Post #233,632
11/11/05 7:08:32 PM
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What's the death rate of BET employees?
Compare it to the Army.
Add in crippling, dis-membering, etc.
I'd say a case could be made that dangerous occupations are barred.
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Post #233,647
11/11/05 8:29:26 PM
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Black helicopters on way from Ft. Dix to Barry's house.
Alex
The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #233,669
11/11/05 9:57:31 PM
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So no police, fire and first responders either?
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,730
11/12/05 8:48:32 AM
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Unlikely
Bomb squad? Out.
Other than that, maybe.
Can we come up with the number of police officers in the country,
and then figure out the percentage of them that were killed or maimed
in a violent fashion. Falling dead of a heart attack while doing
crowd control does not count.
Then compare it against the number of soldiers in Iraq as a percentage
of the armed forces who have had the same thing happen.
It would probably also be good to break it down in age groups. Lot more
younger inexperienced people die than older more cautious people, which
make them ripe for manipulation.
How about we look at it another way?
It seems pretty universal in this country that alchohol consumption is
not legal until age 21. Why is that? Could it be because people under
that age are not deemed mature enough to make rational decisions about
alchohol consumption? It can be a life or death decision, and combined
with cars can impact others, which is pretty serious, so it is reasonable.
Yet we feel they are capable making the decision to join the Army, taking
into account the various pros and cons? Bullshit.
Recruiters brainwash kids. That is their job. They lie, they overpromise,
they ignore the real danger possibilities, they glorify the video game
killing aspect of it. They push the patiotic duty aspect, conveniently
ignoring that fact we are at war based on a pile of lies.
Welcome to 1984.
The people in the schools know this. The parents know this. They consider
it their responsibility to protect the kids as long as possible.
Also, keep in mind, this is not simply a matter of "allowing them in".
They want personal information about the kids. A lot.
[link|http://www.leavemychildalone.org/|http://www.leavemychildalone.org/]
Did you know...
... that the notorious No Child Left Behind Act includes a sneaky
section that requires high schools to turn over private information
on students to military recruiters?
And that the Pentagon has created an illegal database of 30 million
16-25 year-olds, including names, addresses, email addresses, cell
phone numbers, ethnicities, social security numbers, extracurricular
activities, and areas of study?
[link|http://www.leavemychildalone.org/index.cfm?event=showContent&contentid=37|http://www.leavemych...tent&contentid=37]
If you, as a parent, would welcome the recruiter's call, guess what?
CALL THEM!
They are happy to hear from you.
But don't pretend that the military is anything like any other job,
including 1st responders, or that are are only want equal access that
other organizations get. It is a smoke screen, and you are smarter
than that, at least I think you are.
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Post #233,749
11/12/05 10:50:42 AM
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Oh dear
I'm SO OFFENDED (not)
You are old enough to have had to register for selective service so the evil gov could keep track of every single eligible soldier.
Automate it and some mother builds a website.
Please stop pretending like this shit is new.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,793
11/12/05 5:04:05 PM
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There you go again
</Reagan>
You addressed nothing of what I said.
Nothing!
You did the standard "It's always been this way, so why would you bother reacting" response. Words are a bit different, but not much.
Your other standard respone is: The other party is just as bad, so who cares what this one is doing.
If I'd never met you, I'd think you were a variation on the Marlow-bot.
Why do you refuse to engage in any disussion that goes beyond sloganeering?
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Post #233,811
11/12/05 7:55:30 PM
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I have in several posts
And in many fashions.
First, you...YOU...are deciding for others what YOU think is best for them.
Pumping gas is >safe< so you can do that, fry cook also..but soldiering is DANGEROUS so we should keep you from it. The CHEELDRUN cannot decide.
And PLEASE GOD don't use the idiotic alcohol laws in this country to defend this idiocy.
And please tell me more about this ILLEGAL DATABASE that is the EXACT SAME THING as selective service. Maybe you don't remember what you sent in..or the fact that big government was tracking your ass...cause they tracked mine across 2 continents (and I didn't tell them I was there).
But its really much, much simpler than that. YOU want to decide what is best for THEM. Because they obviously can't decide for themselves. Those EVIL RECRUITERS use evil techniques to sucker them in.
So you feel comfortable making that decision for them.
Sorry pal. That dog don't hunt with me.
If ANY employer is allowed on campus, then the military recruiters must be allowed also.
