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New Well... since t'was I who uttered the [oil] generalization
first.. waaay back up there:

I'll concede that - of course! - it isn't *just about oil*. OTOH we do like: cheap; especially cheap nice clean Saudi sweet crude with lots less junk in it we have to refine out, at a co$t. And we do like keeping our own stuff in the ground, safe for when (not if, IMhO) we finally piss-off too many present suppiers / or they piss us off. We like it so much - we have next to be dragged kicking&screaming to even begin any serious development of alternatives (or at least the lip-service to that beginning).

I might even concede a bit of Yttrium re the China package: you can't build YAG lasers w/o it for one. Don't pretend to an encyclop\ufffddic knowledge of all our uses and sources for the (111? now) elements.. but Erbium, Neodymium, Yt and lots of Rare Earths will find increasing demand as we exponentially seek new weapons and other uses along our techno- hi-speed dash into the unknown. (This in a culture in which fewer and fewer have the foggiest what The Periodic Chart might be about) - Hah! transistorized boxes to ameliorate general dumbth? Is that our plan?

Still, back to M.E. - whatever 'favors' we have done for Israel all along obviously are a mix of - partly idealism re its SOLE democratic status amidst fiefdoms - but also as our surrogate presence, thus buffer. Need we debate the fine admixture of a dash of honest principle + Corporations-full of Machiavellian scheming which IS - so-called International Diplomacy (?)

Still too - among the least believable of many National pretenses must be - that the Saudis "are our friends"! It is certainly not clear to the mass of Muricans what that quid is.. for which we offer so much quo: EXCEPT for the highly visible [oil]. And that, mixed with Israel and insoluble One True Religions at perpetual war -- and now explosions on sacred US soil -- is a conundrum which shall soon need much better explanation and justification IMO, if this Admin hopes to stick around beyond the remaining 2 yrs, 8 mos and a few days. Beyond..? - hmmm another impeachment possible, yet?

If we want a thread to get some teeth into, why not take on: what shall We do when China (either from fearfulness of the old men / Old Guard.. of 'progress' away from their core dogma, or other new reasons) DECIDES it is time to take back Taiwan and convert it to a cash cow a la HK -AND- the Taiwanese DECIDE not to go gently into that good night?

And add THAT to the fuzziness above, of our Middle East overall position -- for a Real Problem set to get teeth into.



Ashton

One-front wars are so boring, when you can stumble into Two, don't you think? And we bought that capacity, too - prescience?
New We won't complain about Taiwan.
China represents too big of a market to alienate.

Look at their government and actions, yet we STILL do the "Most-Favored-Nation" status.

