Post #76,857
1/25/03 12:58:06 AM
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battle of verdun all over again in Iraq
[link|http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/01/24/eveningnews/main537928.shtml|http://www.cbsnews.c.../main537928.shtml] If the Pentagon sticks to its current war plan, one day in March the Air Force and Navy will launch between 300 and 400 cruise missiles at targets in Iraq. As CBS News Correspondent David Martin reports, this is more than number that were launched during the entire 40 days of the first Gulf War. launch a missile version of the arty attacks so beloved by ww1 generals. Might work, good luck. Although get there with the mostest fastest falls into this strategy. thanx, bill will work for cash and other incentives [link|http://home.tampabay.rr.com/boxley/resume/Resume.html|skill set]
You think that you can trust the government to look after your rights? ask an Indian
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Post #76,866
1/25/03 4:56:07 AM
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Wow.. I just can't wait to see the Tech Specs on the keen
New. Stuff. All lightweight and titanium and all. Point, click, Zap.
Nice color photos of the innards, contractor's video showing the featurz, weight, sizes - exotic materials, range, explosive size and shape. Microwave surface mount transistors on those shiny gold waveguides.
Those neat camera fotos that end in static -- extra points if it goes down the smokestack without touching the sides -- as it kills a power plant and electricity for the city. All those neat strategic targets which we'll rebuild later -- with the % of their oil-$$ we deem appropriate for them to keep, natch. (Or if that ain't enough, CitiBank will lend them the balance at CC rates)
Can't start modernizing their CC thinking any too early; they're gonna Love Burger King too - don'cha just know? And Bullitt reruns (royalties to RIAA, of course - coin slot in each Tee Vee, I hear - bein built with Arabic labels somewhere in Texas)
Maybe the troops can watch it real-time on their laptops at 1600 x 1200, in color.. and CBS will sorta tie-in so's it can preempt Cheers for a few minutes each night.. to keep us informed and 'tained.
Yep, the excitement is a buildin' - especially with the sit-com plots now so boring: we decidedly Need that Excitement and, we're gonna Get It. (While going to exotic new lands, meeting interesting people and killing them\ufffd \ufffd - Hey.. who'da thunk we could re-use them there slogans from Nam.. over and over!)
My spectrometer sez that the positive ions in the local air seem a bit on the increase -- them'r the ones that make folks soggy, mean and hard to light like. Cause or effect? Not to worry though - lots o' folks are gonna Love US to death, in a few weeks.
I can feel it.
I can feel it..
Dave.
Please stop.
Stop, please.
I can feel it...
Daisycutter, daisycutter, give me your answer, do
I'm half crazy over my love for You
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Post #77,021
1/26/03 1:58:51 AM
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In this case, the cultural damage will be minor.
Iraq is, from what I've seen and heard, pretty much generic Westernized grey.
We won't be introducing much there that we haven't already. That's part of why Iraq isn't on the same team as the Taliban...
----
Whatever
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Post #76,867
1/25/03 5:37:19 AM
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I will be amazed if this plan works.
#1. Everyone over there KNOWS we're on our way.
#2. Given #1, the troops should be dug in deep by now.
#3. With plenty of food, water and ammo to last them.
#4. Which means that this plan wouldn't deny them anything but electricity.
#5. But it would hurt the civilians (unless they're taking precautions, also).
#6. They understand our technology. They won't be chatting on the radios. This will attract bombs. They might not KNOW that all their generals are dead.
This is what you get when you let a bunch of chicken hawks plan a war. Schwarzkopf knew how to fight a war. But then, he wasn't a chicken hawk.
This kind of "thought" seems far to reminiscent of the old British empire.
"We'll sail over there, give them couple good broadsides, show them our strength and the bloody savages will surrender in a day or two."
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Post #76,877
1/25/03 7:33:19 AM
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Does this kind of report give you a hard-on ?
just wondering <grin>
Cheers
Doug
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Post #76,946
1/25/03 4:41:27 PM
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waiting for the other shoe myself
will work for cash and other incentives [link|http://home.tampabay.rr.com/boxley/resume/Resume.html|skill set]
You think that you can trust the government to look after your rights? ask an Indian
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Post #76,882
1/25/03 9:10:44 AM
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It may be Awe-some, but I don't think it'll be a Shock.
