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New Refreshing
I just love it when a thread is saved from the flames. I think we aren't too far apart on this. My original point (however badly expressed) was in the nature of a logic exercise. I regret the implication that I think our gov is worse than the Taliban. However, I strongly disagree with your contention that the current inroads on civil liberties are simply more of the same that others have done in the past. I think this is much more serious. With that in mind, the point I was trying to make was, given the rhetoric of our administration regarding the aims of the terrorists, we have already lost the "war on terrorism" due to our actions in response.
How to mangle the truth;

Have it reported by any major U.S. media outlet.
New Point taken...
And I'm no prophet. I am guardedly optimistic that this is more of the same... We can agree to disagree on the "degree" of severity of this current power grab, and we can agree to agree that we must try to diligently guard our rights to unlawful search and seizure and due process...

I'm ready to put this to rest if you are.
Just a few thoughts,

Screamer

"I'll tip my hat to the new constitution, take a bow for the new revolution, smile and grin at the change all around, pick up my guitar and play, just like yesterday..."

P. Townshend

"Nietzsche has an S in it"
Celina Jones
New Putting it to rest.
Complete agreement. (about putting it to rest. Other things? We'll see.)

:-)
How to mangle the truth;

Have it reported by any major U.S. media outlet.
New PS to both.
Mouse That Roared !!

Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle..

I'd forgotten that masterpiece.. Would that 'we-all' had not: there is no finer pomposity-buster than Sellers in a good vehicle - and that one was a Ferrari Testa Rossa on nitro.

The Q Bomb says it all.

Nice to see Sweet Reason is alive and well at, at least zIWE. I too shall attempt next to avoid merely replying in kind to shibboleths and, if I can - point out as well: the sight of a process doomed to doggerel by M$-like initial Awful McDesign. (repeat after self the mantra.. scale and relativity, scale and relativity, scale and relativity..)


Peace. We have to become accustomed (but not inured) to the Interesting Times - and remain vigilant of the BS of all the bounders, each looking for opportunities, whatever sewn-on label they sport. No?



Ashton
New Pomposity buster
Being There. Sellers most understated role. And an absolute delight to watch. The cluelessness of the politicians/media/business leaders reacting to this "Gardner" is hilarious. The Shirly MacClaine masturbation scene is especially rich in wry humor. Highly recommended to any with an appreciation of subtlety in film. I've got to get the book to see how much is left out of the movie.
How to mangle the truth;

Have it reported by any major U.S. media outlet.
New Yes.. of Course! Timeless and entirely *current*
Maybe more than Mouse. Everyone got to watch close-ups of most congresscritters recently - in that orchestrated Let's Get Horny Billy rewrite of The Ten Commandments Live! on color Tee Vee!

Permanently ingrained: those faces, that High Dudgeon, that McSincerity! er hypocrisy dripping onto the expensive carpeting. Mr. YouthfulIndiscretionHyde presiding with requisite silver-hair and avuncular epithets. Cackle.. glorp..

One of the few videos I bought. Thanks - have to view it again soon, with a cohort. Chauncy Gardner Lives! He lives in the hearts and minds of every little girl at Christmas time.. Yes! Virginia - there IS a Chauncey Gardner !!!



Ashton
ain't us homo-saps a Riot!?
RIP Mr. Sellers

New Okay, Okay.... I'll bite...
The Party is the ultimate in my view... Birdy num nums, birdy num nums...
Just a few thoughts,

Screamer

"I'll tip my hat to the new constitution, take a bow for the new revolution, smile and grin at the change all around, pick up my guitar and play, just like yesterday..."

