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New Fresh Air: the roulette wheel is...
dodgy. "Are you sure this place is honest?" "Honest? As honest as the day is long!"
"The stock market is rigged," Michael Lewis tells Fresh Air's Terry Gross. "It's rigged for the benefit for really a handful of insiders. It's rigged to ... maximize the take of Wall Street, of banks, the exchanges and the high-frequency traders at the expense of ordinary investors."

Lewis is the author of several books about the world of finance, including Liar's Poker and The Big Short. His new book Flash Boys is about the form of computerized transactions known as high-frequency trading, in which the fastest computers with the highest connection speeds get the information first, and make the trade before anyone else can. A millisecond — even a nanosecond — can make all the difference between how much money is made or lost on any transaction.
Infuriating. "It divides the market into predators and prey." 'Twas ever thus, of course, but the predators today are sharper-fanged, and much, much faster.

Take it down, goddamnit. Take down the whole rotten structure of late-stage capitalism. Even hunter-gathering would be better than this.

http://www.npr.org/2...ll-the-difference

disgruntledly,
New Special place in e-Hell is reserved for those
who have mindlessly fed new techno gadgetry to the manifestly despicables (usually for a sop.)
(Oppie warned that physicists now knew sin.. but that was just the beginning of androgynous techno-whoredom--like This.)

It also seems that (as I listen on..) the whistleblowers here: already $M/yr. fat-cats--the ones who spoke out--were, mainly immigrants.
Actually, the dis-USA IS exceptional.

Will meaningless-digital 'money' bring on this overdue dissolution, the requisite blood--then the New-Constitution written on bearskins?
(Ursula Le Guin already used the title for today, The Dispossessed.)


I 'pledge allegiance to'--whatever finally gets our sordid history expunged, if not yet satisfyingly avenged.
New too bad I only had 3 months doing that
So, do I get 3 months in hell then probation?

And it is not front running dammit.

Seller: I have 20,000 shares of IBM right now. I offer it for 100 per share.
Buyer 1: gimme 100 shares.
Seller: cool got a bite, here you go.
Seller: I have 19,900 share of IBM right now. I offer it for 105 per share.
Buyer 2 (who only saw the 1st announcement because he's only human): gimme 20,000 shares for 100 per share.
Seller: no, you are too slow, you can't have it. The current price is 105 and I only have 19,900, take it or leave it.
Buyer 2: wawawa, somebody is front running me.
New The NPR linky seems to be talking about someting else.
Isn't it?

Cheers,
Scott.
New no, it is a series of assumptions
It isn't talking about anything specific other than the fact that guy THOUGHT his transactions were being sniffed, bought before he could, then offered for sale at a higher price. That type of activity IS illegal, and if/when it happens, will be caught.
He is simply guessing and accusing with no proof.
His solution of hit multiple exchanges for the order at the same time fixes THIS scenario (which is also perfectly reasonable):

Seller on exchange 1 makes a deal to sell 100 shares of something.
This sale is announced to the world (legal requirement). The transaction data feed is sent to all the other exchanges in real time, as fast as the wire (or fiber or microwave) can. Far faster than most end users are capable of being connected to the exchange.
Seller on exchange 2 has the same stock, sees there is interest, and bumps up his price a bit.

No front running, nothing illegal.
The guy is simply pushing his own exchange and bad mouthing the others, grasping at bullshit straws, and you fall for it.
New So this is all false?
https://www.youtube....tch?v=itxbyXO67XY
Alex

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”

-- Isaac Asimov
New No idea
I haven't been exposed to it, so I can't comment.
But that wasn't what the top posted article was referring to.
New Think of it as a small tax on all your stock transactions!
The FBI is taking a look:

http://online.wsj.co...79473874181722310

"Probe Centers on Whether It's Insider Trading When High-Frequency Traders Act on Information Others Can't See."

If the SEC doesn't care, and so far they've called it innovation, nothing will happen.
Alex

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”

-- Isaac Asimov
New It's not so much "investors" getting screwed . . .
. . it's the wanabe sharks feeling the teeth of the real sharks - the small time traders trying to "get rich quick" getting munched by the pros.

I don't engage in "trading", so it's not an immediate concern for me - but I do agree that this "high speed trading" stuff should be ended with threats of criminal prosecution. The little guys should get to have some fun too.

