Post #267,645
9/15/06 12:10:41 PM
9/15/06 12:19:53 PM
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Diebold rebuts Princeton study
Diebold Election Systems Response to the Princeton University AccuVote-TS Analysis
The following statement may be attributed to Dave Byrd, President, Diebold Election Systems.
September 13, 2006 \ufffd \ufffdThree people from the Center for Information Technology Policy and Department of Computer Science at Princeton University today released a study of a Diebold Election Systems AccuVote-TS unit they received from an undisclosed source. The unit has security software that was two generations old, and to our knowledge, is not used anywhere in the country. Normal security procedures were ignored. Numbered security tape, 18 enclosure screws and numbered security tags were destroyed or missing so that the researchers could get inside the unit. A virus was introduced to a machine that is never attached to a network.\ufffd
\ufffdBy any standard - academic or common sense - the study is unrealistic and inaccurate.\ufffd
\ufffdThe current generation AccuVote-TS software \ufffd software that is used today on AccuVote-TS units in the United States - features the most advanced security features, including Advanced Encryption Standard 128 bit data encryption, Digitally Signed memory card data, Secure Socket Layer (SSL) data encryption for transmitted results, dynamic passwords, and more.\ufffd
\ufffdThese touch screen voting stations are stand-alone units that are never networked together and contain their own individual digitally signed memory cards.\ufffd
\ufffdIn addition to this extensive security, the report all but ignores physical security and election procedures. Every local jurisdiction secures its voting machines - every voting machine, not just electronic machines. Electronic machines are secured with security tape and numbered security seals that would reveal any sign of tampering.\ufffd
\ufffdDiebold strongly disagrees with the conclusion of the Princeton report. Secure voting equipment, proper procedures and adequate testing assure an accurate voting process that has been confirmed through numerous, stringent accuracy tests and third party security analysis.\ufffd
\ufffdEvery voter in every local jurisdiction that uses the AccuVote-TS should feel secure knowing that their vote will count on Election Day.\ufffd
[link|http://newsblogs.chicagotribune.com/news_theswamp/2006/09/diebold_stands_.html|source] There is a difference between discoverable tampering, and correctable tampering. If after the election the judges look at a machine and discover that it was tampered with (that is screws missing, or the tape is damaged), what will they do? How can they count that votes of the thousand honest people who voted on that machine without counting any fraudulant votes? These machines are connected to the Internet, a feature touted by Diebold. Diebold can remotely upgrade the software on their voting gear. That ability implies the systems are networked, and we all know how easily malicious code can be introduced to an open machine. A paper record is way better than what we're getting now. Edit: went out to find links to the Princeton study: [link|http://itpolicy.princeton.edu/voting/|http://itpolicy.princeton.edu/voting/] [link|http://itpolicy.princeton.edu/voting/ts-paper.pdf|http://itpolicy.princeton.edu/voting/ts-paper.pdf] [link|http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwWP-N1HqT0|http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwWP-N1HqT0] lincoln
"Chicago to my mind was the only place to be. ... I above all liked the city because it was filled with people all a-bustle, and the clatter of hooves and carriages, and with delivery wagons and drays and peddlers and the boom and clank of freight trains. And when those black clouds came sailing in from the west, pouring thunderstorms upon us so that you couldn't hear the cries or curses of humankind, I liked that best of all. Chicago could stand up to the worst God had to offer. I understood why it was built--a place for trade, of course, with railroads and ships and so on, but mostly to give all of us a magnitude of defiance that is not provided by one house on the plains. And the plains is where those storms come from." -- E.L. Doctorow
Never apply a Star Trek solution to a Babylon 5 problem.
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the United States.
[link|mailto:bconnors@ev1.net|contact me]
Edited by lincoln
Sept. 15, 2006, 12:18:10 PM EDT
Edited by lincoln
Sept. 15, 2006, 12:19:53 PM EDT
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Post #267,663
9/15/06 2:00:37 PM
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Wow, these guys are incredible
"A virus was introduced to a machine that is never attached to a network."
Sometime afterward...
"AccuVote-TS units in the United States - features the most advanced security features, including Advanced Encryption Standard 128 bit data encryption, Digitally Signed memory card data, Secure Socket Layer (SSL) data encryption for transmitted results"
How is it supposed to use SSL to transmit results if it's "never attached to a network"?
Do they think we're stoopid?
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #267,664
9/15/06 2:22:20 PM
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Maybe
but his other points are valid. Ignoring other aspects of security and claiming that the one simple gaff on his part invalidates his response is, essentially, the same as agreeing with Lewis A Mettler Esq. and his point of view regarding secretaries and source code.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
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Post #267,672
9/15/06 3:05:35 PM
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If he doesn't know what a network is
and how his product uses one I have a hard time taking the rest of his statements about that product at face value. This is not like LAM.E because LAME.S' ignorance of open source and how it works invalidates what he says about the secretary.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #267,676
9/15/06 4:03:59 PM
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Probably deception rather than ignorance
Not being on a network is so wrong that someone would have caught his statement and corrected it before it was released. This it is lying PR of the low kind is a more likely and plausible explanation. It is only necessary to outspend the truth to fool enough people.
Which still means the rest of the statement is suspect.
Matthew Greet
Choose Life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family. Choose a fucking big television, choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol, and dental insurance. Choose fixed interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisurewear and matching luggage. Choose DIY and wondering who the fuck you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing, spirit-crushing game shows, stuffing fucking junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing your last in a miserable home, nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, fucked up brats you spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life... But why would I want to do a thing like that? I chose not to choose life. I chose somethin' else. And the reasons? There are no reasons. Who needs reasons when you've got heroin?
