Let no good deed go unpunished or, [RFQ?]

Post #5,933 by Ashton 8/20/01 12:06:10 AM Reply	Let no good deed go unpunished or, [RFQ?] How I dreamt I saw God in Her maidenform bra and found.. that power is not an aphrodisiac.. for me. Er, not sure if this blong in Hardware, WWW, Windoze or Stupid Pet Tricks... Admin feel free to move, if you gots a better idea.. OK, story: There's a veritable Nirvana nearby for - old pets, old sick pets. Ones most places just snuff - the Murican 'flush it down the toilet if it's inconvenient' syndrome. Funded by remnants of a (not IT) CEO's former Co. sold to another, etc. Point - not rich (anymore). Place is super-clean and I guess, unique. They have to scrounge a bit as a new business starts up.. I've offered to pitch in on some overdue maintenance - currently they are running on Luck, mere ZIP backups of this n' that. I haven't even inspected yet, just phone description; had to offer some help - as a local yellow-pages Co. just ripped them off for a couple of non-productive visits. Bastards. All I need of course is - The Manual. {sigh} OK there is none, but maybe something written for the basically ept but largely LAN-inept, ISDN - connect-up inexperienced: like moi. Seems to be: A "NT W2K server w/ 'firewall'" (is that possible? or does it mean W2K Expen$ive Server aka formerly-NT?) Dunno yet what firewall s/ware, but I guess it's kept them alive so far. Whatever is running (unattended for months now I'd guess - is THAT possible !?) connects to ~4 desk, laptop machines running W98 (SE I hope - at least there's Sys Info then). Got recent experience - there. This was formerly a node on his Co's network, all set up by Pro(s), a fancy multi-line fone system too. Former Co. retrieved (maybe just an ISDN modem) leaving them on local LAN via 98 "Network [ugh.TheName] Neighborhood". There's CAT5 run thus must be NICs for each workstation, and not some serial horror (not that I'm NIC ept either). Stuff's all working. Now. GTE-ugh-Verizon = our local island amidst PacBell all around, seems destined to supply service. New modem to specs of his former techs, coming. Configured? (does it have flash EEPROMs?) Question: are these ISDN setups premised on the unwashed following NT-menu data insertion, via phone? or do they expect a higher level of on-site competence? Any ideas on books.. re getting up to speed with server, sufficient to seeing what patches have been skipped, basic housekeeping, defrag (dunno if FAT, HPFS even) Would be nice if it starts for newbies but proceeds to more useful pointers, if such a book exists (?) Yes, I have next, to: inventory, document, see if such stuff as IIS or Front Page, Outlook - are present and preparing to receive visiting virii. (May have to enlist a local tutor, and may have a line towards such, if lucky.) Have to get a CDRW up - know zilch re NT drivers for such, nor if say Roxio (nee Adaptec) EZCDC 5 will run on NT; next search project I see. They have Ghost but - doubt anyone's made an image - hope to be pleasantly surprised, find a recovery image on the server, as it sure as hell can't be on a ZIP. (spanned? - not on that POS I hope) {sigh} I'm reasonably good at Doing No Harm usually.. should learn a few things you guys put up with daily. Or fail miserably, ask someone from local Linux group to put in Apache (cackle cackle) - if there's a chance that process could prove cost effective, all things considered. Alas no one there knows much about their system. (Nice it Was Pro installed). Anyway - I have to try. Responses sought. "Idiot!" s'OK too: Truth over niceness. Ashton the Incompetent I didn't know I couldn't do it, so I bought a Cray..
Post #5,943 by static 8/20/01 2:47:51 AM Reply	Some hints. If it's NT4, then you should try to put Service Pack 6a on it. If it's W2k, then you should try to put Service Pack 2 on it. Yes, there are different SPs per OS. And that's if you want to keep the OS. Setting dial-up networking on NT4 and W2k is a reasonably unique proposition. But what I think might derail them is that you seem to want to do four or five things all with one NT server: Internet (including firewalling), web server and file server. With only 4 client PCs, I suspect you will get away with it, but NT4 wasn't that good at doing such diverse things all at once. If it gets crashy whilst trying (you should know in a week) then you're asking too much of it. And creating an Emergency Recovery Diskette for NT4 isn't hard, though I can't remember the command to do it. Unfortunately, it has to put it entirely on one diskette (I don't know why, but can guess). I don't know if it can put it on a ZIP disk. This is different from a Ghost image, BTW. Wade. "All around me are nothing but fakes Come with me on the biggest fake of all!"