P. Townshend

"Nietzsche has an S in it"
Celina Jones
New nope there is a girl in my soup
and dont forget leu licunce pour la mahenky
thanx,
bill
tshirt front "born to die before I get old"
thshirt back "fscked another one didnja?"
     Hmmm. The pres says they "hate freedom" - (Silverlock) - (125)
         Gutting of the Constitution - (screamer) - (122)
             If you really feel that way... - (Silverlock) - (75)
                 As I believe has been noted before. - (Brandioch) - (21)
                     Actually things were different in WW1 and WW2 - (wharris2)
                     Minor difference... - (bepatient) - (19)
                         Why not? - (Brandioch) - (18)
                             Your decided.. - (bepatient) - (17)
                                 Reality isn't your forte. - (Brandioch) - (16)
                                     Never dealt in real estate, eh? - (bepatient) - (14)
                                         Historical side note... - (inthane-chan) - (3)
                                             And I'd bet... - (bepatient) - (1)
                                                 You got it. - (inthane-chan)
                                             Re: Historical side note... - (Steve Lowe)
                                         Why the switch? - (Brandioch) - (9)
                                             Are you really.... - (bepatient) - (8)
                                                 You left out a few. - (Brandioch) - (6)
                                                     Wiretap Osama? - (wharris2)
                                                     Yawn -NT - (bepatient) - (4)
                                                         What a fscking stupid non-response - (CRConrad) - (3)
                                                             To a continued - (bepatient) - (2)
                                                                 C'mon BeeP - missing *all* the common denominators? - (Ashton) - (1)
                                                                     I can't help blindness. - (bepatient)
                                                 actually...not that I care... - (Simon_Jester)
                                     FWIW - (admin)
                 Clarification... - (screamer) - (52)
                     Classic use of fallacy - (Silverlock) - (32)
                         Classic use of phallus... - (screamer) - (31)
                             Consistency not one of your strong points? - (Silverlock) - (15)
                                 Nahh. the pic is an insult to Zippy - (Ashton)
                                 Intelligence not one of yours? - (screamer) - (13)
                                     Evidently not - (Silverlock) - (12)
                                         I'm not done with you yet. - (screamer)
                                         One more thing... - (screamer) - (10)
                                             Ok, I'll explain - (Silverlock) - (9)
                                                 We're getting there... - (screamer) - (8)
                                                     Refreshing - (Silverlock) - (7)
                                                         Point taken... - (screamer) - (6)
                                                             Putting it to rest. - (Silverlock) - (5)
                                                                 PS to both. - (Ashton) - (4)
                                                                     Pomposity buster - (Silverlock) - (3)
                                                                         Yes.. of Course! Timeless and entirely *current* - (Ashton) - (2)
                                                                             Okay, Okay.... I'll bite... - (screamer) - (1)
                                                                                 nope there is a girl in my soup - (boxley)
                             If you can't keep up, take notes. - (jb4) - (14)
                                 Exqueeze me... Noodle man... - (screamer) - (13)
                                     Re: Exqueeze me... Noodle man... - (jb4) - (12)
                                         I guess that also extends the right... - (inthane-chan) - (8)
                                             You got it pal... - (screamer) - (7)
                                                 Which is why... - (inthane-chan) - (6)
                                                     Which is absolute and total bullshit... - (screamer) - (5)
                                                         No, I see the correlation. - (inthane-chan) - (3)
                                                             It's becoming a lovefest... :-) - (screamer) - (2)
                                                                 No more beer comments, I assure you. :P -NT - (inthane-chan) - (1)
                                                                     But ya know... - (inthane-chan)
                                                         WARNING - red-herring alert! - (jb4)
                                         You don't need a license to smoke... - (screamer) - (2)
                                             Actually, I agree... - (jb4)
                                             Or: Everything not prohibited is compulsory. -NT - (Ashton)
                     Jeez Scream-ful One - I be so *ashamed* - (Ashton) - (18)
                         My, my, my... - (screamer) - (17)
                             Not my ox. That died some time ago. - (Ashton) - (16)
                                 L&COL... - (screamer) - (15)
                                     Will be on same side of barricades.. - (Ashton) - (13)