     I am NOT a racist. - (mmoffitt) - (93)
         [oil] - the easy, evident, obvious explanation for All. -NT - (Ashton) - (87)
             No its not... - (bepatient) - (86)
                 Define "have". - (Brandioch) - (85)
                     Well its very simple... - (bepatient) - (84)
                         That >IS< risking national security. - (Brandioch) - (83)
                             Sure... - (bepatient) - (82)
                                 Try that without the "you think". - (Brandioch) - (81)
                                     Damn you're funny. - (bepatient) - (80)
                                         Why can't you answer simple questions? - (Brandioch) - (79)
                                             Why do you answer questions with questions? -NT - (bepatient) - (78)
                                                 To highlight your flaws. - (Brandioch) - (77)
                                                     If you are going to continue... - (bepatient) - (14)
                                                         Can you answer the questions? Are you capable of answering? - (Brandioch) - (11)
                                                             Since you seem incapable... - (bepatient) - (10)
                                                                 It's good to see you're staying true to form. - (Brandioch) - (9)
                                                                     Slight variant... - (bepatient) - (8)
                                                                         The name of the country, Bill. Or the resource. That's all. - (Brandioch) - (7)
                                                                             You seem to want me to repeat myself. - (bepatient) - (6)
                                                                                 The name of the country, Bill. Or the resource. That's all. - (Brandioch) - (5)
                                                                                     This space and your mind = blank -NT - (bepatient) - (4)
                                                                                         The name of the country, Bill. Or the resource. That's all. - (Brandioch) - (3)
                                                                                             It's getting tiresome. :-( Perhaps - (Another Scott) - (2)
                                                                                                 Yes it is... - (bepatient) - (1)
                                                                                                     The name of the country, Bill. Or the resource. That's all. - (Brandioch)
                                                         Science says you're wasting your time. - (marlowe) - (1)
                                                             Bill + Marlowe. - (Brandioch)
                                                     Please be realistic - (Steven A S) - (61)
                                                         Perhaps you can narrow the field? - (Brandioch) - (60)
                                                             Swing and a miss... - (bepatient) - (59)
                                                                 Just tell me the name of the country, Bill. - (Brandioch) - (58)
                                                                     Count China on the following link... - (bepatient) - (57)
                                                                         And you go down in flames. - (Brandioch) - (56)
                                                                             Ahh.. - (bepatient) - (51)
                                                                                 Cry about it. But you know I'm right. - (Brandioch) - (50)
                                                                                     I know of no such thing. - (bepatient) - (49)
                                                                                         Well... since t'was I who uttered the [oil] generalization - (Ashton) - (1)
                                                                                             We won't complain about Taiwan. - (Brandioch)
                                                                                         There's a LOT you don't know, Bill. - (Brandioch) - (46)
                                                                                             A perfect display of your cluelessness.... - (bepatient) - (45)
                                                                                                 WTF? - (Brandioch) - (44)
                                                                                                     Re: WTF? (planet are you on) - (bepatient) - (43)
                                                                                                         It's called "Earth". You might want to visit sometime. - (Brandioch) - (42)
                                                                                                             Re: Price of crude oil. - (a6l6e6x) - (1)
                                                                                                                 That's a "clue"? - (Brandioch)
                                                                                                             Wow...thats deep... - (bepatient) - (39)
                                                                                                                 Do you not know how to read? - (Brandioch) - (38)
                                                                                                                     I don't mean to pry... - (bepatient) - (37)
                                                                                                                         I'll even give you the format, Bill "strawman" Patient. - (Brandioch) - (36)
                                                                                                                             Wow..thats deep sir. - (bepatient) - (35)
                                                                                                                                 Strawman strikes again. - (Brandioch)
                                                                                                                                 Simple Question. - (mmoffitt) - (33)
                                                                                                                                     Simple Answer, perhaps - (rsf) - (1)
                                                                                                                                         But isn't that still about the oil? - (Brandioch)
                                                                                                                                     Simple answer... - (bepatient) - (30)
                                                                                                                                         Ummm, that wasn't "simple". - (Brandioch) - (21)
                                                                                                                                             But you seem to be. - (bepatient) - (18)
                                                                                                                                                 The country is Uzbekistan. - (Brandioch) - (17)
                                                                                                                                                     Congratulations.... - (bepatient) - (13)
                                                                                                                                                         Like I said, "strawman". - (Brandioch) - (12)
                                                                                                                                                             Reading ability? - (bepatient) - (11)
                                                                                                                                                                 You concede? - (mmoffitt) - (3)
                                                                                                                                                                     Dude...sure...why not. - (bepatient) - (2)
                                                                                                                                                                         Saved to File, Burned on CD. Thanks -NT - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                                                                                                                                                                             Anytime ;-) -NT - (bepatient)
                                                                                                                                                                 Protocol and courtesy. - (Brandioch) - (6)
                                                                                                                                                                     You follow neither. - (bepatient) - (5)
                                                                                                                                                                         And when it falls to ME to explain courtesy...... - (Brandioch) - (4)
                                                                                                                                                                             Pardon me.. - (bepatient) - (3)
                                                                                                                                                                                 So, you admit you know nothing about the mid-east. - (Brandioch) - (2)
                                                                                                                                                                                     Funny -NT - (bepatient) - (1)
                                                                                                                                                                                         This thread is eternal, immortal and knows where you live. -NT - (pwhysall)
                                                                                                                                                     Re: The country is Uzbekistan. - (Arkadiy) - (2)
                                                                                                                                                         Perhaps, tovarish, only because you know them better. -NT - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                                                                                                                                                             Da. -NT - (Brandioch)
                                                                                                                                             Ex-Prez Carter: US aid to Israel ~ $10/million / day! -NT - (a6l6e6x) - (1)
                                                                                                                                                 How much a day is a surrogate 'US Presence' worth? - (Ashton)
                                                                                                                                         you forgot our good friends, Turkey secular muslim nation -NT - (boxley) - (7)
                                                                                                                                             With lots of support for us too. The Mid-East is NOT populat - (Brandioch) - (6)
                                                                                                                                                 Well the issue of how the current situation got started - (boxley) - (5)
                                                                                                                                                     Do you mean to say that, - (Ashton) - (4)
                                                                                                                                                         no, what comes around goes around - (boxley) - (3)
                                                                                                                                                             Thou sayest. I agree(est). Sad, ain't it..*every time* too. -NT - (Ashton)
                                                                                                                                                             Yup. - (Brandioch) - (1)
                                                                                                                                                                 Yabut.. ________Can That be Good for Bizness ?? - (Ashton)
                                                                             Mica is a strategic mineral. - (Another Scott) - (3)
                                                                                 We also have "strategic" helium reserves. - (Brandioch) - (2)
                                                                                     You keep forgetting... - (bepatient) - (1)
                                                                                         You keep claiming that. - (Brandioch)
         Ridiculous (got it right this time) - (bepatient) - (4)
             Put down your crack pipe. - (mmoffitt) - (3)
                 On demand air charter. - (bepatient) - (2)
                     In support - (Mike)
                     Spin, Spin, Spin. - (mmoffitt)

Give me someone I can vote for is all I ask.
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