I really don't understand this line of argument at all.

Post #401,543 by Another Scott 5/6/15 2:12:43 PM Reply	I really don't understand this line of argument at all. Similarly with Cheney's "OMG! Secret oil policy meetings!!11". What matters is the policy proposals that come out at the end. If the proposals are bad, then Congress should vote them down. If you don't like the proposals, then elect people who will negotiate better ones. That's the way our system works. https://www.whitehouse.gov/issues/economy/trade My $0.02. Cheers, Scott.
Post #401,565 by mmoffitt 5/7/15 10:31:41 AM Reply	Maybe this will help. We might agree that elected officials should not have to expose the details of an in-process treaty negotiation, but that is NOT what is going on with these trade deals. Corporate lobbyists and Corporate Board of Directors are negotiating these deals on behalf of the American People. If you're going to say that it is okay for Corporate [SIC] Citizens to write these deals I can't see how you can argue against allowing Human Citizens to see what these Corporate Citizens are up to in process. Particularly when these Corporate [SIC] Citizens are negotiating in the Human Citizens name.
Post #401,572 by Another Scott 5/7/15 11:33:19 AM Reply	Did you visit the WhiteHouse linky that talks about the process?
Post #401,574 by mmoffitt 5/7/15 11:47:10 AM Reply	The propaganda site? All you need to do is read the first paragraph to realize that everything on that site is worse than anything Правда ever dared to print. President Obama’s trade agenda is dedicated to expanding economic opportunity for American workers, farmers, ranchers, and businesses. That’s why we are negotiating the Trans-Pacific Partnership, a 21st century trade agreement that will boost U.S. economic growth, support American jobs, and grow Made-in-America exports to some of the most dynamic and fastest growing countries in the world. Translation: President Obama's trade agenda is dedicated to expanding the already obscene wealth of the top 1% and even more to the top 0.01% by having the wealth of the American workers, farmers, ranchers and small business employees funnelled up by forcing those workers to compete with the low wages and oft times inhumane working conditions of developing nations. That's why we are having some of the world's largest multi-national corporations negotiate the Trans-Pacific Partnership, a 21st century trade agreement of, for and by the world's largest multi-national corporations that will boost shareholder value, further depress the wages of American jobs and export those jobs to some of the poorest countries in the world, just as NAFTA did before it.
Post #401,576 by Another Scott 5/7/15 12:11:17 PM Reply	It has verifiable assertions. Things like they're getting input from labor unions, etc. Stuff you don't hear about if you only read sites that think that any trade agreement is designed to enslave us all, or something. What does the AFL-CIO say? I’ve heard “labor” has a seat at the table and gets to see the TPP texts. Is this true? No. Under U.S. law, there are several trade advisers—private citizens appointed by the President—who advise on trade policies. Of these advisers, the vast majority (85% according to the Washington Post) represent businesses. About 5% of the advisers represent labor. The other 10% represent local and state government officials, academics, think tanks and non-governmental organizations. Labor advisers are allowed to review and advise on draft U.S. proposals—advice that the United States Trade Representative (USTR) can freely ignore. But we are locked out of the negotiating room and cannot see the actual negotiating texts, which combine the proposals from all 12 countries and evolve over time as negotiations progress. Nor can we share what we learn with members without violating national security laws. What's the beginning of the answer? "Under US Law". Obama is following the law. Unpossible. So, they do have input on the proposals. But they're not negotiating and they're not sitting at the actual negotiating table. Does anyone really think they should be at the actual negotiating table? I don't - that's not their role. Similarly, big business is advising. State and local governments are advising. The actual people at the negotiating table are official negotiators. FWIW. Cheers, Scott.
Post #401,577 by mmoffitt 5/7/15 12:16:31 PM 5/7/15 12:17:17 PM Reply	You meant "Unsurprising" not "Unpossible." Who writes those laws? The same corporate lobbyists that are sitting at the TPP table deciding how much more of the world's wealth they can divide among themselves. Edits: It loses so much when snark has to be edited. ;0) Edited by mmoffitt May 7, 2015, 12:16:49 PM EDT Edited by mmoffitt May 7, 2015, 12:17:17 PM EDT Expand All History
Post #401,579 by Another Scott 5/7/15 1:48:11 PM Reply	rofl. :-)

Welcome to IWETHEY!