Of course, commodities are far rougher. The Hunt Brothers daddy told them never to touch the commodities market, but they thought their wealth would allow them to beat the pros. Both were forced into bankruptcy. Though they have been rebuilding their fortunes in the oil industry, I think they now respect daddy's advice.
New Baker says a transaction tax would fix it.
http://www.cepr.net/...d-economic-policy

This book is seeming to prompt outrage, although it is not clear exactly why. The basic story of high frequency trading is not new. It has been reported in most major news outlets over the last few years. It would be nice if we could move beyond the outrage to a serious discussion of the policy issues and ideally some simple and reasonable policy to address the issue. (Yes, simple should be front and center. If it's complicated we will be employing people in pointless exercises -- perhaps a good job program, but bad from the standpoint of effective policy.)

The issue here is that people are earning large amounts of money by using sophisticated computers to beat the market. This is effectively a form of insider trading. Pure insider trading, for example trading based on the CEO giving advance knowledge of better than expected profits, is illegal. The reason is that it rewards people for doing nothing productive at the expense of honest investors.

On the other hand, there are people who make large amounts of money by doing good research to get ahead of the market. For example, many analysts may carefully study weather patterns to get an estimate of the size of the wheat crop and then either buy or sell wheat based on what they have learned about the about this year's crop relative to the generally held view. In principle, we can view the rewards for this activity as being warranted since they are effectively providing information to the market with the their trades. If they recognize an abundant wheat crop will lead to lower prices, their sales of wheat will cause the price to fall before it would otherwise, thereby allowing the markets to adjust more quickly. The gains to the economy may not in all cases be equal to the private gains to these traders, but at least they are providing some service.

By contrast, the front-running high speed trader, like the inside trader, is providing no information to the market. They are causing the price of stocks to adjust milliseconds more quickly than would otherwise be the case. It is implausible that this can provide any benefit to the economy. This is simply siphoning off money at the expense of other actors in the market.

There are many complicated ways to try to address this problem, but there is one simple method that would virtually destroy the practice. A modest tax on financial transactions would make this sort of rapid trading unprofitable since it depends on extremely small margins. A bill proposed by Senator Tom Harkin and Representative Peter DeFazio would impose a 0.03 percent tax on all trades of stocks, bonds, and derivatives. This would quickly wipe out the high-frequency trading industry while having a trivial impact on normal investors. (Most research indicates that other investors will reduce their trading roughly in proportion to the increase in the cost per trade, leaving their total trading costs unchanged.)The Joint Tax Committee projected that this tax would raise roughly $400 billion over a decade.

A scaled tax that imposed a somewhat higher fee on stock trades and lower fee on short-term assets like options could be even more effective. Japan had a such tax in place in the 1980s and early 1990s. It raised more than 1 percent of GDP ($170 billion a year in the United States). Representative Keith Ellison has proposed this sort of tax for the United States.


I like the idea of a transactions tax for lots of reasons, but I'm not sure it addresses all of the variations that could be envisioned. The NPR linky seems to be talking about effectively cornering a market (for short period of time anyway) to prevent someone from making a purchase at a price that they have agreed to pay. It's not making money on a big bet with a tiny spread - it's putting a brake switch on the roulette wheel...

Cheers,
Scott.
New How is this news?
New Re: How is this news?
It's news because there's a book coming out on the subject, which presumably will have far more detail than has been available in news reports.
     Fresh Air: the roulette wheel is... - (rcareaga) - (11)
         Special place in e-Hell is reserved for those - (Ashton) - (5)
             too bad I only had 3 months doing that - (crazy) - (4)
                 The NPR linky seems to be talking about someting else. - (Another Scott) - (1)
                     no, it is a series of assumptions - (crazy)
                 So this is all false? - (a6l6e6x) - (1)
                     No idea - (crazy)
         Think of it as a small tax on all your stock transactions! - (a6l6e6x)
         It's not so much "investors" getting screwed . . . - (Andrew Grygus)
         Baker says a transaction tax would fix it. - (Another Scott)
         How is this news? -NT - (mmoffitt) - (1)
             Re: How is this news? - (jake123)

How convenient is that??
56 ms