Post #5,949 by Ashton 8/20/01 5:03:21 AM Reply	Thanks Wade. I grok the Ghost difference. Unsure if the ZIP scenario (which 'works' for certain def'ns on 95, 8) applies for NT, either. I'll look for the emgcy. floppy tab - was on my list already. ZIP could only be temp - know too much about Iomega ever to trust it. Thanks for SP #s for both. As to config for the ISDN box - I'll have to become proficient with whichever is on box; if lucky initially - can be talked through the menus by GTE folk. Which should complete with successful connection and test message exchanges - then I'm on our (my) own. Take notes. re Ghost; dunno how DOS emulation on NT goes. Have to read .docs tonight. Hope for an extra partition (maybe with an image! already) etc. Dunno if the Norton SysWorks speaks NT. Yet. Damn.. thought I'd escaped NT forever. Oh, "if want to keep OS". Heh. I haven't been entirely asleep.. cackle cackle. May well be lobbying for wiping the sucker, so it can walk And chew gum, with local Linux talent. I thought too that - maybe NT could.. handle 4 users and firewall. Dunno for sure it is web-serving; don't think so (they don't have the skills to maintain that). Will make clear: they shouldn't try, on same box. Too bad Andy's in LA or I'd have him by in a flash, or even his PFY ;-) Should be fun - kinda like landing a 747 after the pilot had fish :-\ufffd Cheers, Ashton
Post #5,952 by pwhysall 8/20/01 7:35:59 AM Reply	Re: Some hints. If it's NT4, then you should try to put Service Pack 6a on it. If it's W2k, then you should try to put Service Pack 2 on it. Yes, there are different SPs per OS. And that's if you want to keep the OS. Of course there are different Service Packs. They're different operating systems. Setting dial-up networking on NT4 and W2k is a reasonably unique proposition. On W2K it's a snap (all network connections are treated in a consistent manner on W2K). On NT4 it's only slightly more confusing. But what I think might derail them is that you seem to want to do four or five things all with one NT server: Internet (including firewalling), web server and file server. With only 4 client PCs, I suspect you will get away with it, but NT4 wasn't that good at doing such diverse things all at once. If it gets crashy whilst trying (you should know in a week) then you're asking too much of it. Nah, there's no problem with this. It'll work. And creating an Emergency Recovery Diskette for NT4 isn't hard, though I can't remember the command to do it. Unfortunately, it has to put it entirely on one diskette (I don't know why, but can guess). I don't know if it can put it on a ZIP disk. This is different from a Ghost image, BTW. The command is RDISK and it doesn't have to store everything on a floppy. What it does is store the registry files on the hard disk and the floppy knows where they are. Ghosting NT4 installations is a bad idea and W2K even more so. Personally, I think Windows is the wrong OS here; Linux would be a better choice. However, the Linux approach would be more complex to implement (iptables, Apache, and Samba would be a lot of config to swallow, and PPP on Linux can be a bit fearsome for the novice) but hey, it'd work faster and be cheaper. It all depends what you've got more of - time, or money. -- Peter Shill For Hire
Post #5,955 by static 8/20/01 8:18:54 AM Reply	I was covering a few extra bases. Of course there are different Service Packs. They're different operating systems. I know that and you know that and I know you know that and you know that I kow that; I was being nice to Ashton in case he didn't already know that. :-) On W2K it's a snap (all network connections are treated in a consistent manner on W2K). On NT4 it's only slightly more confusing. What I meant, and clearly failed to say, is that in neither NT4 nor in W2k is it like Windows 95. I've not done it in W2k but I have struggled with NT4's method. Personally, I think Windows is the wrong OS here; Linux would be a better choice. However, the Linux approach would be more complex to implement (iptables, Apache, and Samba would be a lot of config to swallow, and PPP on Linux can be a bit fearsome for the novice) but hey, it'd work faster and be cheaper. It all depends what you've got more of - time, or money. You're right, of course: Linux is a solution I would normally recommend. But Ashton made noises about perhaps leaving NT so I gave some pointers to that end. Thanks for the RDISK note, BTW. Wade. "All around me are nothing but fakes Come with me on the biggest fake of all!"
Post #5,958 by pwhysall 8/20/01 8:56:41 AM Reply	Dialup in W2K is just like the Internet Connection Wizard. It's ridiculously easy. -- Peter Shill For Hire
Post #5,991 by Ashton 8/20/01 12:47:57 PM Reply	On my way to do some homework.. Peter.. I'm afraid your Shill status is in deep doo doo, as our President might say. (Nah - allus knew you were a Benign Shill - just takin on the ravin-loonie SillyParty 'Let's Dismember Bill' partisans.. umm nobody I Know ;-) Thanks both - I had from the first.. the natural, the Decent, the Sane intention.. to get them onto something stable, soon as I can find a local person who is competent. For now it's just a matter of collectiing info about exactly what they need to do, .doc what they have - keep it walking while - saner approaches can be thought out. Local LUG soon. On to GTE, etc. I have a big advantage - thus far it's running on auto. All I have to do is see - What it's running on auto. Save Registry first! Er after I log in as.. Admin cackle cackle fdisk /LILO - nope, that won't work.. OK try - Cheers, A. Yesterday I cudnt spel sysadman and now I Are One!
