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New Scary and racist thought.
At the worst estimates, we've been killing 15,000 Iraqi per year (or, rather, are responsible for the deaths of those Iraqi). We failed (so far) to keep the country under control.

Hussein was in power for what, ~30 years. At the same rate, he would have killed 450,000 people. In fact, between Iran adventure, Quwait adventure, suppressing of Kurds and Shia, purges and so on he killed way more (is responsible for death of way more). At least 1 million in wars. But... He succesded where we're failing - he kept Iraq out of the claws of fundamentalists.

So, could it be that Iraq simply cannot be kept out of trouble by killing less than 30,000 people a year?

One death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic. One thug is a criminal, multiple thugs is a friendly government (or at least a tool of geopolitics).

God damn Bush for commititing us to this mess. At least it was not our fault before. Now it is. This smacks of former communists converted to neocons - the same faith in perfectibility of human nature.

--

... a reference to Presidente Arbusto.
-- [link|http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/001417.html|Geoffrey K. Pullum]
New Absoultely
Classic Jungian situation - bottled evil erupts spontaneously from the unconscious.
-drl
New Excellent summation! Kudos.
     He must be lying - (bepatient) - (53)
         No, not necessarily. - (jake123) - (40)
             Do we want to compare.. - (bepatient) - (39)
                 That comparison means nothing to the issue - (jake123) - (6)
                     And if we are in and out - (bepatient) - (5)
                         Well, the US could leave tomorrow - (jake123) - (4)
                             Agree re: Afghan. -NT - (bepatient) - (3)
                                 There's a very good article in the October Atlantic - (jake123) - (2)
                                     If that's your paraphrase of the article - (Ashton) - (1)
                                         Not entirely - (jake123)
                 Wow. - (mmoffitt) - (31)
                     Are we? - (bepatient) - (30)
                         What crap. -NT - (Silverlock) - (27)
                             Really? - (bepatient) - (25)
                                 !!SHUN!! - (jb4) - (12)
                                     Look at the progression. - (bepatient) - (11)
                                         Devil's advocate can sometimes work. But when this - (Ashton) - (10)
                                             Since when.. - (bepatient) - (9)
                                                 How lofty.. to find the Beginnings now 'Irrelevant' - (Ashton) - (8)
                                                     Has it or has it not already occurred? - (bepatient) - (7)
                                                         Since you seem to have stepped out of the debbil's advocate - (Ashton)
                                                         "Ridiculous"? Really... - (mmoffitt) - (5)
                                                             Right. - (bepatient) - (4)
                                                                 Yep. We'll prolly still be there in 2009. -NT - (mmoffitt) - (3)
                                                                     Well prep for the question then. - (bepatient) - (2)
                                                                         Dream --> on. -NT - (Ashton) - (1)
                                                                             Aerosmith ROX dude -NT - (bepatient)
                                 The crap is your "heartfelt" concern. - (Silverlock) - (2)
                                     I'm not drinking the kool-aid dude. - (bepatient) - (1)
                                         There's the Pollyanna I know. -NT - (mmoffitt)
                                 o0o0 what wonderful proof... - (Simon_Jester) - (8)
                                     Can find some wonderful things.. - (bepatient) - (7)
                                         Yep...that's why no many are ticked at Dan Rather - (Simon_Jester) - (6)
                                             Well...I kind of expect them to do it too, nowadays. - (bepatient) - (5)
                                                 That, my friend, is owed exclusively to a Republican. - (mmoffitt) - (4)
                                                     Ross, is that you? - (Another Scott) - (2)
                                                         Besides, we shouldn't blindly trust those that govern us. - (ChrisR) - (1)
                                                             Well that's mighty cynical - (deSitter)
                                                     I was talking about the press, goof. -NT - (bepatient)
                             oops - (bepatient)
                         I seem to recall an issue with the mass graves in Iraq.... - (Simon_Jester)
                         Hey, if you're Sunni... - (jb4)
         I hope he is successful... - (ChrisR) - (7)
             We're blind men describing an elephant. - (Another Scott) - (3)
                 Russia exists for thousand yrs - Iraq not a country at all -NT - (deSitter) - (2)
                     Not exactly. - (Another Scott)
                     Russia as we know it is a colonial empire - (Arkadiy)
             Scary and racist thought. - (Arkadiy) - (2)
                 Absoultely - (deSitter)
                 Excellent summation! Kudos. -NT - (Ashton)
         No, the IRAQ elections will be held on time... - (Simon_Jester)
         We'll see if he lives that long - (tuberculosis)
         Some elections will be held - (JayMehaffey)
         This will be just as meaningful as the "handover" -NT - (Silverlock)

Disputants more fiendish than the Great Hyperlobic Omni-Cognate Neutron Wrangler of Ciceronicus Twelve, the Magic and Indefatigable!
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