Post #89,798
3/20/03 1:47:23 PM
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The Bush Doctrine
The paper:
[link|http://www.whitehouse.gov/nsc/nss.html|http://www.whitehouse.gov/nsc/nss.html]
Some discussion:
[link|http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/iraq/themes/assess.html|http://www.pbs.org/w...hemes/assess.html]
A quote:
This grand strategy is actually looking toward the culmination of the Wilsonian project of a world safe for democracy, even in the Middle East. And this long-term dimension of it, it seems to me, goes beyond what we've seen in the thinking of more recent administrations. It is more characteristic of the kind of thinking, say, that the Truman administration was doing at the beginning of the Cold War -- thinking not only about what do we have to do tomorrow, and what do we have to do next week, but where do we want to come out at the end of this process.
Iraq is just the beginning...
Regards,
John Urberg
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Post #89,802
3/20/03 1:50:34 PM
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Re: The Bush Doctrine
This is utter horseshit.
Wilson was born before the Civil War, in the South, when Europe was ruled by monarchies for the most part. What he wanted was an organ for world cooperation and joint action. It was shot to pieces by the isolationist opportunists - Republicans - in Congress.
-drl
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Post #89,819
3/20/03 2:46:51 PM
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Do you understand what you are saying?
Iraq is just the beginning... I'm getting a definate sense of Marlowe here. So, now it is open season on other countries? And you seem to think this is a good idea. Do you think North Korea will just let the US invade? If not, do you think any other country would? Welcome to Global Nuclear Proliferation.
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Post #89,829
3/20/03 3:41:27 PM
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Re: Do you understand what you are saying?
Read the links.
- The US will help Iraq setup a democratic government.
- A democracy will be a destabilizing force in a middle east filled with authoritarion regimes
- With the encouragement of the US, democracy will spread throught the middle east
Could it happen? Who knows. But it's sure worth a try.
Regards,
John Urberg
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Post #89,830
3/20/03 3:54:12 PM
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If we're trying to promote Democracy...
how do you explain this administration support for Turkey to invade the Kurdish (democratic) regions of Iraq?
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Post #89,833
3/20/03 4:19:40 PM
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Re: Do you understand what you are saying?
WE hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness -- That to secure these Rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the Consent of the Governed, that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these Ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its Foundation on such Principles, and organizing its Powers in such Form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. -TJ
Could it happen? Who knows. But it's sure worth a try.
-drl
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Post #89,866
3/20/03 5:48:10 PM
3/20/03 5:50:48 PM
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That was a 'Strike' - powerful point !!!
I read John U as being sincere but falling for the mistake of believing Bush & admin are genuine re spreading democracy.
John, you are on the right track but what Bush & admin are achieving is ensuring a happy world for US, not really a happy world for others.
Ask yourself what happens to people who feel they are second class and powerless. Why (for example) would Arabs feel happy if they see *their* world controlled and influenced by an alien culture that many of them do not like. It may be hard to grasp just how much other peoples of the world look down on the 'Rock-Coke-Burger' Gen-X indulgence. Where did Ossama Bin Laden really come from - was he simply a born murderer who loves killing Americans or is he symptomatic of a people who resent having their destiny controlled by a power they don't like and don't respect. OBL is just the begining of US's worst nightmare in terms of hostile suicide jihadists.
Cheers
Doug Marker
Spectres from our past: Beware the future when your children & theirs come after you for what you may have been willing to condone today - dsm 2003
Motivational: When performing activities, ask yourself if the person you most want to be would do, or say, it - dsm 2003
Edited by dmarker
March 20, 2003, 05:50:48 PM EST
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Post #89,845
3/20/03 4:43:58 PM
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A Democratic Afghanistan would serve as well.
Yet we STILL haven't managed that.
And Bush FORGOT to include funding in the budget.
How do you explain that it is "worth a shot" when our LAST attempt in the area is STILL a disaster?
Rather than risk TWO such disasters, the BETTER risk would be to bring Democracy to Afghanistan.
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Post #89,864
3/20/03 5:46:44 PM
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Trying is good
They should perhaps consider trying in some of the places a little closer to home where they've been supporting authoritarian regimes for decades.
They might also want to take a more serious try at Afghanistan, where they said the same thing, but have yet to actually do much other than protect the government in Kabul from being murdered by their own citizens.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #91,404
3/25/03 1:24:29 PM
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Re: Trying is good
They should perhaps consider trying in some of the places a little closer to home where they've been supporting authoritarian regimes for decades. Yeah...like Florida! jb4
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning."
Rich Cook
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Post #91,402
3/25/03 1:21:56 PM
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But Brandi...G.N.P. is good for the GNP!
jb4
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning."
Rich Cook
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