No hostilities are going to start until the UN Inspectors (and other foreign nationals) are told to leave. That'll probably take at least 3 days. If there's going to be a major bombing campaign (as opposed to say some covert effort to sneak in and decapitate the leadership), the world and the Iraqi military is going to have plenty of notice. And even if there were a covert attack, I strongly suspect the UN and foreign nationals would be told to leave first. Bush doesn't want foreign captives there.
In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if (during the State of the Union address or the next day or so after) Bush gave Saddam one final 30 day period to cooperate fully or face the consequences. I'd expect an implicit or explicit warning to foreign nationals and the UN would be given in that message.
The minute of the attack (if any) won't be known, but the week will, IMHO. I don't think there's going to be Shock if or when it comes.
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #76,904
1/25/03 11:12:14 AM
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This is nothing like Verdun. It's quality, not quantity.
This is no crude artillery barrage. We've got precision weapons now. We take out their defenses, and where possible, their WMDs as well. We pick off their tanks from afar (as before) with superior range of fire. Then all they have left is troops...
We don't have to kill many enemy soldiers, except maybe the Republican Guard. No one else is willing to die for Saddam. Last time around, their regular army was like the French in WWII. They couldn't surrender fast enough.
The biggest worry is some WMDs might survive, and Saddam might manage to set them off while we're realtively concentrated in the south. The second biggest worry is the logistics of taking so many prisoners.
The trouble with the French is they have no word for "roulons."
CHICKENHAWK! Scourge of clucking hens everywhere!
Victory is the answer. There are no alternatives.
Where's Abdul Rahman Yasin?
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfire...arlowe/index.html]
[link|http://pascal.rockford.com:8888/SSK@jbf~W~x49RjZfyJwplqwurpNmg0PAgM/marlowe//|http://pascal.rockfo...mg0PAgM/marlowe//]
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Post #76,926
1/25/03 1:09:49 PM
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I find the opinions of those with no experience to be amazin
No one else is willing to die for Saddam. I wouldn't die for Bush, but I'd fight to keep invaders out. Last time around, their regular army was like the French in WWII. They couldn't surrender fast enough. Why was that? No, you won't be able to answer. And the answer will reveal why this plan will not have the same results as the previous war. The biggest worry is some WMDs might survive, and Saddam might manage to set them off while we're realtively concentrated in the south. You have NO IDEA what you're talking about. Look up the FIRST use of chemical weapons in a war. Learn how they're stored and deployed. Learn how biological agents are stored and deployed (hint: the word is "vector").
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Post #76,936
1/25/03 2:55:52 PM
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You may not agree with Marlowe...
...but I would not be so quick to dismiss out of hand the tactical projections of a man who has clearly subjected Tom Clancy's entire \ufffduvre to rigorous study and analysis.
cordially,
"Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist."
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Post #76,987
1/25/03 10:23:10 PM
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"Wewease - Mawowe!"
-drl
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Post #76,985
1/25/03 10:05:47 PM
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But would you fight the
freedom fighters trying to "rescue" you?
Seriously though, while the regular (4th largest army in the world) was being fought in Desert Storm, the (ahem) draftee troops couldn't surrender fast enough. (One draftee was an American, iirc).
I don't know if we hit any of the royal guard or not, but I'd expect them to give us a much harder time.
That said, I doubt there'd be much of a fight here. The country is smaller than Texas (iirc). I don't expect any substantial losses (except perhaps from friendly-fire).
In short, I expect a slaughter. (For better or worse.)
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Post #76,986
1/25/03 10:11:55 PM
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Well I know the first casualty
Press freedom.
Oh Marlowe, you aren't worth responding to about the French.
Sorry Si.
-drl
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Post #77,035
1/26/03 9:30:59 AM
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Chemical, biological, what have you artfully omitted?
A better question is... what haven't you artfully omitted?
What's your vector, Victor?
The trouble with the French is they have no word for "roulons."
CHICKENHAWK! Scourge of clucking hens everywhere!
