Post #266,384
8/30/06 3:29:15 PM
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Soldiers & payday loans
"A new Pentagon report endorses the idea of setting a 36-percent maximum interest rate on loans for military members because predatory lenders are targeting young service members and their families."
[link|http://www.navytimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-2017635.php|http://www.navytimes...92925-2017635.php]
36 percent isn't somewhat predatory?
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Post #266,386
8/30/06 3:53:33 PM
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We had a line of those shops shut down up here in
Western Canada because of usurious rates. Turned out that some folks were paying app. 1500% interest once all the charges etc. were calculated. They got shut down and had all their assets revoked.
... the main point being that in that "industry" 36% is considered the height of reasonable.
It's a consequence of deregulating the banking industry.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #266,391
8/30/06 5:16:05 PM
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So much for looking after their own.
I would have thought any military would use favourable interests out of espirit de corps but mostly as it's in the service's interests to avoid individual, financial distractions. It's not as if they don't know where they are or can't deduct from source.
Military services are not known for their compassion but they are known for policy through bureaucracy. 36% is actually policy? Does the Pentagon hate their men or something?
Matthew Greet
Choose Life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family. Choose a fucking big television, choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol, and dental insurance. Choose fixed interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisurewear and matching luggage. Choose DIY and wondering who the fuck you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing, spirit-crushing game shows, stuffing fucking junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing your last in a miserable home, nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, fucked up brats you spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life... But why would I want to do a thing like that? I chose not to choose life. I chose somethin' else. And the reasons? There are no reasons. Who needs reasons when you've got heroin?
- Mark Renton, Trainspotting.
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Post #266,398
8/30/06 7:14:28 PM
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Not hate, I wot -
I doubt that they think of 'market forces' in other than some variant of ~
Vulture- 'capitalism' is about - 'the sheep shall be sheared' (and it's really OK to focus on the unsuspecting.) Deregulation is about - expanding the means by which the sheep may be more slyly sheared; allegedly, this is good for 'business'.
But only if one defines business as - an asocial, amoral vocation, geared to test the limits of all laws, in its pursuit of financial advantage by all means discoverable.
(So how could the military object to the mindset of a majority of those who fund it? Lavishly.)
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Post #266,399
8/30/06 7:59:57 PM
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This is not about the military charging those interest rates
There are a bunch of little lending shops called things like Payday Loans and Instacash on corners that will lend you a few hundred bucks until your next payday for a fee. All you have to show them is a few stubs showing you can cover it when your checque arrives and they'll lend you the money. What is being proposed is that those shops have to "only" charge a maximum of 36% when the pay stub in question comes from the military, as opposed to the several hundred percent APR that they apply to most people for borrowing money for a few days (eg- typical terms would be borrow a hundred bucks and pay back a hundred and three bucks four days later -- do the math to find out what the APR of that loan is).
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #266,413
8/31/06 8:44:54 AM
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My mistake
Matthew Greet
Choose Life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family. Choose a fucking big television, choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol, and dental insurance. Choose fixed interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisurewear and matching luggage. Choose DIY and wondering who the fuck you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing, spirit-crushing game shows, stuffing fucking junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing your last in a miserable home, nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, fucked up brats you spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life... But why would I want to do a thing like that? I chose not to choose life. I chose somethin' else. And the reasons? There are no reasons. Who needs reasons when you've got heroin?
- Mark Renton, Trainspotting.
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Post #266,442
8/31/06 12:42:44 PM
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Or the bank overdraft charge
of $33 for a $2.00 od, which is paid off immediately on the next clock cycle when the payroll check is credited. What't the APR for a "loan" that lasts only 1 second?
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. (Herm Albright)
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Post #266,443
8/31/06 12:47:01 PM
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Not how these shops work, at least in Canada
The longer the wait for your paycheque, the more you have to pay, so it is an interest rate, not a od charge sort of deal.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #266,406
8/30/06 8:44:40 PM
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well when I was in the Royal Navy
many eons ago a 2 quid loan till payday was repaid at 2.25 quid on payday. What is that interest rate? No, it wasnt from the purser or postal savings bank. They wouldnt loan people like me a dime.
thanx,
bill
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 50 years. meep
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Post #266,408
8/30/06 8:52:38 PM
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Give 'em government credit cards instead
Neocons - down to the proto-Neocon Reaganists, are all about usury.
Why not codify it?
6 for 5 weekly, the traditional loanshark rate, and make debt payable in additional enlistment time. Hell, then we'd need no draft, and recruiters would be able to meet their quotas by just handing out cards to high-school students.
Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
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Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
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Post #266,484
8/31/06 3:55:14 PM
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'Finding Machiavelli' Award
But we have that already, and not just for them lucky sojers Defending the Freedom to Usurificate all over -
Notice how all the CC Cos. have been persistently ratcheting up their <euphemism alert> Late Fees?
Now the fact that (when running any balance) you are already in the Usury-land of a few short decades ago, via just basic payment 'interest' -- why is it that, increasing their interest take (by Not paying on the Principal, for another month, say) -- now merits these new $30-plus Fees, ever ascending ??
Only a Repo/MBA can construct an answer, of course.
