You may have seen them...

Post #45,461 by ben_tilly 7/13/02 1:41:40 PM Reply	You may have seen them... But did you understand the context at that age? From the start the show had the goal of pushing a [link\|http://www.museum.tv/archives/etv/H/htmlH/hensonjim/hensonjim.htm\|social agenda]. Then you might not have realized that it was somewhat controversial. Now you do. Cheers, Ben "... I couldn't see how anyone could be educated by this self-propagating system in which people pass exams, teach others to pass exams, but nobody knows anything." --Richard Feynman
Post #45,475 by Ashton 7/13/02 3:46:06 PM Reply	..but 'Social Agenda' has such__such____'connotations' Y'know? I guess you could call... In skits, songs, and other performances they epitomized the social skills fundamental to Sesame Street's mission--cooperation, understanding, tolerance and respect. ..a "social agenda" alright, but - Whom? Would It Offend ?? ('Agenda' is a word now Fully-Loaded, whatever the context) Ditto Mr. Rogers, an adult who appears to fully comprehend the sorts of things which frighten young children - as they watch the adults around them shouting and carrying on over mysterious Words.. But I guess this is just another case wherein a merely descriptive word has come to join the cacophony indicated by, say Right to 'Life' A Woman's Ownership of Her Body and all the other 'issues' in the automatic war of opposites. (I do wonder though - what 'opposite' to the above agenda is in some minds.. as find these ideas also subversive ??) Ashton
Post #45,483 by Brandioch 7/13/02 4:33:05 PM Reply	I can support that "agenda". In skits, songs, and other performances they epitomized the social skills fundamental to Sesame Street's mission--cooperation, understanding, tolerance and respect. You have to remember the time frame we're talking about here. 1963 - Gov. George C. Wallace stood in the doorway at the University of Alabama in an attempt to block two black students from enrolling. 1964 - It finally becomes illegal to post "no niggers need apply" in job announcements. 1965 - It becomes illegal to use poll taxes or tests to disqualify blacks from registering and voting. 1969 - Sesame Street 1988 - Congress overrides President Regan's veto of the Civil Rights Restoration Act making it ILLEGAL for private organizations that receive government funds to discriminate based upon colour (and so forth). For that time, NOT being a small minded bigot WAS a pretty radical change. And an "agenda" to show that "different" is NOT "evil" was very liberal.
Post #45,490 by ben_tilly 7/13/02 7:25:18 PM Reply	Exactly And don't forget various race riots, forced integration through bussing in Boston circa 1974, and other more minor conflicts. Cooperation, understanding, tolerance and respect between puppets of different colors might sound utterly blase. But it wasn't so in the context of its times. Cheers, Ben "... I couldn't see how anyone could be educated by this self-propagating system in which people pass exams, teach others to pass exams, but nobody knows anything." --Richard Feynman
Post #45,503 by Ashton 7/13/02 9:58:22 PM Reply	Yes, the times were like that but the same hypocrisy existed: that is, I'd still think it unlikely that anyone would have overtly countered.. such an 'agenda' as was stated. There were no self-proclaimed bigots then or now. Yet too.. It's Not Easy Being Green musta pissed-off a whole next generation of the gent-eel. (as silently) Of course I was (mostly) in California and the experience of these other savage lands was vicarious - via sound pix of the folks with dogs and firehoses and such, and personal reports of intrepid travellers who had lived to tell of their experiences among heathens. Not all did live, of course. CA had its share of the afflicted natch - they just weren't allowed to lynch or set dogs; just spread nastiness. But yes, I can see that in the boardrooms wherein was discussed the need not to upset anyone (especially not a Sponsor) - no muppet would ever be seen. Commercially. An MBA is about learning non-controversy, guts optional. (Guess too, that Henson was on some hit-lists along with PBS, accordingly. Only some Commie could think of such a message.) Kinda brings a lump to the throat. Ashton
Post #45,489 by orion 7/13/02 7:22:04 PM Reply	What I understood were that muppets were fakes, usually pupets with someone's hand stuck up their butt or proped up on sticks. It was fun pretending they were real monsters, etc. What really scared me was the McDonald characters. Ronald McDonald, I had nightmares about him really being a vampire who wore clown makeup to appear on cameras. In one nightmare he came to my school, I went to meet him before anyone else did, and found him putting on the makeup and wig, before he retracted his fangs and turned his eyes to look normal. He sent a bunch of Bat-Like Golden Arches after me, and the rest of the kids in my school got turned into Vampires or Werewolfs and went chasing after me. *I am free now, to choose my own destiny.*
Post #45,501 by Ashton 7/13/02 9:27:48 PM Reply	Those weren't nightmares. Somehow you scoped in on a Board of Directors meeting re seeking new markets for the infrastructure, post-2000. Be very afraid (still). Now if you never lost sight of the fact of what 'muppets' really were, while watching.. then perhaps you were doomed to a certain literal view. (Sorry - you were supposed to "suspend disbelief" for a while, as I understand it.) Ashton

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