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New You're doing it again.
Hey Bill,

I still don't feel that there is a need to have 100% of all government meetings, inclusive of lower staffers, watchdogged.


[link|http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_in_the_Sunshine_Act|Sunshine laws] don't, and shouldn't, apply to 100% of all government meetings.

One of Congress's most important functions is oversight of the Executive branch. In [link|http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d03894.pdf|this] GAO report (31 page .pdf) it says:

p.5-6:
From the outset, OVP [Office of the Vice President] did not respond to our request for information, including descriptive information on the process by which the National Energy Policy report was developed, asserting that we lacked statutory authority to examine NEPDG activities. We were also denied the opportunity to interview staff assisting the Vice President on the NEPDG effort. As a result, throughout the spring and summer of 2001, we engaged in extensive attempts to reach an agreement with OVP on our information request in an effort to fulfill our statutory responsibilities in a manner that accommodated the Vice President\ufffds asserted need to protect certain executive deliberations. Importantly, we significantly narrowed the scope of our review by, among other things, withdrawing our initial request for minutes of NEPDG meetings. We also offered flexibility in how we would access certain documents. Despite our concerted efforts to reach a reasonable accommodation, the Vice President denied us access to virtually all requested information, with the exception of a few documents purportedly related to NEPDG costs that OVP provided to us. The Vice President\ufffds denial of access challenged GAO\ufffds fundamental authority to evaluate the process by which NEPDG had developed a national energy policy and to obtain access to records that would shed light on that process. As authorized by GAO\ufffds access-to-records statute, after exhausting the processes specified in that statute for achieving a resolution and receiving a request from two senate full committee chairs and two senate subcommittee chairs to pursue our evaluation,4 we filed suit in the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia on February 22, 2002, to obtain the limited factual NEPDG information that we had requested.5 On December 9, 2002, the district court dismissed GAO\ufffds suit on jurisdictional grounds, without reaching the merits of GAO\ufffds authority to audit and evaluate NEPDG activities or to obtain access to NEPDG records.6 After considerable bipartisan outreach efforts to the Congress, GAO decided not to appeal the district court decision.7 A detailed chronology of our efforts to obtain access to NEPDG records can be found on GAO\ufffds Web site.


p.7-8:
According to the best information that we could obtain, the National Energy Policy report was the product of a centralized, top-down, shortterm, and labor-intensive process that involved the efforts of several hundred federal employees governmentwide. NEPDG\ufffdcomprised mostly of cabinet-level officials (Principals)\ufffdand its Support Group\ufffdcomprised mostly of select DOE officials detailed to OVP\ufffdcontrolled most facets of the report\ufffds development. [...]


This wasn't a few people meeting in the hallway and talking about what they were going to do over the weekend. Congress apparently tried to address legitimate concerns by the administration but were thwarted at every turn.

On the "witchhunt" - sure there's some posturing and grandstanding going on by the opposition. That's part of the purpose of having an opposition. But shouldn't it be the case that the rules about testifying truthfully, even if not under oath, are respected? Wouldn't it be disconcerting if incorrect information was presented in response to subpoenas by a Senate committee and nobody cared?

My $0.02.

Cheers,
Scott.
New No, I'm not
Theres a happy medium...and you and I are probably not as far apart as it seems.

I support the GAO oversight, think its a good thing.

And it sounds like they think the law is being circumvented and it sounds like a Judge disagreed with them (unlike the previous healthcare issue apparently).

So process is working.

Sounds to me like there are others here that think there should be no happy medium. And I disagree.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition

