Post #174,031
9/13/04 9:55:49 PM
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New Century Schoolbook is the One True Font! 60 kB .gifs.
New Century Schoolbook:
[image|http://www.fonts.com/images/products/closeup/000004760.gif|0|New Century Schoolbook|590|535]
Times New Roman:
[image|http://www.fonts.com/images/products/closeup/014869113.gif|0|Times New Roman|590|535]
NCS is clearly much better than TNR. See?
Seriously, I think it's an easier font to read and much more interesting (it has a little bit of an old-fashioned feel to it).
The Economist magazine redesigned their font a few years ago. They started with the "o" and went from there. It's a nice font too:
[image|http://www.fonts.com/images/products/closeup/015752113.gif|0|Economist 101|590|535]
Note the shading in the "o" tilts slightly from upper left to lower right, compared to the nearly symmetric shading in the "o" in NCS. I like NCS better. YMMV.
Cheers, Scott. (Who thinks this can be moved out of Politics now.)
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Post #174,038
9/13/04 10:02:13 PM
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Fonts often need character.
I find Times New Roman to be quite character-less (but I'm fairly sure Peter will disagree on that score). New Century Schoolbook has some character, and that Ecomonist font has loads. Goudy Old Style has a distinct personality, as does Bookman Old Style. Microsoft used to distribute a font called Footlight which also has a distinct personality. I found it was a good default seriffed font for web pages.
Wade.
Is it enough to love Is it enough to breathe Somebody rip my heart out And leave me here to bleed
| | Is it enough to die Somebody save my life I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
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Post #174,044
9/13/04 10:28:14 PM
9/13/04 10:28:56 PM
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Standard documents don't need character ;)
I find Times New Roman to be quite character-less (but I'm fairly sure Peter will disagree on that score). New Century Schoolbook has some character, and that Ecomonist font has loads. Goudy Old Style has a distinct personality, as does Bookman Old Style. Microsoft used to distribute a font called Footlight which also has a distinct personality. I found it was a good default seriffed font for web pages. Well, that's why I prefer Times New Roman for standard documents, things people might read, such as my monthly letters. It's easy to read, it isn't "fancy" and it doesn't detract from what they are reading. Not having "character" to distinguish it, makes it a good everyday use font. And maybe it's habit, or what I'm used to, but when I switched to the Opera browser, it started putting everything in Arial and man, it looked weird. I like things I'm used to, so I guess I decided that it was the best thing for regular stuff, like my To Do lists and letters and such. I pretty much use it for all standard documents in a 12 font or 10 font. Note: I did go into MS Word and look for New Century Schoolbook, but it isn't there. They have something called Old Century, but MAN it comes up dark in a 12 font, compared to the Times New Roman. Compared next to each other, they look entirely different, and when you bold Old Century, it all blurs at 12 point. Now, when making signs or posters or things with "character" I choose a font that fits, such as an old fashioned cursive with a religious sign, or a rustic looking font for say, the family reunion. And when making such "fancy" things, I usually use Print Shop, and I really like the Cuckoo font and the Christie font. They are pretty neat. So I'll probably stick with Times New Roman for basic things, simply because I'm used to it. It's also easy to space out and write things above and below (I do that with lyrics and music notes sometimes). Nightowl >8#
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
Edited by Nightowl
Sept. 13, 2004, 10:28:56 PM EDT
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Post #174,050
9/13/04 10:39:38 PM
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NCS is a PostScript font, though you can get a TT version.
It doesn't come with Winders. You have to add it yourself (usually for $$), or have a PostScript printer.
Bitstream had a nice 500 font CD (with PostScript and TrueType versions). I think it was about $50. They don't seem to sell it anymore.
If TNR does the job for you, there's no need to change.
Cheers, Scott.
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Post #174,073
9/14/04 12:24:57 AM
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TNR screams "I've got a laser printer".
And if you ever put "Footlight MT Light" on a web page, sir, I shall have no option but to direct the Slashdot Orbital Cannon at said web server.
It's the only way to be sure.
Peter [link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire] [link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal] [link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #174,075
9/14/04 12:26:40 AM
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Re: TNR screams "I've got a laser printer".
Not in my case, I only have an inkjet. ;)
But someday....
Nightowl >8#
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
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Post #174,084
9/14/04 12:58:18 AM
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Right on cue. :-)
Is it enough to love Is it enough to breathe Somebody rip my heart out And leave me here to bleed
| | Is it enough to die Somebody save my life I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
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Post #174,164
9/14/04 10:36:48 AM
9/14/04 10:58:55 AM
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If I want character...
I'll use Comic Sans MS [link|http://www.identifont.com/samples/microsoft/ComicSansMS.gif|Example at identifont.com]
~~~)-Steven----
"I want you to remember that no bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country..."
General George S. Patton
Edited by Steven A S
Sept. 14, 2004, 10:58:55 AM EDT
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Post #174,172
9/14/04 10:56:20 AM
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Re: If I want character...
It should be [link|http://bancomicsans.com/|banned].
BTW, please don't link images directly from identifont.com; it's a bit rude. Do what I did and copy the image to your own host.
