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New Wait a minute...
In short, the argument that it is good to have legal abortion because you abort some fetuses who might otherwise become criminals can also be used to support forced abortions. The fact that we, as a society, find the latter argument repugnant mirrors how repugnant many find the former repugnant.


AFAIK, nobody (not even the authors of Freakonomics) are arguing that it's good to have legal abortion because it reduced crime rates.

The discussion of abortion and crime is in the chapter [link|http://www.freakonomics.com/ch4.php|Where Have All the Criminals Gone?] (excerpts). They present evidence that it's not increased law enforcement, or tougher sentences, or a stronger economy and lower unemployment, or whatever else that is commonly cited as the reason. Rather, it's greatly correlated with the changes after Roe v. Wade. In short, it's not a tract that advocates abortion as a way to reduce crime. It presents evidence that some of the commonly held explanations for the drop in crime rates don't hold up.

It may be a fine distinction, but I think it's important. To let abortion opponents (like Bennett) twist the results into an argument (for even hypothetical) forced abortion (in an attempt to thereby discredit legal voluntary abortion) strikes me as a travesty.

I still think it's incorrect to stretch evidence from a time of legal voluntary abortion to one of mandatory abortion and claim that the proposition obviously holds.

My $0.02.

Cheers,
Scott.
New Right, he disproved the argument they didn't make
And he didn't even do it well.
===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
     Bill Bennett demostrates he is a racist - (JayMehaffey) - (101)
         So are you saying poorosity and blackness *don't* correlate? - (CRConrad) - (65)
             Bill Bennett: - (jb4) - (64)
                 Make no mistake yourself - (ben_tilly) - (63)
                     Mandatory enforced abortions will lead to lower crime rates? -NT - (Another Scott)
                     Uh, Ben...Read me in my posts, dude! - (jb4) - (10)
                         You claim the statement is racist. I claim it is factual. - (ben_tilly) - (2)
                             C'mon Ben...you know me better 'n that! - (jb4) - (1)
                                 Thank you for the clarification. - (ben_tilly)
                         want to explain why stating a fact makes you racist? -NT - (boxley) - (6)
                             Fact? What fact? - (jb4) - (5)
                                 Of course crime rate would go down - (boxley) - (4)
                                     What do you mean by rate? - (ben_tilly) - (3)
                                         youts cause crime,removing youts lessens crime -NT - (boxley) - (2)
                                             True! - (ben_tilly)
                                             Now we're Getting somewhere! - (Ashton)
                     Other correct statement - legalizing drugs will act similar - (tuberculosis)
                     Can we see even a hand-waving proof of that? -NT - (mmoffitt) - (49)
                         I didn't think so. -NT - (mmoffitt) - (4)
                             Gimme time to type!!! - (ben_tilly) - (3)
                                 Okay. - (mmoffitt) - (2)
                                     Look at timestamps!!! - (ben_tilly) - (1)
                                         Touchy, aren't ya? - (mmoffitt)
                         Sure - (ben_tilly) - (43)
                             I dunno - (pwhysall) - (19)
                                 That one is admittedly harder to prove - (ben_tilly) - (18)
                                     Wouldn't last - (drewk) - (17)
                                         Then show me Canada's permanent underclass -NT - (ben_tilly) - (16)
                                             I don't know Canadian society that well - (drewk) - (13)
                                                 They don't but... - (ben_tilly) - (12)
                                                     I'm not talking about capitalism, but about human nature - (drewk) - (11)
                                                         Confirmed! 'He who is not One Up is One Down' - (Ashton)
                                                         Slavery also used to be defended as inevitable... - (ben_tilly) - (9)
                                                             Where did you see me defending it? - (drewk) - (8)
                                                                 "defended" might be the wrong word - (ben_tilly) - (7)
                                                                     I may have noticed another aspect - (Ashton)
                                                                     Lots of disagreements - (drewk) - (5)
                                                                         On that last bit... - (Another Scott) - (3)
                                                                             I don't know about that - (drewk) - (1)
                                                                                 You might have a point - see "stranger anxiety" -NT - (ben_tilly)
