Post #118,778
9/25/03 4:30:01 AM
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Just got laid off
Just got the news this morning, the products that my group worked on have been cancelled and the whole team is laid off. The cancellation of the product was not a surprise but the layoff was.
This is the first time that I have been laid off/fired so I don't even know where to start.
To top it off the announcement came right before all the Jewish Holidays (the Jewish New Year is Saturday), a great holiday present.
The only thing I can say is that the peons always the pay the price for upper management's stupidity. Upper management has utterly failed in the last 2 years, but instead of laying off VP's and coming up with a working strategy, they lay off the developers who do the real work.
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Post #118,798
9/25/03 9:43:39 AM
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Condolences. Best of luck with the search!
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Post #118,808
9/25/03 10:37:32 AM
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It's true, then, that...
..shit runs downhill!
(and I'm sure tha thte Veeps won't forgo their bonuses this year, either...)
Condolences...and good luck in the New Year!
jb4
Boy I'd like to see those words on a PR banner behind [Treasury Secretary John] Snow at the podium:
Jobs and Growth: Just Wait.
John J. Andrew, unemployed programmer; see jobforjohn.com
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Post #118,853
9/25/03 1:44:05 PM
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Definately
The old joke is that a conservative is a liberal who got mugged. The same thing applies with regards to workers rights. After getting laid off you suddenly have a different perspective. The current corporate system is definately broken. Upper management gets huge salaries and is not accountable. When things go wrong they lay off workers and shuffle the execs around, the execs almost never get fired, and if they do they get a golden parachute. I don't believe that the current situation can go on much longer. I don't have an answer (a union is definately bot the answer), I hope someone does.
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Post #118,858
9/25/03 1:59:46 PM
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What we need is a reform in business
the current way business is done is broken. We need a more reliable and responsible business model. One that cares for the employees, holds management responsible for their own mistakes, has environmental policies, has ethical policies, and does what is best for the economy and not just their own profit margin.
Caring for the employees, because if you don't care you can lose very talented people. Employees are part of the business and play key roles in that business.
Holding management responsible, this helps to eliminate mistakes and correct them by retraining managers, or finding new managers that can do the job better. If management is held respnsible for their own mistakes, maybe they will learn from those mistakes. This can help to create a better company.
Environmental policies, this will help avoid environmental law suits and fines from the government. The company should clean up any mess it makes, and do what it can to limit pollution.
Ethical policies, these need to be enforced to avoid another Enron scandle. We cannot have managers raid the company's funds or sell off stock before the public knows the company is going under. We need fair play here.
Does what is best for the economy, because if the economy tanks, so does your profits. A goal would be to do something that boosts the economy, rather than maximize profits to take money away from the economy. For example, outsourcing to other countries eliminates middle-class jobs and can actually hurt the economy. These middle-class people could have bought products and services from your clients, and now they can't. So now your clients cannot afford to buy from your company. You gained a short-term profit, but killed off the long-term profit.
"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"
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Post #118,931
9/25/03 10:52:55 PM
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Syndicated columnist
mentioned something about this very topic just several days ago:
[link|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/content/show?contentid=117919|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/content/show?contentid=117919]
If the link has expired, go to [link|http://www.dallasnews.com|http://www.dallasnews.com] and do a search on Scott Burns, then check his recent archives.
lincoln
"Windows XP has so many holes in its security that any reasonable user will conclude it was designed by the same German officer who created the prison compound in "Hogan's Heroes." - Andy Ihnatko, Chicago Sun-Times
[link|http://users3.ev1.net/~bconnors/resume.htm|VB/SQL resume]
[link|http://users3.ev1.net/~bconnors/tandem_resume.htm|Tandem resume]
[link|mailto:bconnors@ev1.net|contact me]
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Post #118,859
9/25/03 2:04:49 PM
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Unions
What kind of union? Teamsters? CUPE? International Union of Telegraph Workers?
Note that there are some very significant differences in what these three organisations do, as well as some very significant congruences.
WRT white collar work: Unions are exactly what is needed. The old style idea that white-collar == management is not true anymore. Most white collar workers are just as plebian in their role in a given firm as the people down on the shop floor are.
