Bad assumption

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though my general unfamiliarity with the US justice system may falsify that statement.

Who lays criminal charges? Is anyone allowed to, or only the prosecutor's office? Here in Canada, the laying of criminal charges is under the sole purview of the Crown. However, that doesn't mean that it's under the sole purview of the state in your system.

Perjury, being a crime, would have to be brought forth by the Crown attorney here. Further, criminal law is the under the sole purview of the Federal level of the government, not the provinces: provinces do not and cannot lay criminal charges. I would imagine that it's similar there in that only the state (and not individuals) can lay criminal charges, but (IIUC) it's actually up in the air as to which level of the state can lay charges; for some things it's the Federal level, while for others the State level. So, in order for the policeman to be charged with perjury, the Attorney General of either the United States of America or the State of New York will have to decide that it's likely that the policeman would be indicted, that the policeman would be convicted, and finally that it's advisable to do so. This seems unlikely to come from the Federal level (after all, the policeman was basically acting on his behalf as a Republican when he was hassling the protestors, and given the general odour that Those Uppity Liberal Commie Pinko Faggot Professional Inciters are held by the junta in power), and unlikely from the State level as well (as the State Attorney General probably doesn't want to alienate the policeman's union, considering how dependent he is on evidence gathered by its members for the rest of his work).

Gotta realise the difference between civil and criminal law, you know, and perjury is a criminal matter, not a civil matter.

Post #203,953 by jake123 4/19/05 4:53:28 PM Reply	Bad assumption You're assuming justice is the actual goal of the police. --\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca \n [link\|http://consultron.ca\|http://consultron.ca] [link\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] \n Kingston Ontario Canada [link\|news://news.consultron.ca\|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
Post #203,954 by ben_tilly 4/19/05 4:58:48 PM Reply	s/police/legal system/ The legal system should provide recourse against the excesses of individual policemen. In reality, alas... Cheers, Ben I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
Post #203,955 by jake123 4/19/05 5:01:21 PM Reply	Ok, rephrase You're assuming that justice is the goal. Note that the word of many many people was not enough. It wasn't until they were shown something that could be put on TV that justice was at least partially served. --\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca \n [link\|http://consultron.ca\|http://consultron.ca] [link\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] \n Kingston Ontario Canada [link\|news://news.consultron.ca\|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
Post #203,956 by ben_tilly 4/19/05 5:05:57 PM Reply	But will the rest of it be served? I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
Post #203,960 by Arkadiy 4/19/05 6:16:07 PM Reply	The pie will not be served ------ 179. I will not outsource core functions. -- [link\|http://omega.med.yale.edu/~pcy5/misc/overlord2.htm\|.]
Post #203,978 by jb4 4/19/05 8:45:43 PM Reply	No PIE?!? jb4 shrub\ufffdbish (Am., from shrub* + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf.* BULLSHIT
Post #203,980 by admin 4/19/05 9:04:56 PM Reply	Honor not like pie... Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
Post #203,965 by jake123 4/19/05 6:58:38 PM Reply	Not relevant to the statement but I personally doubt it. We live in a police state, doncha know. --\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca \n [link\|http://consultron.ca\|http://consultron.ca] [link\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] \n Kingston Ontario Canada [link\|news://news.consultron.ca\|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
Post #203,961 by Arkadiy 4/19/05 6:17:35 PM Reply	It only takes one person who wants to bring the cop down (yes, the person should be a lawer or pay one enough money) No lofty things like "goal" and "justice", just "grudge" and "satisfaction". ------ 179. I will not outsource core functions. -- [link\|http://omega.med.yale.edu/~pcy5/misc/overlord2.htm\|.]
Post #203,967 by jake123 4/19/05 7:08:57 PM Reply	That's not true though my general unfamiliarity with the US justice system may falsify that statement. Who lays criminal charges? Is anyone allowed to, or only the prosecutor's office? Here in Canada, the laying of criminal charges is under the sole purview of the Crown. However, that doesn't mean that it's under the sole purview of the state in your system. Perjury, being a crime, would have to be brought forth by the Crown attorney here. Further, criminal law is the under the sole purview of the Federal level of the government, not the provinces: provinces do not and cannot lay criminal charges. I would imagine that it's similar there in that only the state (and not individuals) can lay criminal charges, but (IIUC) it's actually up in the air as to which level of the state can lay charges; for some things it's the Federal level, while for others the State level. So, in order for the policeman to be charged with perjury, the Attorney General of either the United States of America or the State of New York will have to decide that it's likely that the policeman would be indicted, that the policeman would be convicted, and finally that it's advisable to do so. This seems unlikely to come from the Federal level (after all, the policeman was basically acting on his behalf as a Republican when he was hassling the protestors, and given the general odour that Those Uppity Liberal Commie Pinko Faggot Professional Inciters are held by the junta in power), and unlikely from the State level as well (as the State Attorney General probably doesn't want to alienate the policeman's union, considering how dependent he is on evidence gathered by its members for the rest of his work). Gotta realise the difference between civil and criminal law, you know, and perjury is a criminal matter, not a civil matter. --\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca \n [link\|http://consultron.ca\|http://consultron.ca] [link\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] \n Kingston Ontario Canada [link\|news://news.consultron.ca\|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
Post #203,997 by Arkadiy 4/20/05 9:18:36 AM Reply	I am not sure if perjury is criminal, but if it is you are right. Who watches the effing watchers... ------ 179. I will not outsource core functions. -- [link\|http://omega.med.yale.edu/~pcy5/misc/overlord2.htm\|.]
Post #204,003 by jake123 4/20/05 9:21:20 AM Reply	Dunno about in the US but it's definitely criminal code in Canada. --\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca \n [link\|http://consultron.ca\|http://consultron.ca] [link\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca\|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] \n Kingston Ontario Canada [link\|news://news.consultron.ca\|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------

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