Victory is the answer. There are no alternatives.
Where's Abdul Rahman Yasin?
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfire...arlowe/index.html]
[link|http://pascal.rockford.com:8888/SSK@jbf~W~x49RjZfyJwplqwurpNmg0PAgM/marlowe//|http://pascal.rockfo...mg0PAgM/marlowe//]
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Post #77,036
1/26/03 9:39:28 AM
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Oh, and to help you spurt your distracting tangentials
[link|http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=wmd+delivery-systems+missile&btnG=Google+Search|and incidentally, help people more honest than you to address this issue honestly]
Don't worry overmuch, folks. We'll probably get those SCUDs before they can launch. But there is a risk. Just remember that the risk of not acting is far, far greater.
The trouble with the French is they have no word for "roulons."
CHICKENHAWK! Scourge of clucking hens everywhere!
Victory is the answer. There are no alternatives.
Where's Abdul Rahman Yasin?
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfire...arlowe/index.html]
[link|http://pascal.rockford.com:8888/SSK@jbf~W~x49RjZfyJwplqwurpNmg0PAgM/marlowe//|http://pascal.rockfo...mg0PAgM/marlowe//]
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Post #77,065
1/26/03 2:35:06 PM
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Marlowe replying to Marlowe replying to Marlowe.
Rather than replying to my post because then it would be obvious that he hasn't the slightest clue of what he speaks.
Let's see, "WMD's" seems to mean:
Chemical - Marlowe failed to look up the first usage of such and therefore does not understand the deployment.
Biological - Marlowe failed to look up the means of deployment of such and therefore is fixated upon SCUD systems.
Nuclear - Marlowe is attempting to imply that Saddam has a nuke (more than one nuke?). Well, it's been more than 6 months since Marlowe said Saddam was only 6 months away from getting a nuke.
Those damn UN inspectors MUST be on Saddam's payroll if they haven't found it YET.
Marlowe is focused on SCUDs. Only SCUDs. SCUDs are the ONLY means of deploying these attacks.
Iraq has ties to al Queda!
How did al Queda execute their attacks?
And THAT is the problem with discussing these issues with a sophomore. They lack the mental ability to extrapolate from their claims.
If Iraq DID have ties to al Queda, and al Queda employs suicide bombers, then would not Iraq have access to al Queda suicide bombers?
Isn't one of Bush's claims that Iraq will supply al Queda with "WMD's" to be used by terrorists?
Now, for Marlowe's edification, a single person with a canister of nerve agent can hide just about anywhere. And all it takes to set it off is popping the canister and letting the wind blow it. Sure, the guy doing it will end up dead, but that's what a suicide is.
SCUD's are used for deploying agents IN ADVANCE of your attack or to DENY terrain to the enemy.
When the enemy is INVADING, and you have SUICIDE BOMBERS, the tactics change.
Duh!!!
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Post #77,237
1/27/03 12:35:31 PM
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You actually think there will be massed suicide attacks?
Who the hell is going to be willing to die for Saddam? The people he's been murdering for thirty-odd years? Not on planet Earth. I don't know or care about planet Brandioch.
Who the hell is going to be willing to die to repel a "foreign invader?" The Shi'ites, who've been oppressed by Ba'athist butchers all those years? We're not much more foreign to their point of view than the Baghdad regime is. And we're a lot nicer. The Kurds? Ditto. The Sunnis around Baghdad? By the time we reach them, we'll be moving too fast.
Al Qaeda? We already have experience chasing them from the field of battle. And there are no caves in southern Iraq for them to hide in. And... wait a minute! Are you admitting that Saddam supports al Qaeda?
You're too friggin' stupid to extrapolate your way out of your own silly massed suicide bomber fantasy. It ain't gonna happen. The only real threat is the SCUDs. And only in the first couple of days.
It's a good thing you never went to war. You've got the loser mentality. You spend all your mental energy looking for ways to lose. Of course you'll find them, even if you have to imagine them. I'm glad I never had you by my side in any of the dustups of my youth. It would've been nice to have you on the other side, though.
The trouble with the French is they have no word for "roulons."