Period.
Any other result is simple discrimination, no less evil than Rosa had to face.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,812
11/12/05 7:59:02 PM
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Fine
The second you can quit from the military the way you can quit from a job, then you can treat them on equal footing.
Until then, I call bullshit.
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Post #233,814
11/12/05 8:01:11 PM
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Until then
you feel perfectly comfortable telling people what they can and cannot do with their life.
Back of the bus for you. The front seats are for the "smart people".
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,854
11/13/05 12:53:30 AM
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In HS, they aren't 'people'; they are CHILDREN.
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Post #233,857
11/13/05 1:09:08 AM
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Actually, no
They are cannon fodder.
But BeeP doesn't mind.
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Post #233,867
11/13/05 10:32:27 AM
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Nice ad-hom
But they cannot sign until they are legal adults.
But thats ok, we have people all to willing to make decisions for them and take potential opportunities away from them.
We're so lucky that way.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,870
11/13/05 10:50:36 AM
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While they can't sign until adults
you are perfectly happy requiring high schools to send personal information (that no other recruiting entity gets, don't bother giving me that crap about equal access) to the military.
And then for the military to contact them in a continous barrage.
And for them to ignore the parents of kids who say stop calling if there is a hint that the kids was receptive (plenty of examples if you care to google).
So while the day of signing might wait until 18, the thought process is finely influenced for long before then.
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Post #233,882
11/13/05 11:56:48 AM
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What I've said
is that it is NO DIFFERENT TODAY than at any other time. Some website gets you all in a fluff and you ignore the reality that has always been there because the >now< supports your prejudice.
I can find supporting positions for ANYTHING on the web if "I care to Google".
My position is simple. If McDonalds can recruit on a high school campus then the armed forces should have the same ability.
You want to make this bigger than that, enjoy yourself.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,946
11/13/05 9:06:53 PM
11/13/05 9:32:59 PM
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McDonald's doesn't train kids to kill or be killed
A kid can work at Mickey D's and quit if he/she wants to. You can't quit the military, no siree. You are in for your hitch, if you make it out alive.
Big difference. That has been the point all along, Bill!
SF wants the kids to go to either college or job training. What is wrong with that? If they change their minds later, so be it. But at least let these kids get a chance to make something of their lives. It's all about vocation. If someone feels the call to be in the military, by all means, follow that call. Most kids have no idea what they want to do with their lives. And LIVE is the operative word here.
Were we not in a war, this would not be such a hot issue, but, as it stands, the people of San Francisco obviously feel it is predatory to recruit in high schools. I agree. The kids are too young and inexperienced. Training is minimal at best and then they are shipped to combat. Good luck!
Hell, even the experienced soldiers are dying! War is war! Can you blame these people for wanting to preserve a natural resource...their young people?
I just want to leave you with one thought. Why is it that only four of the 535 members of Congress have children in the military; only one, Sen. Tim Johnson, D-S.D., has a child who fought in Iraq?
Peace,
Amy
"It's never too late to be who you might have been." ~ George Eliot
Edited by imqwerky
Nov. 13, 2005, 09:32:21 PM EST
Edited by imqwerky
Nov. 13, 2005, 09:32:59 PM EST
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Post #233,948
11/13/05 9:10:08 PM
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just blow the wrong gender and instant discharge
that pig wont fly
thanx,
bill
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #233,958
11/13/05 9:45:18 PM
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pun intended?
Darrell Spice, Jr. [link|http://spiceware.org/gallery/ArtisticOverpass|Artistic Overpass]\n[link|http://www.spiceware.org/|SpiceWare] - We don't do Windows, it's too much of a chore
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Post #233,960
11/13/05 9:46:07 PM
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nope, just unintended brilliance! :-)
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #233,981
11/14/05 8:18:23 AM
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Thank you for proving my point
Were we not in a war, this would not be such a hot issue It doesn't matter what the TERMS are, you are hunting for differences to JUSTIFY your position that you know better for the cheeldrun what choices they should be allowed to make as adults by filtering and/or blocking their access to both information and the ability to commit. If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,057
11/14/05 1:36:21 PM
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Sorta depends on who you ask...
...The guy who produced "Super-size Me" might argue that they do train their employees to kill.
