Post #238,685
12/20/05 5:59:03 PM
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Probably was inevitable.
Most of the population is Shia, with a strong religious bent. We probably didn't help things either, but when Mr. Hussein came down there really wasn't anybody in the wings ready to take his place.
When somebody asks you to trade your freedom for security, it isn't your security they're talking about.
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Post #238,688
12/20/05 6:18:26 PM
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So, the US solved no problem, gets blamed for all others.
Matthew Greet
Choose Life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family. Choose a fucking big television, choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol, and dental insurance. Choose fixed interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisurewear and matching luggage. Choose DIY and wondering who the fuck you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing, spirit-crushing game shows, stuffing fucking junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing your last in a miserable home, nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, fucked up brats you spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life... But why would I want to do a thing like that? I chose not to choose life. I chose somethin' else. And the reasons? There are no reasons. Who needs reasons when you've got heroin?
- Mark Renton, Trainspotting.
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Post #238,694
12/20/05 6:35:14 PM
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one more small step to solve the Saudi Arabian problem
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #238,889
12/21/05 7:35:08 PM
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How? Getting rid of the evil fanatic Wahabbite tyrants...
...by paving the way for Iran to invade Saudi Arabia and replace them with evil fanatic Shiite tyrants?
Some "solution".
[link|mailto:MyUserId@MyISP.CountryCode|Christian R. Conrad]
(I live in Finland, and my e-mail in-box is at the Saunalahti company.)
Yes Mr. Garrison, genetic engineering lets us correct God's horrible, horrible mistakes, like German people. - [link|http://maxpages.com/southpark2k/Episode_105|Mr. Hat]
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Post #238,893
12/21/05 7:43:25 PM
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yep, absolutely
they will be so busy cutting each others throats from Muritania to the hindu kush maybe they will forget about us.
thanx,
bill
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #238,908
12/21/05 10:26:34 PM
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But first, they will turn off the oil to the US.
Casus belli, eh wot?
Alex
The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #238,918
12/22/05 2:31:22 AM
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Then I get my greenhouse - a $500 HumVee. Silver lining :-)
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Post #238,920
12/22/05 2:54:45 AM
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You sure you're not talking about a 50$ hummer?
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #238,954
12/22/05 11:13:16 AM
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50$ hummer is something else entirly
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Post #238,940
12/22/05 10:23:33 AM
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got a lot of oil in Alaska we arnt using
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #238,942
12/22/05 10:28:43 AM
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Cool... have it ready by Wednesday, ok?
They can have less dependent cars before they have significant new production there.
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Post #238,968
12/22/05 12:29:54 PM
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Big whoop. 1 year's supply.
And it would be extracted over a 20 year period, so it only supplies 5% of our needs each year.
This is not the level of resource that will support us becoming far more wasteful than we are today.
Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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Post #238,975
12/22/05 1:16:36 PM
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Some more numbers.
[link|http://www.doi.gov/news/030312.htm|10.4 B barrels "technically recoverable", 1.4 Mbbl/day estimated production]. That would give 20.3 years at 1.4 Mbbl/day (real production rates will almost certainly fall after a peak).
The [link|http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/international/petroleu.html#IntlConsumption|EIA] has an XLS file that says the US consumption in June 2005 was 21.2 Mbbl/day, and [link|http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/international/petroleu.html#IntlConsumption|EIA] has an XLS file that says that the US production in June 2005 was 5.4 Mbbl/day.
Similarly, the [link|http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/international/petroleu.html#IntlConsumption|EIA] says that US Net Imports were 12.8 Mbbl/day in June 2005.
So if you accept all of the above, then ANWAR could decrease net oil imports by 1.4/12.8 = 10.9% - a not-insignificant amount. But, by the time ANWAR oil was on the market, it's probably safe to assume that US net imports would be larger than 12.8 Mbbl/day, giving ANWAR a smaller piece of the pie. But it may also be the case that pressure on oil markets will be larger by that time (due to increased imports by China and India) so that any increase in production will help reduce pressure on the market.
ANWAR clearly isn't a panacea, and won't be a big part of the solution to the oil import problem we have. It would help some, but, e.g., improving efficiency in transportation would help much more.
FWIW.
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #238,981
12/22/05 1:39:47 PM
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Something you gotta realise
The tar sands are coming on line. Those are SA sized reserves, and they're right next door in a friendly country.
We'll expect to be paid for the oil, but we're not going to expect blood for it.
I'd leave ANWR alone; it's a drop in the bucket next to the tar sands, and there aren't the same kinds of concerns; there's not a lot of wildlife there as grass doesn't grow too well in bitumen-soaked sand.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #239,040
12/22/05 5:21:32 PM
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we know why you want to leave anwr alone
you're sucking it dry from your side of the line :-) forgot those delta drilling plans?
thanx,
bill
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #238,970
12/22/05 12:51:35 PM
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's not that much
"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" --Mark Twain
"The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them." --Albert Einstein
"This is still a dangerous world. It's a world of madmen and uncertainty and potential mental losses." --George W. Bush
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Post #238,979
12/22/05 1:33:59 PM
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Kewl!
We won't have to nuke Medina and Mecca after all...they'll do it themselves for us!
(But, we'll get blamed for it, of course...)
jb4
shrub●bish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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Post #239,041
12/22/05 5:22:52 PM
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like I always said, how many shiites were on the 911 planes?
"the reason people don't buy conspiracy theories is that they think conspiracy means everyone is on the same program. Thats not how it works. Everybody has a different program. They just all want the same guy dead. Socrates was a gadfly, but I bet he took time out to screw somebodies wife" Gus Vitelli
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #239,247
12/23/05 3:14:12 PM
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How many Afghanis and Iraqis were?
I know, I'm not arguing the righteousness of attacking Afghanistan. But Saudi Arabia needs to be turned into glass. Then we put Asimov's Robots out there to suck up the oil.
bcnu,
Mikem
It would seem, therefore, that the three human impulses embodied in religion are fear, conceit, and hatred. The purpose of religion, one might say, is to give an air of respectibility to these passions. -- Bertrand Russell
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Post #238,756
12/21/05 10:29:26 AM
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Hard to say
Most of the population is Shia, with a strong religious bent. We probably didn't help things either, but when Mr. Hussein came down there really wasn't anybody in the wings ready to take his place. By middle eastern standards the Iraqi population was educated, secular and moderate prior to the war. The war seems to have done a lot to radicalize the population and put the most radical into power. I suspect that any government that would have been created to replace Saddam would have had some religious trappings. But suspect that the US invasion has created one that is more overtly and dedicated then would have replaced Saddam or his sons after and internal collapse. Jay
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