Well see.. if we don't hear from 'them' at least exactly-monthly, why.. why.. how do we know they aren't joining the bank's Executives in the Caymans? Huh?? Maybe they've, er {Skip}ped!
But the Market Is Correcting cha cha -- I note that some of those millions of solicitations now speak of waiving late fees (some number of times, during a year.)
Just ramp up the distractions - works every time.
(En fin: as we both know: the FIX is IN waay too deep, shrouded in way-too-many conceptual absurdities-within-bafflegab - to expect 'reform'. And many cannot Add.)
Decimation? might do it. Stay tuned to your CONELRAD station.
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Post #266,486
8/31/06 4:34:22 PM
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Re: 'Finding Machiavelli' Award
Ashton says:
>>> Notice how all the CC Cos. have been persistently ratcheting up their <euphemism alert> Late Fees?
They say:
"...there is a good reason for the fees they charge.
"It's to encourage people to pay their bills the way they said they would in their contract, to encourage good financial management," said Nessa Feddis, senior federal counsel for the American Bankers Association. "There has to be some onus on the cardholder, some responsibility to manage their finances."
[link|http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A10361-2005Mar5?language=printer|http://www.washingto...?language=printer]
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Post #266,509
8/31/06 6:54:48 PM
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s/a/g
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 50 years. meep
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Post #266,567
9/1/06 6:38:17 PM
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Will keep last two \ufffds in mind..
According to R.K. Hammer Investment Bankers, a California credit card consulting firm, banks collected $14.8 billion in penalty fees last year, or 10.9 percent of revenue, up from $10.7 billion, or 9 percent of revenue, in 2002, the first year the firm began to track penalty fees.
The way the fees are now imposed, "people would be better off if they stopped paying" once they get in over their heads, said T. Bentley Leonard, a North Carolina bankruptcy attorney . Once you stop paying, creditors write off the debt and sell it to a debt collector. "They may harass you, but your balance doesn't keep rising. That's the irony." Scumm.. practicing Vulture Capitalism to the limits you can juuust get away with - turns every such practitioner into Scum. And we teach cheeldrun to look at the world that way. Not even the capacity for shame exists among Suits, today. Bring on the bombers - As to the Mall-rats unable to delay gratification / not the legions of abandoned single parents (with bills for partner's toys, left also to pay) / - OK.. make that lots of Smart-bombs, then - -
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Post #266,453
8/31/06 1:56:29 PM
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The military does give loans....
but since they have 0% interest, they're really advance pay. But they're only given in a couple circumstances such as:
- when you are moving, you can get some advance pay, which is then taken out of your subsequent paychecks over a set amount of time
- when you're going on a long deployment, you can get all of your pay in advance. If you're wise and invest, it's a good deal (0% loan), but then you have NO PAY coming in, because you already got it. I never did this, because I felt it was better to leave my pay alone - "the paymaster is always quick to get back overpay, but slow to correct underpay".
Some Navy pay stories:
- We got one guy 3 days before we went to sea. He was supposed to be on another ship, but we needed another guy, so.... Anyway, when we got back, his pay was all screwed up, and the pay people were slow at fixing it. Our XO finally fixed the issue by saying (cleaned up version) "If you guys don't pay him NOW, I'm coming over this instant and making you. You can straighten out the details later."
- Navy wife quote: "How can I be out of money? I've got checks in my checkbook."
- Another wife needed assistance because her husband got all his pay in advance (so nothing more coming in for 3 months), but thought it was only partial, so she went out and bought a new car - and then had no money for mortgage, groceries, etc.
- Then there's the officer who met a girl three weeks before deployment, and then gave her a checkbook full of signed, blank checks, so she could pay his bills....and she paid each one, and nothing more.
So yes, many in the military aren't smart about money, but neither are many other, otherwise intelligent people - we're already hearing horror stories as the housing bubble collapses. And there are plenty of pay day loan places in the SFBA, and there's no longer any significant military presence.
--Tony
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Post #266,455
8/31/06 2:15:46 PM
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I must have missed something
Then there's the officer who met a girl three weeks before deployment, and then gave her a checkbook full of signed, blank checks, so she could pay his bills....and she paid each one, and nothing more. Isn't that exactly what he wanted her to do? ===
Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
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Post #266,458
8/31/06 2:27:29 PM
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Yes, and...
...I think the point is that sometimes, people who are stupid with their money luck out. As this misguided officer did.
-YendorMike
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Benjamin Franklin, 1759 Historical Review of Pennsylvania
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Post #266,462
8/31/06 2:32:40 PM
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Check
"I'm not cynical, I'm a realist. Is it my fault the world sucks?"
No, not my line, but I like it.
===
Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
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Post #266,483
8/31/06 3:52:51 PM
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I spent many years in Army Finance
and at least two years at the pay complaints counter.
And trying to convince soldiers that it was an ADVANCE pay that had to be collect from the next paycheck(s) was sometimes quite difficult.
Best "war story" .. We had a Major (O-4) and a Specialist (E-4) with the same name and MI (eg Ronald M McDonald) and the same SSN expect for two digits switched in last 4 (eg 123-45-6789 vs 123-45-6879) SPC made a pay change of bank and it was processed against the MAJ account. SPC loved the raise, until we had to take it back.
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. (Herm Albright)
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