                                                                             ethiopian comment, they are racially distinct - (boxley)
                                                                         We do have several disagreements - (ben_tilly)
                                             go to the nearest reservation.... -NT - (boxley) - (1)
                                                 Granted, but in numbers and societal impact... - (ben_tilly)
                             Wait a minute... - (Another Scott) - (1)
                                 Right, he disproved the argument they didn't make - (drewk)
                             Man, you took me literally. - (mmoffitt) - (20)
                                 "Forever to have nots?" - (imric) - (7)
                                     Let me be a little more clear. - (mmoffitt) - (6)
                                         I don't see it - (imric) - (3)
                                             If it doesn't have to be that way, can you ... - (mmoffitt) - (2)
                                                 Sure - (drewk)
                                                 Nope! - (imric)
                                         entrenched underclasses are good for business - (boxley) - (1)
                                             Henry Ford would argue with you. -NT - (Another Scott)
                                 That's not *Ben's* reasoning - (drewk) - (2)
                                     You should read him in his posts. - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                                         Because it is - (drewk)
                                 Speaking of handwaving... - (ben_tilly) - (8)
                                     What about this... - (Another Scott) - (3)
                                         What does "permanent" mean to you? - (ben_tilly) - (2)
                                             Briefly... - (Another Scott) - (1)
                                                 Then we differ on what permanently means - (ben_tilly)
                                     I would then argue for frenco canadians to hold the place - (boxley) - (3)
                                         Not comparable - (ben_tilly) - (2)
                                             well ya were a west coaster, lets have jake weigh in on this - (boxley) - (1)
                                                 Things are very different now - (jake123)
         Jessie Jackson is a racist too. - (Andrew Grygus) - (7)
             Other cool PC issue - (drewk) - (3)
                 Where do you suppose the people in the West Indies came from -NT - (tuberculosis) - (1)
                     China. - (Another Scott)
                 It's not Africa that's the problem . . . - (Andrew Grygus)
             Well, yes - (JayMehaffey) - (2)
                 The question a racist always has to ask, - (Ashton) - (1)
                     They called them indefinitely indentured servants. -NT - (folkert)
         Wrong. Proves hes a statistician - (bepatient) - (20)
             Are all statisticians racist, then? -NT - (mmoffitt)
             A poor one though. - (Another Scott) - (13)
                 You're right, but for the wrong reason - (drewk) - (12)
                     Superbly stated reason why - - (Ashton)
                     A slightly different view. - (Another Scott) - (10)
                         Both your views are 'right' IMO - (Ashton)
                         I think you're misunderstanding his point - (drewk) - (8)
                             Bingo - (bepatient) - (7)
                                 Yes, but be-Not a smug Boolean-head - I know it's Hard, here - (Ashton) - (6)
                                     From you, that's ironic - (drewk) - (4)
                                         Et tu captain clarity: Not. At. All. - (Ashton) - (3)
                                             If by "slogan word" you meant "racism" ... he didn't say it - (drewk) - (2)
                                                 [Raises hand] - (Another Scott) - (1)
                                                     Oohhh.. spinning the def'n of spin! - (Ashton)
                                     Did you hear the entire thread of his show? - (boxley)
             I would suspect both - (JayMehaffey) - (4)
                 No, he is not "literally" saying what you claim he is - (ben_tilly) - (3)
                     No argument with your qualified restatement, except - - (Ashton) - (2)
                         You don't understand. Gambling is a Virtue. :-) -NT - (Another Scott) - (1)
                             I know.. Guido 'told' me. -NT - (Ashton)
         Jesse weighs in on Bennett (new thread) - (drewk)
         This thread reminds me of a classic PG essay (new thread) - (ben_tilly)
         Just an idiot not a racist - (andread) - (3)
             :-) - (Another Scott) - (2)
                 Spin? - (ben_tilly) - (1)
                     Considering the original topic seemed to be Social Security - (Another Scott)

One man's dream is another man's eternal nightmare.
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