Ukraine has a very long history of fighting outsiders.

Post #440,988 by Another Scott 2/25/22 1:17:00 PM 2/25/22 1:21:56 PM Reply	Ukraine has a very long history of fighting outsiders. Nobody knows the future, but VVP has a tiger by the tail. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_Insurgent_Army [eta] https://mobile.twitter.com/olgatokariuk/status/1497142166434598912 (via VladDavidzon) Cheers, Scott. Edited by Another Scott Feb. 25, 2022, 01:21:56 PM EST Ukraine has a very long history of fighting outsiders. Nobody knows the future, but VVP has a tiger by the tail. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_Insurgent_Army Cheers, Scott. Collapse All History
Post #440,990 by boxley 2/25/22 1:37:47 PM 2/25/22 1:37:47 PM Reply	"with many cases of collaboration with the German forces" don't hold yer breath on tht group "Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman
Post #440,991 by Another Scott 2/25/22 1:49:26 PM 2/25/22 1:49:26 PM Reply	I was reluctant to cite that, but didn't have time to find something better. Yeah, too many paint Ukraine as being a hotbed of Nazi-ism. It's not. History is complicated. Thanks. Cheers, Scott.
Post #440,996 by CRConrad 2/25/22 9:26:13 PM 2/25/22 9:26:13 PM Reply	You couldn't have found a better way of sounding exactly like... ...a Putin apologist. It's getting harder and harder to accept the constant stream of pro-Trump, pro-Putin, pro-anything that's evil in this world posts from you as "just contrarianism" or "sheer coincidence". One is reminded of the classic Mitchell and Webb sketch... Except, nobody in real life can of course actually be quite that naïve. Occam's Razor suggests it's genuine intent. -- Christian R. Conrad The Man Who Apparently Still Knows Fucking Everything Mail: Same username as at the top left of this post, at iki.fi
Post #440,997 by boxley 2/25/22 9:37:54 PM 2/25/22 9:37:54 PM Reply	nope, putin is entirely wrong and I hope the russian people pull him off his throne pro trump? read me in my posts "Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman
Post #441,004 by CRConrad 2/26/22 7:25:21 AM 2/26/22 7:25:21 AM Reply	Then why the fuck do you sound exactly like his trolls all the time? Are you actually totally fucking stupid, or just stupidly thoughtless? If the later, just fucking simply stop that and start thinking in stead. Your brain is a free resource; the best way to ensure it's engaged before you post is keeping it switched on all the time. Pro Trump? Yeah, that's what far too many of your posts sound exactly like, cher Michel. -- Christian R. Conrad The Man Who Apparently Still Knows Fucking Everything Mail: Same username as at the top left of this post, at iki.fi
Post #441,033 by scoenye 2/28/22 7:47:55 AM 2/28/22 7:47:55 AM Reply	Only ~9 years before Operation Barbarossa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor Stalin tried to subjugate Ukraine by deliberately starving the population. Millions died. That goes a long way toward explaining why the Ukranians were happy to see the Germans arrive in 1941. (But the Nazis did not bother to hide their true intent so in general, that feeling was very brief.)
Post #441,043 by a6l6e6x 2/28/22 10:31:07 PM 2/28/22 10:31:07 PM Reply	You got it! And a lot of people sufferred from communism in other ways too. The Germans screwed up their welcome in a number of ways. Alex "There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge." -- Isaac Asimov
Post #441,109 by a6l6e6x 3/8/22 11:07:15 PM 3/8/22 11:07:15 PM Reply	Here's some related information in Smithsonian magazine. Smithsonian magazine: The 20th-Century History Behind Russia’s Invasion of Ukraine Alex "There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge." -- Isaac Asimov
Post #441,110 by Another Scott 3/9/22 12:05:19 PM 3/9/22 12:05:19 PM Reply	A kinda related thread, on Russia's economy. https://twitter.com/kamilkazani/status/1501360272442896388 Kamil Galeev @kamilkazani Let's discuss Russian economy. Many underestimate its dependency upon technological import. Russia's so deeply integrated into Western technological chains that severing these ties will lead to its collapse. Sanctions are already effective and can be made even more efficient🧵 Basically, the mobsters control the "easy" stuff (oil, gas, mining), while the engineers and nerds run the complex stuff (manufacturing) but have no power and are undercut by the mobsters above them. So they're highly vulnerable to boycotts from the outside. It's pretty long (be sure to expand the "more comments"), but very thought provoking. Cheers, Scott.
Post #441,113 by a6l6e6x 3/9/22 10:36:59 PM 3/9/22 10:36:59 PM Reply	Interesting! Makes sanctions more powerful to bring Russia down. Alex "There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge." -- Isaac Asimov
Post #441,112 by scoenye 3/9/22 10:31:56 PM 3/9/22 10:31:56 PM Reply	Good read. Thank you. Europe will be dealing with the shadow of that conflict for a long time to come. West-Germany dealt with the past, but the rest never did. I do see parallels with what happened internally in Belgium, another one of those places that had always been part of one glorious empire or another, and the antics of part of Flanders'* populace leading up to and during WW II. The basics came down to the economic elites speaking French and the peasants Flemish. Queue some choice fake news about Flemish boys dying in the WW I trenches because their French speaking officers were unable to give them proper orders, and by the time the Germans came around again, there were several legions who saw them as saviors from oppression, and who were more than eager to do their bidding. * For completeness, there was collaboration on the French speaking side as well, but the connection between das Deutsche volk and le people Wallonne was nowhere near as strong as the one to het Vlaamse volk.
Post #440,994 by crazy 2/25/22 4:04:11 PM 2/25/22 4:04:11 PM Reply	You are citing a group of people from 70 years ago They grew up in a much different world. Most of current the Ukrainians grew up under Russian domination. Sure they revolted a bit but the tanks didn't roll in yet. And that other group of bastards was exterminating the Poles at that point. History may be complex but right now it's obvious who's going to simply take what he wants. Remember they were partying in the nightclubs for the last couple of weeks because they have this fatalistic attitude of what will be will be. Well it will be now.
Post #440,995 by Another Scott 2/25/22 5:36:21 PM 2/25/22 5:36:21 PM Reply	They threw off an attempted dictator in 2014. A million in the streets. Thread. https://mobile.twitter.com/StevenBeynon/status/1497223166522970112 They will fight for their country. Cheers, Scott.

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