                                         Hey - <lightbulb on> - does this mean the expression... - (CRConrad) - (12)
                                             Ya gotta watch that incipient Alzheimers.. - (Ashton) - (11)
                                                 Er - (Ashton)
                                                 I think that was only the whole word I saw then? - (CRConrad) - (7)
                                                     Heh.. forgot what -- er, what you said is prolly correct :-) -NT - (Ashton)
                                                     Not that we should... - (CRConrad) - (5)
                                                         Not sure what you're unsure about. Also: need New Word! - (Ashton) - (4)
                                                             Ashcroft has at least a temporary setback. - (a6l6e6x) - (1)
                                                                 The mob is very loud, though. A small step for a man - (Ashton)
                                                             About whether the idiom *actu-really does* refer to the car. -NT - (CRConrad) - (1)
                                                                 It do: less'n they lied to a little kid :( -NT - (Ashton)
                                                 The real D\ufffdsey -- - (Ric Locke) - (1)
                                                     Huh? Of course I did; that may be *why* I could correct him. -NT - (CRConrad)
                                     aaactuually aahm ver found of - (boxley)
             But what job is that? - (jb4) - (40)
                 Huh? - (bepatient) - (39)
                     We should conform to the herd mentality? - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                         Conform? - (bepatient)
                     And another thing... - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                         Now >that< was funny. -NT - (bepatient)
                     Er Beep: they use *Corporate money*. Umm - get it? - (Ashton) - (6)
                         Uh...yeah...I do - (bepatient) - (5)
                             If you accept what they hand you, you deserve what you get. -NT - (mmoffitt) - (4)
                                 Who said anything about blind acceptance? - (bepatient) - (3)
                                     Last was restricted to your "Reality" post. - (mmoffitt) - (2)
                                         Hardly. -NT - (bepatient) - (1)
                                             Umm.. if this-all really *were* - (Ashton)
                     Yer damn RIGHT I think they use their own money! - (jb4) - (27)
                         Ah...so.... - (bepatient) - (26)
                             I'm too lazy to look up link and Name this official fallacy - (Ashton) - (9)
                                 Why me? - (bepatient) - (8)
                                     Because.. - (Ashton) - (7)
                                         All I did... - (bepatient) - (6)
                                             Well___OK___ demi-Supreme Evil then. What - no solutions ?? -NT - (Ashton) - (2)
                                                 42 - (bepatient) - (1)
                                                     8\ufffd - It's *always* about Sex, in the End. -NT - (Ashton)
                                             Challenging a red-herring...how quaint. - (jb4) - (2)
                                                 Nah... - (bepatient) - (1)
                                                     OK, but as far as a Left Fielder goes... - (jb4)
                             Counterexamples? - (jb4) - (15)
                                 Everyone else. - (bepatient) - (14)
                                     Re: Everyone else. - (jb4) - (13)
                                         Ok...your obvious counter... - (bepatient) - (12)
                                             Wow! Beep: so ya got the germ of a Solution after all? ;-) - (Ashton) - (11)
                                                 Actually... - (bepatient) - (10)
                                                     OK - it's time to come Clean. - (Ashton) - (9)
                                                         I certainly understand >that< aspect... - (bepatient) - (8)
                                                             OK. I see it's about Religious Faith in [Boxes] of any kind. - (Ashton) - (7)
                                                                 Well since you continually seem to be missing my point... - (bepatient) - (6)
                                                                     This mini thread - (Steve Lowe) - (5)
                                                                         Impasse. Future Fork. - (Ashton) - (4)
                                                                             No...that was NOT my response. - (bepatient) - (3)
                                                                                 I'll concede your phrasing there. And raise you. - (Ashton) - (2)
                                                                                     Entropy just went up. - (pwhysall) - (1)
                                                                                         Entropy decreased. - (Ashton)
             That's right... - (Simon_Jester) - (4)
                 Let's let it die... - (screamer) - (3)
                     of course... - (Simon_Jester) - (2)
                         In the immortal words of Rodney King... - (screamer) - (1)
                             Where's my 11 million? - (bepatient)
         I've been immersed in my own work lately - (gtall) - (1)
             expanded wire tapping, detention without charges - (Silverlock)

My Mom, who is vacationing in Aruba...
120 ms