True, why does debt not count?

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Post #260,909

by drewk

7/6/06 1:55:47 PM

True, why does debt not count?

One of the articles about Lay said the concept of finality holds that the state doesn't really consider someone "guilty" until they've exhausted all appeals.

Let's say I've got some heavy-duty debt. I tell the creditors I don't intend to pay them back, and never did plan to. That makes it theft, right? But that's civil, not criminal ... why? And why does that obligation outlive you, but criminal forfeiture doesn't? How would I get my debt turned into a criminal matter so I can have it wiped out by my death?

Now there's some creative estate planning for you.

===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]

Post #260,913

by Simon_Jester

7/6/06 2:08:03 PM

7/6/06 2:08:48 PM

The criminal charges are dropped

but the civil charges can go forward.

The trouble in Lay's case is that, without the criminal charges (and conviction) can the civil charges go forward? Did Lay commit a crime when he was CEO? If he didn't, why do you think you (or anyone else) is owed money from the Lay Estate?

Here's a good one for you though. Let's say you're a big time CEO and you're committing bad things left and right. The government is onto you. You've been convicted (but not sentenanced) and the government is looking at coming for your $40 million.

And your wife decided that she might want 40 million a lot more than visiting you in jail.

Edited by Simon_Jester July 6, 2006, 02:08:48 PM EDT

Expand All History

Ken Lay, Enron founder, dead. - (bepatient) - (24) - July 5, 2006, 10:44:42 AM EDT

I must have my tinfoil beanie on too tight - (drewk) - (5) - July 5, 2006, 11:20:52 AM EDT

Not really.... - (Simon_Jester) - (2) - July 5, 2006, 11:30:43 AM EDT

Or maybe your beanie is tuned to the same frequency as mine -NT - (drewk) - (1) - July 5, 2006, 11:55:59 AM EDT

Nyah...we just saying its possible.... - (Simon_Jester) - July 5, 2006, 12:01:41 PM EDT

Mine was tighter - (broomberg) - (1) - July 5, 2006, 07:10:56 PM EDT

I agree - (imqwerky) - July 5, 2006, 07:18:08 PM EDT

justice got cheated - (lincoln) - (14) - July 5, 2006, 12:12:24 PM EDT

Sure, he got off lucky cause he's DEAD. - (bepatient) - (9) - July 5, 2006, 12:15:48 PM EDT

tell you what - (lincoln) - (8) - July 5, 2006, 11:28:33 PM EDT

What---evah. -NT - (bepatient) - July 5, 2006, 11:37:54 PM EDT

you're going a bit hard-core....but there are better - (Simon_Jester) - (6) - July 6, 2006, 09:31:01 AM EDT

He was already convicted. - (bepatient) - (5) - July 6, 2006, 10:46:10 AM EDT

It was on appeal.... - (Simon_Jester) - (4) - July 6, 2006, 12:56:47 PM EDT

Is forfeiture "punishment"? - (drewk) - (3) - July 6, 2006, 01:15:44 PM EDT

Don't forget those you could possibly - (folkert) - (2) - July 6, 2006, 01:33:35 PM EDT

True, why does debt not count? - (drewk) - (1) - July 6, 2006, 01:55:47 PM EDT

The criminal charges are dropped - (Simon_Jester) - July 6, 2006, 02:08:48 PM EDT

Could've been worse. - (Simon_Jester) - July 5, 2006, 01:07:38 PM EDT

Just had a little chat with DEATH - (Ashton) - (2) - July 5, 2006, 10:34:56 PM EDT

Unfortunately, he won't care. - (admin) - July 5, 2006, 10:47:09 PM EDT

That reminds me... (new thread) - (imqwerky) - July 5, 2006, 11:01:53 PM EDT

Don't believe it. - (mmoffitt) - July 5, 2006, 02:11:31 PM EDT

Guess it really *was* a life sentence, after all.... -NT - (jb4) - July 5, 2006, 04:19:35 PM EDT

Here's the funny thing - (drewk) - July 6, 2006, 08:58:27 AM EDT

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