Peter [link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire] [link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal] [link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #174,239
9/14/04 2:58:10 PM
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But I don't have access to your own host..........
jb4 shrub\ufffdbish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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Post #174,310
9/14/04 7:41:53 PM
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That's not character.
That's obnoxiousness. :-)
Wade.
Is it enough to love Is it enough to breathe Somebody rip my heart out And leave me here to bleed
| | Is it enough to die Somebody save my life I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
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Post #174,090
9/14/04 1:25:27 AM
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That is so yesterday
Actually right now that's my default proportional font. But for sheer perfection in screen reading, Georgia is unbeatable. Georgia is a perfect font. I switch off now and then between Georgia, Schoolbook, and Palatino. BTW there are variations in Schoolbook so check them all out.
I've come to hate TNR. I think - yuppies, Microsoft, mauve carpets, sales reps, marketing mavens, drones.
A slight variation of Schoolbook, Computer Modern, is the standard for math/physics and IMO is more readable. Equations written in CM give me a woody :)
-drl
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Post #174,092
9/14/04 1:30:11 AM
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Hoefler Text is my fave (14K image)
[image|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org/tmp/HoeflerText.gif||This is a picture. If I'd wanted to use words, I would have.||]
Peter [link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire] [link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal] [link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #174,093
9/14/04 1:31:23 AM
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That's nice. Very classy.
Is it enough to love Is it enough to breathe Somebody rip my heart out And leave me here to bleed
| | Is it enough to die Somebody save my life I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
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Post #174,096
9/14/04 1:33:52 AM
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And for sans serif work....
Gill Sans.
[link|http://www.identifont.com/show?MB|http://www.identifont.com/show?MB]
Peter [link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire] [link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal] [link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #174,100
9/14/04 1:48:06 AM
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Ah the "Underground" font :) I love it too
-drl
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Post #174,155
9/14/04 9:44:21 AM
9/14/04 9:45:20 AM
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Identifont...Very cool!
Bookmarked....
jb4 shrub\ufffdbish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
Edited by jb4
Sept. 14, 2004, 09:45:20 AM EDT
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Post #174,162
9/14/04 10:28:51 AM
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I like this font for Serif work...
But some people don't like the stiffer-older feel of it.
[link|http://www.identifont.com/show?8YQ|Priori Serif]
[image|http://www.identifont.com/samples/emigre/PrioriSerif.gif||||]
It is a young font(2003). But still looks very nice. I find it very easy to read. Very.
-- [link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg], [link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ iwetheyNo matter how much Microsoft supporters whine about how Linux and other operating systems have just as many bugs as their operating systems do, the bottom line is that the serious, gut-wrenching problems happen on Windows, not on Linux, not on Mac OS. -- [link|http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1622086,00.asp|source]Here is an example: [link|http://www.greymagic.com/security/advisories/gm001-ie/|Executing arbitrary commands without Active Scripting or ActiveX when using Windows]
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Post #174,173
9/14/04 10:57:01 AM
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OW MY EYES IT HURTS
All that pointiness!
Peter [link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire] [link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal] [link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #174,240
9/14/04 2:58:57 PM
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Howe Middley Englishe!
jb4 shrub\ufffdbish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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Post #174,311
9/14/04 7:43:35 PM
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That's quite a delicate font.
It would work much better on the page than on the screen. It needs lots of resolution.
Wade.
Is it enough to love Is it enough to breathe Somebody rip my heart out And leave me here to bleed
| | Is it enough to die Somebody save my life I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
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Post #174,320
9/14/04 8:53:01 PM
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Yes. Correct.
I find it better to look at... which is why I said "I find it easier to read."
-- [link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg], [link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ iwetheyNo matter how much Microsoft supporters whine about how Linux and other operating systems have just as many bugs as their operating systems do, the bottom line is that the serious, gut-wrenching problems happen on Windows, not on Linux, not on Mac OS. -- [link|http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1622086,00.asp|source]Here is an example: [link|http://www.greymagic.com/security/advisories/gm001-ie/|Executing arbitrary commands without Active Scripting or ActiveX when using Windows]
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Post #174,101
9/14/04 1:48:35 AM
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Beautiful, but I need to see some text
-drl
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Post #174,108
9/14/04 2:11:21 AM
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Re: Beautiful, but I need to see some text
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org/tmp/hoefler_text.pdf|http://guildenstern..../hoefler_text.pdf]
(Text from Ed Foster's current newsletter)
Peter [link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire] [link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal] [link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #174,110
9/14/04 2:13:25 AM
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Very formal
I couldn't take it more than a few minutes.
-drl
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Post #174,112
9/14/04 2:17:35 AM
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Why? What would happen?
Would the good taste fairies invade your home and start critiquing your wallpaper and soft furnishings?
Peter [link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire] [link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal] [link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #174,113
9/14/04 2:20:01 AM
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Re: Why? What would happen?
I might accept a university teaching position that had not been offered to me.
It's still a beautiful font. I have something like 400 fonts - almost all of them are useless.