[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
     I'm *shocked*! Oil execs met with Cheney's task force. - (Another Scott) - (93)
         I suppose it would make more sense to invite them to - (boxley) - (2)
             I have no problem with them meeting Cheney's task force. - (Another Scott) - (1)
                 I object to them *being* Cheney's task force -NT - (tuberculosis)
         Um, I don't get the problem - (bepatient) - (81)
             Why am I not surprised? -NT - (jb4) - (1)
                 I see so the ILA should run IT shops - (boxley)
             I think you do. - (Another Scott) - (49)
                 Lets see, energy policy should receive input from env groups - (boxley) - (48)
                     I guess only the police should have input on the law then? - (Another Scott) - (46)
                         I agree the meetings should have been open to the public - (boxley)
                         There are several problems - (bepatient) - (43)
                             Well, they're right about one thing - (jake123) - (42)
                                 They *are* investing - (scoenye) - (40)
                                     Read "The Innovator's Dilemma" - (ben_tilly) - (39)
                                         dunno BP owns a lot of patents and is doing own R&D -NT - (boxley) - (1)
                                             That doesn't help. Read the book for why. - (ben_tilly)
                                         So you don't think - (bepatient) - (36)
                                             No, I think Big Oil != Nynex - (jb4) - (2)
                                                 So you don't equate - (bepatient) - (1)
                                                     one is an evul environmental horror with ties to Whitehouse - (boxley)
                                             They may well invent and promote it... - (ben_tilly) - (32)
                                                 Then there's the classic: Gillette and Bic - (jake123) - (24)
                                                     Not quite a classic illustration of this particular point - (ben_tilly) - (23)
                                                         I don't think that'll happen. - (Another Scott) - (22)
                                                             Of course he failed - that is according to theory - (ben_tilly) - (12)
                                                                 predictions - (cforde) - (5)
                                                                     Not so much the ability to grok, as the will to risk -NT - (drewk) - (1)
                                                                         Not so simple. Read the book. -NT - (ben_tilly)
                                                                     Definitely - (ben_tilly) - (2)
                                                                         case study - (cforde) - (1)
                                                                             Very true - (SpiceWare)
                                                                 Electrics, batteries - and the 5% problem - (Ashton) - (5)
                                                                     Great post. Thanks. -NT - (Another Scott)
                                                                     ObLRPD: Solar powered jet packs. I think that's the ticket. -NT - (Another Scott)
                                                                     My copy of the book is in storage or I'd give numbers - (ben_tilly) - (2)
                                                                         This paper from MIT in 2000 is interesting. - (Another Scott) - (1)
                                                                             What I mean by "good enough"... - (ben_tilly)
                                                             Not that I care...but looking at history... - (Simon_Jester) - (8)
                                                                 Good point. But they're selling a service, not a Thing. -NT - (Another Scott) - (7)
                                                                     Kodak sold things. They're hurting pretty badly. -NT - (ben_tilly) - (6)
                                                                         But thats a different beast - (bepatient) - (5)
                                                                             Again, read the book. - (ben_tilly) - (4)
                                                                                 I will actually. Looks interesting - (bepatient)
                                                                                 Organization learning.... - (Simon_Jester) - (2)
                                                                                     And that is reinforced... - (ben_tilly)
                                                                                     It's not so black and white. - (Another Scott)
                                                 They spun the business and remerged it several times - (bepatient) - (6)
                                                     OK, they invented. Will they build the next business model? -NT - (ben_tilly) - (5)
                                                         We'll see - (bepatient) - (4)
                                                             That we will. (I'm betting on Skype and relatives.) -NT - (ben_tilly) - (3)
                                                                 Too limited - (bepatient) - (2)
                                                                     Seemlessly? Is that anything like unseemly? -NT - (drewk) - (1)
                                                                         grrrr -NT - (bepatient)
                                 1/2 of BP R&D is recylcling and new energy sources -NT - (boxley)
                         More like saying the Mafia should write the law. -NT - (JayMehaffey)
                     That's a fair question.... - (Simon_Jester)
             The problem is evasion of "sunshine laws". - (a6l6e6x) - (28)
                 So every meeting of every public servant - (bepatient) - (27)
                     Welcome to Government Service... - (Simon_Jester)
                     yep, absolutely - (boxley) - (23)
                         Disagree - (bepatient) - (22)
                             Nor would I - - (Ashton)
                             I just got back from a "step in front" - (boxley)
                             Qualification on your disagreement - (ben_tilly) - (2)
                                 Any loophole will be used enthusiastically. -NT - (admin) - (1)
                                     ICLRPD (new thread) - (imric)
                             If you can say that with a straight face... - (inthane-chan) - (7)
                                 I would regardless - (bepatient) - (6)
                                     Extremes again - (hnick) - (3)
                                         Not that extreme - (bepatient) - (2)
                                             That would be nice - (hnick) - (1)
                                                 I see we are forgetting a simple credo - (bepatient)
                                     Speaking of "Government Relations". - (a6l6e6x) - (1)
                                         proves they are cheap bastards, thats all - (boxley)
                             Litmus test - (imqwerky) - (8)
                                 Let's see... - (Another Scott)
                                 No - (bepatient) - (6)
                                     Aha! - (imqwerky) - (4)
                                         Don't think you understand - (bepatient) - (3)
                                             This has gone from funny to sad... - (hnick)
                                             You're doing it again. - (Another Scott) - (1)
                                                 No, I'm not - (bepatient)
                                     a previous employer did think it was ok to do same -NT - (boxley)
                     No. Only when $ignificant decision$ are to be made. - (a6l6e6x)
                     We have that - its called cspan - (tuberculosis)
         Energy Policy => Invade Iraq => .... => Profit... -NT - (ChrisR) - (7)
             Re: Energy Policy => Invade Iraq => .... => Profit... - (bepatient) - (6)
                 We didn't go there for cheap oil -NT - (ChrisR) - (5)
                     Then there is no Profit -NT - (bepatient) - (4)
                         Tell that to the oil companys -NT - (Silverlock) - (1)
                             a profit of - (SpiceWare)
                         ... without Underwear! -NT - (admin) - (1)
                             And then you can order more beer! -NT - (Ashton)

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