...But I digress...
jb4
shrub●bish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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Post #234,054
11/14/05 1:32:37 PM
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Re: I have in several posts
And please tell me more about this ILLEGAL DATABASE that is the EXACT SAME THING as selective service. Well, for one thing, BeeP, the Selective Service (the doublethink aspect of the name notwithstanding) database is the result of young men (are we registering wimmens yet?) physically supplying the information (allegedly) voluntarily. The ILLEGAL DATABASE (screaming yours) is surreptitously taken from sources other than the subject. But of course, that doesn't bother you none, now does it? jb4
shrub●bish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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Post #234,062
11/14/05 2:00:21 PM
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Look.
If I were to arrest and try every single person or group that is accused on the net by another person or group of some illegal activity...there wouldn't be anybody left (including us...who have been accused of stalking and other illegal acts by some folks)
Grain of Salt unless proven otherwise.
And again, not central to any point of mine.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,091
11/14/05 3:29:18 PM
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Technically not illegal
as the law (No Child Left Behind) says to do it. :-)
The central issue you're looking for is why does the military (if it's merely a business) get a license to collect this information on kids and Walmart/Disney/whatever does not.
After all, they're supposed to have the same access to people on College Campuses.
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Post #233,710
11/12/05 12:35:05 AM
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Put it another way...
...if killing people is part of the job description, then no go.
Peter
[link|http://www.no2id.net/|Don't Let The Terrorists Win]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Home]
Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
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Post #233,750
11/12/05 10:51:52 AM
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Then no police and no correctional officers
all who will be trained in the use of deadly force.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,755
11/12/05 11:02:42 AM
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Sounds fair enough to me.
Peter
[link|http://www.no2id.net/|Don't Let The Terrorists Win]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Home]
Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
|
Post #233,762
11/12/05 11:30:45 AM
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So then you feel comfortable
restricting others freedom to choose.
Thats very generous of you.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,776
11/12/05 1:21:09 PM
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Yes, basically.
There are some professions that you should go and seek out, rather than vice versa.
They are the professions that involve hurting and killing people as part of the job description.
Peter
[link|http://www.no2id.net/|Don't Let The Terrorists Win]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Home]
Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
|
Post #233,781
11/12/05 2:23:19 PM
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Difference of opinion, then.
I don't believe that someones options should be limited by someone else's opinion of what is good for them. That, to me, is not very far removed from not wanting them to associate with (name your group, race, religion here) because you "don't like them".
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #233,783
11/12/05 3:18:00 PM
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No-one's options are being limited by my point of view.
I'm just of the mind that if killing people is what you want to do for a living, then you should actively have to go and seek it out.
Peter
[link|http://www.no2id.net/|Don't Let The Terrorists Win]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Home]
Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
|
Post #233,790
11/12/05 4:44:30 PM
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The brush is a bit broad
There was a time, here, as well as England, where young men were brought up to do a hitch before enjoying the benifits of the system we live under. Some played slide horn in the band; some killed people. In either case, when they enlisted, they didn't get the choice "killing or not killing?"
It would be nice if everybody sat around the camp fire an sang Kumbaya together. It's not going to happen soon. The military are head breakers; if you want your booboos fixed, call the Peace Corps.
My initial bitch with this was the high schools having to rat out students. College kids can make their own decisions.
If you join the military for any reason or any job classification, you should expect to kill or be responsibile for the killing of people you don't know. That's what they do for a living.
Be a nice socialist and grow up a little, please. Thank you.
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Post #234,059
11/14/05 1:46:15 PM
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Ya know, Bill...
...It's not as if those who would want to be in the military are somehow limited in their ability to get propaganda and lies information about joining the military should they be restricted from access to the high-schooler's and collegians personal info. There's plenty enough info out there for those with the blood-and-guts-and-veins-in-my-teeth mentality to line up, sign up, and turn in their shoes! And that's the red herring in your argument. Colleges have HISTORICALLY (shouting mine, in response to your shouting) had the final say in who can and cannot recruit on campuses...it happens all the time...and those who are not welcome or welcomed onto campus still makange to find employees. Thus shall it be with the Hue-hess milit'ry!
So, unlike Barry, I don't call bullshit. I just call red herring. Nothing to see here, move along...move along....
jb4
shrub●bish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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Post #234,064
11/14/05 2:04:53 PM
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Re: Ya know, Bill...
Nice justification of the offense. Same argument as Peter has made.
They can still do it if they want to.
Problem is, YOU are deciding who should and shouldn't be seen based on some prejudice or veiled "difference".