-drl
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Post #174,119
9/14/04 2:39:23 AM
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ICLRPD (new thread)
Created as new thread #174118 titled [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=174118|ICLRPD]
To deny the indirect purchaser, who in this case is the ultimate purchaser, the right to seek relief from unlawful conduct, would essentially remove the word consumer from the Consumer Protection Act - [link|http://www.techworld.com/opsys/news/index.cfm?NewsID=1246&Page=1&pagePos=20|Nebraska Supreme Court]
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Post #174,312
9/14/04 7:46:58 PM
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Nice. The anti-aliasing helps.
Is it enough to love Is it enough to breathe Somebody rip my heart out And leave me here to bleed
| | Is it enough to die Somebody save my life I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
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Post #174,377
9/15/04 12:24:21 AM
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very nice
I'm fond of [link|http://www.identifont.com/show?3IN|Baskerville] myself.
Have fun, Carl Forde
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Post #174,094
9/14/04 1:32:22 AM
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New Toy!
Identifont!
Here's why Footlight is a big pile of arse:
[link|http://www.identifont.com/show?3NZ|http://www.identifont.com/show?3NZ]
Peter [link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire] [link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal] [link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #174,102
9/14/04 1:49:03 AM
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Too Irish
-drl
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Post #174,114
9/14/04 2:21:10 AM
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Heck with that
Caslon's way nicer than either. So is Garamond, Centaur, and a host of others. Poetica by Adobe is based on Arrighi, a renaissance italic font, and makes a nice complement to Centaur (which is also based on a renaissance font, but it doesn't have an italic version, only a roman version).
If you like newer fonts, the Stone (roman, italic, sans, semisans, and serif) series is pretty nice, as is Bembo, Gill Sans, and Minion. Minion also has the advantage of coming in Cyrillic along with a bunch of other varieties; a very complete line when compared to a classic font like Centaur. What else do I like... Rotis is really nice too.
Most of the fonts that you get when you buy those CDs are utter crap, though.
Times New Roman was specifically designed for newspapers, and even more specifically to be legible on cheap crappy newsprint, where fun things like runout of the ink happens (ie- when the ink spreads out after landing on the paper in those oh-so-nice little tendrils along the paper fibres). In short, it was specifically designed not to look nice but to explicitly deal with the limitations of the medium it was to be printed on... being designed for the Times of London a century or so back.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #174,313
9/14/04 7:54:42 PM
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This often happens.
The desire for a pleasing and/or beautiful font tends to be at odds with the need for it to work in poor conditions. I've heard from several places that Times New Roman in TrueType was carefully hinted to work well in 640x480 in Windows 3.1. The fact that it was originally designed for printing on poor-quality paper would have been a major choice in it's selection.
Newer fonts can and do take advantage of higher-resolution displays and printers with better paper. Hence fonts like New Century Schoolbook gain traction. NCS will look good in moderate resolution, as does Footlight MT Light (Peter's opinion notwithstanding :-). However Priori clearly needs higher resolution.
Desktop magazine had a report of a font/art display a few years ago where the artist displayed odd letters from a common newspaper font at massively huge point sizes. One of his points was that such fonts have odd shapes where edges and corners meet so that the ink traps properly at low point sizes. But make them too large or use a suitably high-quality process and suddenly they don't work because the ink trap problem doesn't exist.
Fonts are often designed for a purpose and people should respect that.
Wade.
Is it enough to love Is it enough to breathe Somebody rip my heart out And leave me here to bleed
| | Is it enough to die Somebody save my life I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
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Post #174,362
9/14/04 11:43:40 PM
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Re: This often happens.
That's like centaur. You need at least a 600dpi printer to make that font work, and higher is better, as the verticals are very thin. However, with the verticals so thin, it is a font that can be quite legible at very small point sizes, like 10, 8, and 6, as long as the paper and printer can support it.
It's really good for home publishing on higher quality gear (at least, for publishing stuff where a classic font is appropriate) because you can take something like A4 and turn it into a quarto of A6 with very small type and still get something you can read.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #174,154
9/14/04 9:39:14 AM
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Always been a fan of NCS
I find that TNR is hard to read, because of its aspect ratio. NCS is more elongated (which, IIRC, means it has a higher aspect ratio, but I never realy knew which way increased the aspect ratio; I'm sure the omnicient LRPD will enlighten). I was always an outcast because I insisted in setting up my normal.dot with NCS as the default paragraph font. Alas, Micros~1 no longer packages NCS with Orifice (although it dodes package the rest of the "standard" Postscript fonts). So I have saved the Orifice97 font package, which does have it.
Also prefer Lucida Sans Typewriter to Lucida Console and Courier New for monospaced type...again Micros~1 no longer packages it with Orifice, so I keep a copy I got from the Windows font pack 1 for Windows 3.1.
Sometimes, legacy stuff is worth keeping around....
jb4 shrub\ufffdbish (Am., from shrub + rubbish, after the derisive name for America's 43 president; 2003) n. 1. a form of nonsensical political doubletalk wherein the speaker attempts to defend the indefensible by lying, obfuscation, or otherwise misstating the facts; GIBBERISH. 2. any of a collection of utterances from America's putative 43rd president. cf. BULLSHIT
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