the time the OS is going it's too late if you have mismatched components. Either the memory or the processor is wrong for this motherboard.
-drl
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Post #128,136
11/30/03 6:39:12 AM
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Re: DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL
One of the first things that I learned with my Shuttle was that you MUST install the drivers from the driver CD immediately after installing Windows XP, and that you must install them in the order on the menus.
qts
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Post #128,138
11/30/03 7:02:25 AM
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System restore?
Won't this prevent installing new things unless disabled?
NT - love or shove.
-drl
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Post #128,192
11/30/03 8:51:20 PM
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Hey now
I have a 200Mhz Pentium system running NT 4.0 as a spare system. 6.4 Gig HD, 64M of RAM, named Pegasus. I have a 166Mhz Pentium system with 2G hard drive and 48M of RAM running Windows 98 named Starbuck. Neither of them can run any version of Linux, and OS/2 tends to barf on them.
Now the XP2000+ system with the Shuttle motherboard is named Lazarus0 while my Abit 700Mhz Celeron system is still named Lazarus. It is a likely canidate for a Linux install once I finish moving files over and burning CDRs off of it. Lazarus because I've brought it back from the dead many times. :)
I got parts from my brother and father after upgrading their systems for them, could turn it into yet another system. My brother bought me a wireless LinkSys DSL router, so I can get a wireless LAN card and run it in another room. But that is another project for next year when I get more money. My goal is to have a computer in almost every room of the house. :) But with my limited resources, that is going to be hard to do. :(
I do have a KVM switch in my "war room" in the basement, but it is a mess down there and I have clutter everywhere. I tried cleaning it up, but it just gets cluttered again. I'm a Gemini, I organize things in clutters. :)
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #128,189
11/30/03 8:42:44 PM
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That was not the problem
I did install the drivers right away from the Shuttle CD in the order that they were on the install menu.
Problem turned out to be incompatable DDR RAM, switched ValueSelect for XMS from Corsair and the problems went away.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #125,916
11/16/03 3:04:27 PM
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Re: Building the $400 computer
A person is not an electric eel. All you need to do is discharge yourself on just about anything metal - somewhere for the excess electrons to go - then avoid adding more to yourself by jumping up and scooting across a rug in rubber-soled shoes. Take your shoes and socks off while working on static sensitve equipment. Put the parts on newspaper spread on the floor. You don't have to be paranoid.
-drl
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Post #125,924
11/16/03 5:11:24 PM
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Re: Building the $400 computer
I never worried about thermal goo when building my Athon XP1800 box; I just used whatever came on the bottom of the CoolerMaster fan. Still running 18 months later :)
I tend to leave the power plugged in but switched off, and then earth myself by touching a metal part of the case. Never killed a component yet. Well, not by static anyway :)
Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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