Post #191,304
1/24/05 6:51:32 AM
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This is surprising?
Of course not. They are just people.
[link|http://forfree.sytes.net|
] Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
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Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
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Post #191,314
1/24/05 7:43:49 AM
1/24/05 7:45:14 AM
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Ignore
slow network...
"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" --Mark Twain
"The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them." --Albert Einstein
"This is still a dangerous world. It's a world of madmen and uncertainty and potential mental losses." --George W. Bush
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Post #191,315
1/24/05 7:44:30 AM
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Pushy self righteous people who claim to know a better way
and are apparently wrong.
Note that this focuses on evangelicals - the preachy pushy group. Not your run of the mill church goers.
If you can't walk your talk - sit down and shut up.
"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" --Mark Twain
"The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them." --Albert Einstein
"This is still a dangerous world. It's a world of madmen and uncertainty and potential mental losses." --George W. Bush
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Post #191,322
1/24/05 9:05:33 AM
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*shrug*
Evangelicals are all right. Problem occurs when they a) preach to those that obviously don't want to hear the message (ignoring the 'pearls before swine' message: Don't preach to those that won't listen),
b) they pay more attention to dogma than the message,
c) they feel self-righteous or superior because they 'get it' and those they preach to don't,
d) they get the map confused with the territory - they believe that acting like (what they think a Christian is like) a 'Christian' is the same as being a Christian or
e) they are hypocrites using religion for gain (social, political or economical). The worst of these fall under 'all of the above' of course; these are IMO the individuals that cause people to judge the whole group badly. [link|http://forfree.sytes.net|
] Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
|
Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
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Post #191,423
1/24/05 6:25:53 PM
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Well.. the hypocrisy thing is pretty universal
and hardly the sole province of Christians, although certain of the now countless sects appear to possess the concentration-gene for this heady hallucinant of self-forgetfullness. Why at extremes: some are even known to completely forget, vengeance is mine, saith __ .. let alone that cute one about beams/motes (or throwing stones)
But whether or not a 'Christian' is really BEING a Christ-ian comes out in certain visible behavioural artifacts IMO: the Greed-is-Good thing (or not?) .. Gosh, was Ronnie a Christian?
More importantly re smaller matters.. like, say - survival of the species, all the billions - is the *cough* Elitism-thing. Promulgating a pre-packaged theology of Exclusion:
Whereby all those who do not buy the 'home' or Commercial Version, after removing the shrink-wrap [ie akshully Reading all the barbaric stuff intermixed amidst countless contradictions, and with the Love stuff - so evidently honored vastly more in its breach than its performance] -- all those Other billions get consigned to a Xian Hell thing.
Those scribes and their Editors accomplished quite imaginitive feats, presumably without the aid of authentic Bad Acid, No?
Ah well, Fellow Elitist - I admit I'm one too; indeed I acknowledge a preference for folks who actually Use their fucking Gawd-given minds - both intellectual AND emotional - in dealing with the Grand Mysteries (and I even like to see in such a one.. a clear appreciation of how it is that committees of Men-type homo saps are utterly incapable of Not-garbling the really Heavy stuff on ANY topic.)
Because {pious chords in C# Minor}
I. have. looked. on. these. Men. {/chords}
and I see at near-#2 CIEIO spot:
a wretched textbook-misogynist; you know: the really Popular guy who spawned what came to be a whole new tiny country/city in what is now called 'Italy'? Probably impotent and decidedly infected with diseased attitudes towards all Not-him, (and especially if they had a vagina) - can ya really found a Massive Corporation around an emotional cripple?
Why.. YES!
You can.. for a lengthy period, but -
at what cost in near-universally diseased mental health and the wars generated by Being the Only Right Ones\ufffd?
OK - Over to Elitist #2
er :-\ufffd
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Post #191,338
1/24/05 11:36:43 AM
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The thing is
they claim to be.
After reading the article, I think the author needs to apply Occam's Razor to the problem. The actual situation is that most of the people who claim to be Christian aren't. For most people, their church is a social club, not faith.
For example, the author is still willing to condemn those who cohabitate. Now, according to the article, fully one in five evangelicals think adultery in marriage is OK. I'm not even married, and I would never consider fooling around on my partner, and have not, despite over two years of separation while I go to school.
Who's more Christian, the person who observes the rituals but ignores the precepts, or the person who ignores the rituals but follows the precepts? Most of the evangelical movement in the US seems to be made up of the former, not the latter.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #191,438
1/24/05 8:41:00 PM
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Interesting point
Who's more Christian, the person who observes the rituals but ignores the precepts, or the person who ignores the rituals but follows the precepts? Most of the evangelical movement in the US seems to be made up of the former, not the latter. That is a religious question itself, and one that might play into the evangelical belief that grace is more important then works. Evangelicals may be more willing to overlook errors of precepts then somebody who centers their beliefs on the importance of works. At the very least, history shows them as being easier to manipulate by leaders who can follow the rituals despite lack of commitment to precepts. Jay
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