Post #5,944 by static 8/20/01 2:53:51 AM Reply	Some hints. If it's NT4, then you should try to put Service Pack 6a on it. If it's W2k, then you should try to put Service Pack 2 on it. Yes, there are different SPs per OS. And that's if you want to keep the OS. Setting dial-up networking on NT4 and W2k is a reasonably unique proposition. But what I think might derail them is that you seem to want to do four or five things all with one NT server: Internet (including firewalling), web server and file server. With only 4 client PCs, I suspect you will get away with it, but NT4 wasn't that good at doing such diverse things all at once. If it gets crashy whilst trying (you should know in a week) then you're asking too much of it. And creating an Emergency Recovery Diskette for NT4 isn't hard, though I can't remember the command to do it. Unfortunately, it has to put it entirely on one diskette (I don't know why, but can guess). I don't know if it can put it on a ZIP disk. This is different from a Ghost image, BTW. Wade. "All around me are nothing but fakes Come with me on the biggest fake of all!"
Post #6,015 by Ashton 8/21/01 12:42:47 AM Reply	A sysadmin's lot is not a happy one.. Seems we're back on, but slow - here. Small report on first day of fakin it - OK, now I see how it is.. after just 2 hours in small room with bloody Compaq heavy-duty server with fans from a Huey. Win2K (V 5.00.2195) "Win. 2000 Server". Wear those earplugs, folks. Directory for 'Connection Wizard' is empty (??) Previous rent-a-guy spent 3 hours installing a (driver?) for ISDN modem - finally complaining that orig. was "used", had prev. config - wouldn't accept his config.. but GTE said the ISDN modems have no flash-mem/NVRAM. Doesn't compute.. Presume I need to find .cabs (that dir. is empty too!) = orig. install CD. Who'd nuke the Connection Wizard? (er, a BOFH?) Found a couple logs dated the day this work was done - apparently successfully 'creating' something labelled, "DHCPServer.Ndi" perhaps from \\WINNT\\INF\\netdhcps.n[can't read my note for last 1? 2 of the .ext]. In any case - this is what he appears to have been working on in 'setupap.log'. LAN works - "Netelligent 10/100TX PCI Embedded UTP/AUI Controller" listed. So apparently, with the occasional reboot (one last week) - it's been serving the non-phone side for some months, free of sentient intervention, including today. No web service (that is elsewhere) - so this has to handle the firewall (no idea what ap), LAN, printer sharing - next, ISDN. File sharing appears to be via a 'drive J:' as seen on workstations. (As sys previously was a node on Corp network - as Peter says: it could handle it then, no doubt it still can). We'll try to get the tech on the line for instrument landing instructions, after new box arrives. Didn't find much resembling a Help system, but may well have missed it.. wtf is a server GUI for, if not drawing pretty Helpful pictures ? A diagram of the network with labels, say - might have been interesting. Saw nothing in what Sysinfo there is re service packs; missed any display of hdwre, drivers, etc. as in 9x. 192 MB, no idea what the cpu is except - there's 1, not 2. More sleuthing anon. Gracias for the tips.. Ashton
Post #6,020 by static 8/21/01 2:49:53 AM Reply	SP level clues. There's a tool called Windows Diagnostics or something like that. It's in the Start Menu, not in the Control Panel. I think it's in the Adminstration Tools. It tells you the exact SP level installed. It probably won't be SP2. If you're going to stick with Win2k, then I'd open the Administration console and turn off all the services you don't need. For instance, if it's not being a web server, turn off IIS and the Indexing Service. Wade. "All around me are nothing but fakes Come with me on the biggest fake of all!"
Post #6,024 by Ashton 8/21/01 4:23:07 AM Reply	Thanks - on the list. Hmmm - I hope it wasn't Admin Tools (rather than Sys Tools) where I found only the disk clean-up -defrag I suppose, so it's gotta be FAT- and another which wasn't Diagnostics. Now I have to wonder if a bunch of things got deleted. What records I saw showed only rare 'actions' on this server. Time for forensics. Wish I could run an unerase ap and see when these disappeared. Damn.. Symantec for 2K? As to remaining with W2K.. All our micro-wars come home to roost in the Question, "which choice is likely to cause them the least, integrated grief/day" ?? If as Peter says - Ghost won't (work? work well enough to bet on?) - then a bad glitch would mean RRR. They couldn't do it. Dunno if I want to learn enough about 2K to feel confident I could (anytime and quickly), either. If I'm going to put in that much energy, best be towards ~Debian - for the future - not to salvage the past. (And if I got W2K cooled ..? How long til it's rendered unmaintainable by intent?) Then too, and as Peter has claimed about 2K: this install has performed adequately thus far (!) Now if it's been sabotaged.. \ufffd \ufffd I guess it has to come down to, eventually - for them too: The W2K path seems to lead to only increasing agony, costs and ultimately NET-like total control of their data and their options. As in our general er discussions. Guess I have a chance to try out the trade-offs; it also comes down to psych, availability of local people - as much as tech - in the end ;-) Nothing's simple since the Sinclair! Arrrggghhhh. A. Why Me, God ? ..because You. Piss. Me. Off.
Post #6,025 by static 8/21/01 5:46:45 AM Reply	Try looking in Accessories. I've found that Microsoft move stuff around with each release of Windows (guess where Windows Explorer is in W2k) but people often do, too. At my last position, the CTO was absolutely anal about the Start Menu, the Desktop and the TaskBar on the servers. (Of course, I wouldn't have used W2k in the first place...) Wade. "All around me are nothing but fakes Come with me on the biggest fake of all!"

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