Unions are a tool; they are as good or as bad as the people that use them. If you look at the history of organised labour, you'll see that there is a very valid need for them, and that that need continues to exist.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca] [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
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Post #118,901
9/25/03 6:11:22 PM
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Thomas Jefferson had the answer
We're just about 200 years behind "schedule"
jb4
Boy I'd like to see those words on a PR banner behind [Treasury Secretary John] Snow at the podium:
Jobs and Growth: Just Wait.
John J. Andrew, unemployed programmer; see jobforjohn.com
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Post #118,814
9/25/03 10:50:18 AM
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Compete!
If you know the paying customers, then go talk with them. Propose an alternative solution.
As far as I'm concerned, when a company lays you off for management stupidity, they're giving you a license to prove how truly stupid your management was.
If you can reach the decision makers, you might be able to convince them that a new reorganized project WITHOUT your ex-management is the way to go.
Glen Austin
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Post #118,915
9/25/03 9:06:54 PM
9/26/03 4:12:37 AM
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Sorry to hear. What's the general outlook in Israel?
I understand that's where you are. US (particularly CA) is grim. I'm entering the hell-if-I-can-figure-out-what-I'm-going-to-do stage. It's...unsettling. --\r\n
Karsten M. Self [link|mailto:kmself@ix.netcom.com|kmself@ix.netcom.com]\r\n
[link|http://kmself.home.netcom.com/|http://kmself.home.netcom.com/]\r\n
What part of "gestalt" don't you understand?\r\n
[link|http://twiki.iwethey.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/|TWikIWETHEY] -- an experiment in collective intelligence. Stupidity. Whatever.\r\n
\r\n
Keep software free. Oppose the CBDTPA. Kill S.2048 dead.\r\n[link|http://www.eff.org/alerts/20020322_eff_cbdtpa_alert.html|http://www.eff.org/alerts/20020322_eff_cbdtpa_alert.html]\r\n
Edited by kmself
Sept. 26, 2003, 04:12:37 AM EDT
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Post #118,957
9/26/03 3:55:51 AM
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Not great
The hi tech industry in Israel is heavily affected by what is going on in the US (in fact I was laid off by a large US company). On the other hand I spoke to a few friends and they think that things might be starting to pick up a bit. I will know more as I start to look.
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Post #118,924
9/25/03 10:10:07 PM
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What to do
1) Eat right - nothing makes you feel like shit like a bad diet. Yes good food costs more - spend the buck and if you don't cook this is a fine time to learn.
2) Work out - if you don't - start - if you do - keep it up and maybe kick up the intensity a notch.
3) Network your ass off - that's the gig these days - you gotta make your own opening - meet people, collect business cards, spend a half day on the phone and sending email every day "touching base". (Just ask what's going on with them - offer to help - pass on leads if you hear of any you can't use).
4) Find fun free stuff to do and do it - try to enjoy your extra time - go to museums - free concerts - whatever you can that's cheap.
5) Check your local business journal - it will have a leads section - start going to these meetings first one is free - same for rotary club, optimist club, lions club, whatever - wherever people gather just go - have a good time - enjoy people - do NOT say you're looking for a job - DO say you're looking for more networking opportunities in your field - can they recommend any gatherings.
6) Print personal business cards - get them cheap from vistaprint.com if you're in the US - don't pay extra to have the vistaprint logo removed - I see vistaprint cards everywhere - even with people who have successful companies - you'll just look frugal.
7) Limit your computer time to 1/2 day. Its easy to bury yourself in the web - it just makes you tired and feel spent. Keep up on technology - start a shareware project if you like - but its really easy for us types to use it as a crutch.
8) Join a job search group if you can find one - swap leads.
This is what I'm doing - I like to think it will lead to a good position soon. At least it makes me feel hopeful.
Good luck.
In Java, you can't escape the creepy feeling.
--James Gosling
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Post #118,958
9/26/03 3:57:49 AM
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Thanks for the good advice
Everything you said is absolutley right. I am starting to network, in fact I have a lead from a former co-worker which I am going to follow up on Monday.
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