Yep.

Post #9,875 by addison 9/20/01 1:54:38 PM Reply	Yep. Not that it matters. We trained him to fight the Soviets, in a guerilla war. He decided to become a terrorist. Not that we probably didn't encourage that thought. But that doesn't matter. Should we somehow go after the US Army for Timothy McVeigh? But they trained him. Or who trained him to drive? No. Bin Ladin has been protected by Afganistan for 4 years - and during those 4 years apparently has devised and set into motion multiple plans for attacking innocent bystanders - not just Americans, but many nationalities. They're not blameless anymore. And they know it. They'd promised his behavior, and now its not excusable by any stretch. And they're culpable as he is... You're saying we should sit down and talk with the people who enabled him to run his terrorist empire. I've got a problem with that. They know how to get out of this. They hand him over with apologies, and radio addresses claiming they didn't know, and its not the way of Islam. Addison
Post #9,877 by brettj 9/20/01 2:01:19 PM Reply	The courts of International Law will make those decisions. First we get the key people involved and then we can find out who helped them and who didn't. In other words we need more facts before the International Coalition can make judgements. If the U.S. starts violating International Laws, then we are no better than those we will bring to justice. Will you listen to the President when he asks for patience, or is he as "off-base" as I am? :)
Post #9,879 by addison 9/20/01 2:09:09 PM Reply	You mean, the ones who don't... Have a concept of Freedom of Speech, for instance? As far as I know, there are no international courts claiming jurisdiction. And the concept of them is probably very faulty. Most governments have a completely different concept of "freedom" than the US was founded on, and still has. Will you listen to the President when he asks for patience, or is he as "off-base" as I am? :) Who has said not to be patient? I said that there's no reason to wait for/on the Taliban to discuss or come to an agreement. There's not. I'm not saying we need to rush into anything - but neither do we need to obey the Taliban's timeline. They've got no standing anymore, except as possible targets/defendants. They're not disassociating themselves from the main target, with lots of prior warning and knowledge. They're stalling, trying to negotiate. So far, they've not advanced a starting position worth taking even at face value. Addison
Post #9,884 by brettj 9/20/01 2:19:18 PM Reply	As just heard on CNN, the Clerics are waiting for a U.S. ... ... response. If we respect their decision to ask bin Laden to leave then they will work with us. If we reject their authority to rule in their own land, then we get a Jihad instead. I prefer to try to work with them in order to end ALL terrorism? I suspect we'll need their help to fight other groups too. Terrorism must be dismantled bit by bit until we gets to the roots and causes. This takes wisdom, not bombs. People will have to decide if they want to continue to help evil or start cooperating to achieve peace and justice. Those that don't want to change their ways should be prosecuted to the full extent of world law, in my opinion.
Post #9,893 by bepatient 9/20/01 2:43:35 PM Reply	Wording... ..they are still referring to the man as their "guest". We won't, nor should we, accept that as a decision. They are as much our enemy as Bin Laden. They offer safe harbor to terrorists. This is not a time for patience...they view our patience as weakness. You were born...and so you're free...so Happy Birthday! _{Laurie Anderson} [link\|mailto:bepatient@aol.com\|BePatient]
Post #9,896 by addison 9/20/01 2:50:05 PM Reply	Which raises the question.. People will have to decide if they want to continue to help evil or start cooperating to achieve peace and justice. People are not created equal, at least in mindset. Which raises the question who do you want to "cooperate" with. Do you want to help people who stone women for speaking? If we respect their decision to ask bin Laden to leave then they will work with us. That's BS. Ok, ok, ok, Binnie did all sorts of bad things and organized plots to kill thousands, and we helped, but tell ya what, we'll tell him to leave, and not come back, Deal? That's not cooperating. That's saying "screw you and the horse you rode in on". The Taliban promised that he would behave. They assured that he was not working on terrorists acts. They're culpable and responsible. How much do you want to work with them? Meanwhile, their "demands" were that if we give THEM money, and STOP giving money to those heretical moderates (Who apparently don't stone women, but still don't think much of them). So. They want our "international aid" - in other words, give us money. And we'll kick him out. Maybe. When he wants to go. Nah, that's utter horseshit. If they want to go to war, well, they're about to find out the only way you can about the Truth of God's Existance. Terrorism must be dismantled bit by bit until we gets to the roots and causes. This takes wisdom, not bombs. How does it take wisdom? The problem with "terrorists" is that any cause can start with such an act. Anti-abortionists. Anti-government. Anti-Roses-in-the-town-park. Wisdom doesn't (always) deal with disgruntled people. It doesn't deal with criminials or the insane. Sometimes, you have to have a response, and show you're willing to have, and use such a response. But if you want to live what you're saying, go over - and be sure to take your daughters (if you have them), if not, find some female family members for the grand trek, and let us know how the 1600s feels like. Addison

Welcome to IWETHEY!