CHICKENHAWK! Scourge of clucking hens everywhere!
Victory is the answer. There are no alternatives.
Where's Abdul Rahman Yasin?
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfire...arlowe/index.html]
[link|http://pascal.rockford.com:8888/SSK@jbf~W~x49RjZfyJwplqwurpNmg0PAgM/marlowe//|http://pascal.rockfo...mg0PAgM/marlowe//]
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Post #77,286
1/27/03 5:06:19 PM
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"Massed"? Like the 20 people who hijacked the planes?
You "military experience" consists of reading Sgt. Rock comic books and jacking off. It's a good thing you never went to war. You've got the loser mentality. You spend all your mental energy looking for ways to lose. Fucking aye! Because THAT is the way you PLAN an attack. You look for the WORST the enemy can do and then you NEUTRALIZE it. One guy with a canister of nerve agent can knock out a brigade. Like I said, do your research. Learn what has been done before. Once this is done, ALL the OTHER units will have to go to MOPP 4 and then they'll be great targets for the dug in regular troops. Who the hell is going to be willing to die to repel a "foreign invader?" Whomever is there. The Shi'ites, who've been oppressed by Ba'athist butchers all those years? Would a Jew fight against someone invading the USofA? The Kurds? Any African-Americans who would fight for the USofA? The Sunnis around Baghdad? Any Native Americans who would fight for the USofA? By the time we reach them, we'll be moving too fast. If we are, it is because Saddam does NOT possess the weapons you claim he does. But his possession of those weapons is your "justification" for this invasion. Al Qaeda? We already have experience chasing them from the field of battle. And there are no caves in southern Iraq for them to hide in. And... wait a minute! Are you admitting that Saddam supports al Qaeda? Saddam is only 6 months away for nukes!!! No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that YOU are saying that to "justify" this invasion. But the plans for this invasion seem to be based upon the assumption that NONE of those things exist. Why is that? You're too friggin' stupid to extrapolate your way out of your own silly massed suicide bomber fantasy. It ain't gonna happen. The only real threat is the SCUDs. And only in the first couple of days. I agree, "it ain't gonna happen". But the REASON "it ain't gonna happen" is that THEY AREN'T THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE. SCUD's are a threat? To an ADVANCING army? How? Again, your "justifications" for this invasion: #1. al Queda links #2. chemical weapons #3. biological weapons #4. nukes Yet the PLANS for the invasion take NONE of these into consideration. Because EVERYONE knows that they do NOT exist.
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Post #77,402
1/27/03 9:52:35 PM
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You just don't understand my Gramma..
It isn't about what they can do today! It's about what they might do, if they think as we Know they think and - proceed with these *devious* [however unknown, unproven, fanciful] Plans we have heard so much about.
(Naturally enough, all these production plants are underground, in that matrix of tunnels dug by political prisoners and descendants of the pyramid builders). They are not like Muricans: they are devious untermensch who care little about raising a family, going to the cubicle and -- doing Real Important Work (like - coding a new spam dbase for pop-unders). No, their naked envy drives them to want to destroy thegreatestcountryinnaworld - unless We Stop Them.
Just like.. those Pinko-perfessers, molding youthful minds for.. The Takeover (when those scum weren't actively seducing the tads into their depraved sexual libertine ways, the rest of the time). We had to stop them before they did [whatever it was We Knew They Would Do].
New Jersey and areas around certain Texas-based iron pipe mfgs.: are highly vulnerable to chemical attack! (How could the average citzen tell the change in the smell of the air.. til it's too late?)
Hope this clears up The Danger.
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Post #77,506
1/28/03 9:02:45 AM
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The boogey man will get you!
Kids are afraid of the monsters under the bed and in the closet.
Sometimes, the kids get older without growing up.
They're still afraid of the boogey men.
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Post #76,914
1/25/03 11:39:02 AM
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Personally sick of grinding metal
..and body parts.
I would like to be able to hear my President speak without rushing for the remote to change the channel. I refused to listen to Clinton, and now I refuse to listen to Bush. I could barely listen to BUSH. More than 10 years of not being able to stomach even LISTENING to the CPO.
-drl
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