Thats not acceptable around here.
Just the same as when the skinheads want to organize and march in Dayton. I don't like what they stand for, don't agree with anything they say..but DEFEND their right to be there because thats what this thing called freedom is all about.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,066
11/14/05 2:09:42 PM
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There is another POV on this.
The States run the schools. Why should the States be compelled to be recruitment centers for the Fed? You're making a specious argument here. But, you knew that, didn't you?
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,072
11/14/05 2:36:55 PM
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You're qualifying again
If they are recruitment officers for anyone, the fed must be included.
Simple, really. If you don't want military recruiting there, don't have any recruiting there at all.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,075
11/14/05 2:40:45 PM
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Private != State != Federal.
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,076
11/14/05 2:45:21 PM
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And you continue
with the "but, but, but >this< is different".
Wolf in sheeps clothing.
Denial or restriction of a legal choice because you don't like it.
Gave you the option. You pick.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,079
11/14/05 2:50:03 PM
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It's about States autonomy from this pov.
Thought that might appeal to you. Besides, hell, let's be honest. With the millions upon millions of US Taxpayer dollars going to advertisements on the teevee (not to mention the army's foray into online games), guess where most of these students that do sign up are going to be recruited? That's right, in their living rooms, bedrooms, kitchens, etc.
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,090
11/14/05 3:29:13 PM
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No it isn't.
You're moving way down the chain on that.
Its about "Joe's" right to information and access to choices that >you< don't like. You want to tell Joe he can't. You want to infringe on Joe's liberty for (insert your choice of reasons why >this< is different here).
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,098
11/14/05 4:06:01 PM
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Again, this time with feeling.
The States run the schools. The States, therefore, have the right to decide who is permitted on campus. It's curious that you are insisting that the Federal Government has a right to usurp the authority of the States. If the States don't want their schools to be fertile ground for Federal job recruitment then that is clearly within the States rights. It is a big, fat, whopping, "Saddam is an imminent threat" kind of distortion to suggest otherwise.
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,103
11/14/05 4:16:15 PM
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You are mixing things up
They can decide if they want to recruit or not.
If they decide to recruit, they can't decide to recruit for "only who you like"...that falls under a completely different section of law.
You are trying to mix up arguments.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,114
11/14/05 5:10:15 PM
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If the Federal Government really wants to, they can
make the states and local governments cooperate.
Section 8, clause 12. Congress has the authority To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years; The following clause is about the navy.
I believe that requiring that states and local governments cooperate with the federal efforts to raise armies is within that Congressional grant of power. However right now they aren't choosing to do that. They are waving the carrot of money, not the cudgel of the Constitution. But they don't have to be nice about it.
Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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Post #234,126
11/14/05 6:30:59 PM
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They can raise armies as needed, but pussy communists
dont allow that. They can open up the draft or even press gangs for any ablebodied male citizen between 16 and 45 bu they cannot force public schools to host recruiters unless other companies are allowed to recruit giving a limited public platform for that type of free speech.
thanx,
bill
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #234,140
11/14/05 7:26:52 PM
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why don't you tell us what you really feel box.
Don't hold back now ;-)
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,153
11/14/05 8:39:22 PM
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pussy communists, where the army cant be used in the US
its an ammendment passed after reconstruction tried to destroy the south
thanx,
bill
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #234,158
11/14/05 8:48:19 PM
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:-)
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,211
11/15/05 9:16:48 AM
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What are you on about?
[link|http://www4.army.mil/ocpa/read.php?story_id_key=8090|http://www4.army.mil...story_id_key=8090]
Looks to me like the army is being used in the US. And what's with the "pussy" communists? You mean these guys? [link|http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/april/21/newsid_3560000/3560175.stm|http://news.bbc.co.u...60000/3560175.stm]
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,216
11/15/05 9:29:29 AM
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rent a movie called tank
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #234,217
11/15/05 9:33:16 AM
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That '84 Maverick flick? ;0)
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #235,671
11/23/05 11:24:18 AM
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"by any means necessary" is implied, then?
I'm not, by any means, an expert on this. And I'm not usually one to argue for States' rights (probably because I'm a descendant of Southerners and "States' Rights" in that region have always been code words for "Racist Policies"). But I don't read that section you posted as necessarily mandating that the States participate.
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #235,791
11/23/05 10:25:51 PM
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Not quite ANY means..