- Mark Renton, Trainspotting.
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Post #267,684
9/15/06 5:01:09 PM
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Don't ascribe to conspiracy that which can be explained by
incompetence....
In short, I doubt the spokesdude knows his serial ports from his cereal ports....
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #267,733
9/16/06 5:37:28 AM
9/16/06 5:50:53 AM
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Lying in PR isn't much of a conspiracy
There is little attempt to conceal the damning truth as the real damning truth is that there is no audit. This kind of lie can slip with little incident as the people who'd notice are already being ignored by the politicians. The PR is just to drown out a bad report before enough uncontested, bad reports achieve a critical mass.
Matthew Greet
Choose Life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family. Choose a fucking big television, choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol, and dental insurance. Choose fixed interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisurewear and matching luggage. Choose DIY and wondering who the fuck you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing, spirit-crushing game shows, stuffing fucking junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing your last in a miserable home, nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, fucked up brats you spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life... But why would I want to do a thing like that? I chose not to choose life. I chose somethin' else. And the reasons? There are no reasons. Who needs reasons when you've got heroin?
- Mark Renton, Trainspotting.
Edited by warmachine
Sept. 16, 2006, 05:50:53 AM EDT
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Post #267,678
9/15/06 4:14:57 PM
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Addressing security
his points about physical security were extremely valid. And if Princeton ignored or violated any of those, their results must be invalidated. Thats the point. Regardless of the machine being on the internet. If they had to crack the box (physically) to break security, their results are invalid.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
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Post #267,729
9/16/06 1:58:42 AM
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I don't give a damn what he says unless it has
an auditable paper tape and the voter can view what gets printed on the tape when he pulls the lever.
[link|http://www.blackbagops.net|Black Bag Operations Log]
[link|http://www.objectiveclips.com|Artificial Intelligence]
[link|http://www.badpage.info/seaside/html|Scrutinizer]
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Post #267,753
9/16/06 3:53:13 PM
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Thats fine with me.
Problem is, I don't make the rules.
Democrats are, however, part of this process in equal numbers...so if these machines are going to be used in a vast right wing conspiricy to steal elections...then both parties can share equally in the blame.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
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Post #267,789
9/16/06 10:06:34 PM
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Explain that statement please
>Democrats are, however, part of this process in equal numbers.
I don't follow. I would note that the election commissioners in both rigged states in the last 2 stolen elections were openly and unabashedly republican.
[link|http://www.blackbagops.net|Black Bag Operations Log]
[link|http://www.objectiveclips.com|Artificial Intelligence]
[link|http://www.badpage.info/seaside/html|Scrutinizer]
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Post #267,792
9/16/06 10:47:37 PM
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Of course
its not possible that it was a loss, fair and square.
And there aren't any democrats anywhere in the process of overseeing elections...or that could contest decisions being made.
Much easier to whine about it later.
Quite simply, as with the thread regarding terrorists, the point is simple. We are not capable of keeping secrets of that magnitude.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
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Post #267,807
9/17/06 5:52:42 AM
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So then, like the Holocaust
- all those roadblocks in Dade, the bogus 'ex-cons-lists' were just the fanciful musings of disgruntled vast-left-wing-Conspirators. Too.
Let me guess here: this is something like your idea of 'keeping an open mind' (??)
If so, there's always the danger that a mind may be so open that there's no keeping anything in or out of it - I've heard.
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Post #267,864
9/17/06 10:08:01 PM
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Cute
And the voting of 100+% of registered in Dem strongholds used to carry states like PA and reports of disenfrachised Republocrats in metro areas equally didn't happen.
No...what is being held here is a lack of tinfoil hattery.
And if the other side could pick someone worth voting for...we would have to worry about "irregularities" in one state. Because if you look hard enough, with as screwed up as our election process is, you will find vast EITHER wing conspiricies.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
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Post #267,839
9/17/06 1:36:55 PM
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curiouser and curiouser....
I recall arguments regarding the 2000 election (and 2004...and now 2006)...particularly references back to the Chicago elections of yesteryear.
And I can't help but wonder...."And there aren't any republicans anywhere in the process of overseeing elections...or that could contest decisions being made."?
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Post #267,848
9/17/06 3:07:17 PM
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Argument goes both ways...but the real issue
is "is it a conspiricy to steal elections".
To which I continue to respond...we're not good enough at keeping secrets.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
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Post #267,857
9/17/06 6:03:52 PM
9/17/06 10:20:06 PM
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Based on reports
no - I don't buy that Dems lost Ohio fair and square. I don't believe they lost Florida fair and square either. There are WAY too many irregularities in there.
I am quite amazed at how well the entire party goose-steps in perfect time to the daily talking points memos. The level of coordination is really quite remarkable. So, based on that, I don't find the idea unlikely that a common goal of subverting elections was disseminated and individuals worked at it each in their own way.
I think the behavior chronicled [link|http://www.seattleweekly.com/news/0501/050105_news_recount.php|here] more or less backs up my opinion. The reps worked like a team. They had strategies and daily group prayer in their own war room/lounge at the recount. Does this sound like people who just want to count ballots, or rig the election?
Based on this and similar anecdotes - I do not consider them to be fair minded folks who respect the will of the people. "Culture of corruption" fits.
[link|http://www.blackbagops.net|Black Bag Operations Log]
[link|http://www.objectiveclips.com|Artificial Intelligence]
[link|http://www.badpage.info/seaside/html|Scrutinizer]
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Post #267,914
9/18/06 10:16:02 AM
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I think they've discovered YGBM tech... (Humor, Vinge)
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