But the latitude is wide enough that it has included pressgangs and military drafts in the past. So I'd assume that the federal government has quite a bit of latitude here.
Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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Post #236,302
11/28/05 12:09:40 PM
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Has that ever been challenged? Did any State try to opt out?
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #236,309
11/28/05 1:08:26 PM
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not since 1865
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #236,316
11/28/05 1:55:45 PM
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Thanks. I meant USSC cases. ;0)
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #236,338
11/28/05 5:09:24 PM
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Yes, and I do not know
[link|http://www.mainstream.com/nhpolitics/getcase.gillette.html|http://www.mainstrea...ase.gillette.html] is an example of a USSC case involving the draft. (The outcome is that one can't register as a conscientious objecter because you object to the current war.)
I don't know of any cases offhand where a state tried to keep the federal government from enforcing a draft, but I cannot imagine that it would go well for the state. National defence is clearly a federal responsibility in the Constitution.
Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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Post #234,492
11/16/05 1:54:01 PM
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Red Herring alert number 2581 (or so)
Its about "Joe's" right to information and access to choices that >you< don't like Uhhh...actually no it isn't. Its about giving...no -- let's be accurate here for a change. It's about compelling certain institutions to provide private information to a particular Federal agency (one whose motives are suspect, to be sure; and one whose image, through no fault of its own, is rather tarnished). And, its about one municipality who has given the big digit to said compelling. Military recruiters don't come to high schools to try to win the hears and minds of the Cheeldrins from Big Corporate...they're too chicken, and besides, they can't enlist anybody until they'r basically outof HS anyway. So no "access to choices", whether >I< like them or not, is being impinged. But thank you for playing. It's so much nicer listening to you than Rush or Pat...you, at least, have intelligence.... jb4
shrub●bish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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Post #234,077
11/14/05 2:45:28 PM
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But, must everybody be allowed to recruit if the Fed is?
[link|http://www.runningworks.com|
] Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
|
Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
|
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Post #234,078
11/14/05 2:47:23 PM
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Any specific exclusion should be frowned upon
yes.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,171
11/14/05 10:17:46 PM
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How about groups that promote violence and killing?
Of course, that would encompass not only the armed forces, but the Republican Party and the 700 Club.
[link|http://www.runningworks.com|
] Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
|
Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
|
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Post #234,176
11/14/05 10:27:27 PM
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or democrats depending on your point of view
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #234,187
11/15/05 12:23:00 AM
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Was wondering where that was headed
yeah...them too.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,214
11/15/05 9:23:15 AM
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Political parties are not businesses either.
So you mean that if business is allowed to recruit, ANY ORGANISATION AT ALL should be allowed to recruit - just clarifying here...
[link|http://www.runningworks.com|
] Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
|
Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
|
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Post #234,233
11/15/05 10:56:38 AM
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Are they paying now?
I didn't get my check, in that case.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,251
11/15/05 12:00:26 PM
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Yes you did. $300.00
[link|http://www.runningworks.com|
] Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
|
Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
|
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Post #234,256
11/15/05 12:23:42 PM
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That was my money
early loan repayment was all that was.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,212
11/15/05 9:19:38 AM
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How about Al Qaida? CPUSA?
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,235
11/15/05 10:58:18 AM
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What, trying to find somebody I don't like?
So that I'll capitulate to your groupthink mentality?
I'm arguing for one already, why would I change my mind for these others.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,248
11/15/05 11:46:37 AM
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Nope. Just testing your metal. ;0)
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,380
11/15/05 10:11:46 PM
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Then here's one for you.
North American Man/Boy Love Association.
Alex
The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,381
11/15/05 10:13:39 PM
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You're right
don't like them.
But there's also scoutmasters and priests
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,383
11/15/05 10:22:43 PM
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NCLB Sec 9525 covers the Boy Scouts.
[link|http://www.ed.gov/policy/elsec/leg/esea02/pg112.html|No Child Left Behind]. Scroll down to section 9525 - it's the "Boy Scouts of America Equal Access Act".
So they don't have anything to worry about...
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #234,487
11/16/05 1:39:18 PM
11/16/05 1:40:15 PM
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Section HOW MANY?!?
No law, in anything resembling a Democracy (even if in name only) should have 9525 sections!
jb4
shrub●bish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
Edited by jb4
Nov. 16, 2005, 01:40:15 PM EST
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Post #234,493
11/16/05 1:57:51 PM
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It's not that bad.
[link|http://www.ed.gov/policy/elsec/leg/esea02/index.html|Almost], but not quite. It's better than, say, Title VI, Part XI, Sec 13, Subparagraph J2(ii), isn't it?
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #234,088
11/14/05 3:24:32 PM
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they take the federal dole, thats why
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #234,092
11/14/05 3:31:19 PM
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Even that doesn't feature in my reasoning.
Though it gives them a club, should they (and they often do) want to use it.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,100
11/14/05 4:07:38 PM
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Not much, they aren't.
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
|
Post #234,490
11/16/05 1:43:33 PM
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Yes I am...
...as a HS or College administrator, because...as you have most often said in this thread...it happens all the time! And if you want to recant that "it happens all the time" line, fine! Then we'll get onto the no special access part of the argument....
jb4
shrub●bish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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Post #234,014
11/14/05 11:20:25 AM
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Um, that wouldn't be freedom. That'd be indoctrination.
Next you'll be wanting mandatory seminars in Mom, Apple Pie and the absolute wonder of capitalism.
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,017
11/14/05 11:24:09 AM
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Next
you'll be wanting to ban books from libraries becasue you don't like their content.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #234,022
11/14/05 11:32:38 AM
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Um, that wouldn't be me. That'd be DHS. ;0)
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
|
Post #234,040
11/14/05 12:34:57 PM
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like what you teach your kids :-) /me dux
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #234,047
11/14/05 1:12:40 PM
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I don't teach my kids anything anymore. They teach me.
And largely, I don't like it. ;0)
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
|
Post #234,053
11/14/05 1:32:27 PM
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tell me about it
oldest boy asking questions about juggling two girls simultaniously. I shrug and say as long as you dont tell them you love them or get them pregnant. He states "Dad, I dont believe in pre-marital sex" WTF!!! Different world out there.
thanx,
bill
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #234,058
11/14/05 1:37:34 PM
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If that's true,
how old is he and would he like to date one of my daughters? :-)
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
|
Post #234,060
11/14/05 1:46:38 PM
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will be 17 in Jan, link below
[link|http://bellsouthpwp.net/w/i/williamoxley/allnme.JPG|http://bellsouthpwp....moxley/allnme.JPG] the one with the donkey on his shirt.
thanx,
bill
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #234,067
11/14/05 2:10:36 PM
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Thanks. I'll give 'em a gander ;0)
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
|
Post #234,071
11/14/05 2:31:48 PM
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is it pre-marital if they're not going to get married?
Darrell Spice, Jr. [link|http://spiceware.org/gallery/ArtisticOverpass|Artistic Overpass]\n[link|http://www.spiceware.org/|SpiceWare] - We don't do Windows, it's too much of a chore
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Post #234,089
11/14/05 3:25:48 PM
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Im afraid to ask :-)
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
|
Post #234,099
11/14/05 4:06:56 PM
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Well, clarify that before I go show mine the pic. ;0)
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #234,146
11/14/05 7:52:43 PM
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He didn't give you the whole story
It's not pre-marital if he is not going to get married.
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Post #234,147
11/14/05 7:57:20 PM
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Just because he doesn't believe in it . . .
. . doesn't mean he isn't going to do it, as rampant STDs among the sworn abstainers has shown.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #233,739
11/12/05 9:40:28 AM
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In the South?
[link|http://www.runningworks.com|
] Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
|
Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
|
|
Post #233,771
11/12/05 12:33:50 PM
8/21/07 5:45:47 AM
|
That's not gonna fly
I have no problem with recruiters at COLLEGE campuses AS LONG AS the recruiters don't have favored access. IOW, they get exactly the same level of access as Joe Local Company.
Also, they have to leave the big hardware at home - no helicopter fly-ins etc (which was a point of contention at a local high school - they wanted to bring a blackhawk to the high school on career day - not appropriate on lots of levels).
"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" --Mark Twain
"The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them." --Albert Einstein
"This is still a dangerous world. It's a world of madmen and uncertainty and potential mental losses." --George W. Bush
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Post #233,856
11/13/05 1:00:51 AM
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Indeed: SHOCK n'AWE competing with GM corner office -
How Orwellian must this country get, before anybody much.. Notices?
I suspect.. a tad more
The Nintendo generation is pretty Suggestible, if things go BANG.
:-/
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