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New Ok, now here's a question
Still working from the Canadian numbers.... that 50% of the population that gets 10% of the dough... should they pay taxes?

Right now, I'm pumping gas to make ends meet. I gross 219.20/wk, which ends up being about 175 after taxes. My gross income over the course of a year in this job works out to being 11 400, and I will be paying app. 2350 in taxes, or about 20%. This puts me about 20% under the poverty line for a single person in a Canadian city, let alone the poverty line for someone supporting children. Should I be paying any taxes at all, in your view?
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton                            jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca]                   [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada               [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
New sure
but I'd also expect that you'd receive a lot more in "social support"(food stamps, rent support, medical, etc) than the guy who made more(just medical).

I have no problem with helping those that aren't as well off - I have a big problem with penalizing people for doing well.
Darrell Spice, Jr.                      [link|http://www.spiceware.org/cgi-bin/spa.pl?album=./Artistic%20Overpass|Artistic Overpass]\n[link|http://www.spiceware.org/|SpiceWare] - We don't do Windows, it's too much of a chore
New Different system here
I don't get any social support. My ex does... but if I give her any money, it comes right off the top of what she gets.
--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton                            jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca]                   [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada               [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
New Does that tax include retirement, pension etc?
Here we have a payroll tax that is 7.5% and unemployment tax which is lopped off first, then any additional moneys are taxed at whatever bracket you are in. So when repos howl that the working poor do not pay taxes, they are wrong, everyone working gets 7.5 lopped off and sent to washington. Now if you make above 87k (or higher not sure) you immediately get a 7.5% tax cut on any income above that because you no longer have to pay this payroll tax. The problem is most talk about taxes ignore that tax break.
thanx,
bill
will work for cash and other incentives [link|http://home.tampabay.rr.com/boxley/resume/Resume.html|skill set]

questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]

"I hit him so hard in the head his dog shat a turd in the shape of Jesus" Leonard Pine
New Yes
There are three main components to the taxes. Income tax, CPP (Canada Pension Plan), and EI (Employment Insurance), though the benefits from Employment Insurance on that level of income is enough to mean that you can go grab a beer after you get pitched out for not paying your rent.

Employment Insurance has become a major cash cow for the gov; it netted something like nine billion in profits last year.

--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton                            jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca]                   [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada               [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
New Minor nit...
it's not 7.5% ... it's 15.1% (the employer takes 7.5% of yours and ANOTHER 7.5% directly from the employer.)

Want the best one I've ever heard though? A former boss of mine has been married 4+ times. He's got one son, under 17. The son's mother dies (cancer). Sad...but the son starts to receive SSI checks from the account of the mom (to continue until he reaches 18). (He was in joint custody).

Father remarries - step mom dies (cancer again). Son starts to receive YET ANOTHER check from SSI, this time from the step mom (until he reaches 18).

Nevermind that he was living with his father the entire time and didn't have any bills to begin with.
New I can best that.
My mother-in-law receives an SSI check 1/2 of my father-in-law's. Their total take is $1,800/month. My father-in-law "paid the maximum" until 1990, total contributions were $50,000. My mother-in-law worked part-time for 2.5 years, her total? < $1,000. My mother-in-law is 70 and my father-in-law just turned 70. To date their withdrawls from the SS "Trust Fund" exceed $124,000. They're both in good health and can reasonably expect to take out another $200,000.

What I find absolutely hysterical is the Repo position that people of my parents generation "would have been better off putting their money in the stock market." Yeah? The stock market would have GUARANTEED a $50,000 investment turning into over $300,000? Or how about my mother-in-law's SSI performance? She put in less than $1,000 and is taking home at least $120,000. Think "the market" could have done that for her? And let us not forget that they both receive health insurance as a part of their pay-back in addition to the checks. How much is that worth?

The sad fact is that my father-in-law put money into the SS fund for 30 years and put less in total than I have as of right now. And I've got at least another $100,000 to put in before I'm old enough to qualify for withdrawls. Worse, my in-laws don't really need the SS money, but they're gonna get it.

[Edit]
I love my in-laws, but they are the poster children for what is wrong with Social Security.
bcnu,
Mikem

The soul and substance of what customarily ranks as patriotism is moral cowardice and always has been...We have thrown away the most valuable asset we had-- the individual's right to oppose both flag and country when he (just he, by himself) believed them to be in the wrong. We have thrown it away; and with it all that was really respectable about that grotesque and laughable word, Patriotism.

- Mark Twain, "Monarchical and Republican Patriotism"
Expand Edited by mmoffitt June 10, 2003, 07:16:43 AM EDT
New Re: Minor nit...
it's not 7.5% ... it's 15.1% (the employer takes 7.5% of yours and ANOTHER 7.5% directly from the employer.)

Which, of course, means that if you're self-emplowed (e.g. a contractor), you're on the hook for the WHOLE 15.1% enchillada!
jb4
"We continue to live in a world where all our know-how is locked into binary files in an unknown format. If our documents are our corporate memory, Microsoft still has us all condemned to Alzheimer's."
Simon Phipps, SUN Microsystems
     Study: Middle Class ends up with more tax burden - (deSitter) - (23)
         waa waa waa - (SpiceWare) - (20)
             Shhhh - (bepatient) - (19)
                 Question about tax burdens - (jake123) - (9)
                     The ones I saw... - (bepatient) - (8)
                         Ok, now here's a question - (jake123) - (7)
                             sure - (SpiceWare) - (1)
                                 Different system here - (jake123)
                             Does that tax include retirement, pension etc? - (boxley) - (4)
                                 Yes - (jake123)
                                 Minor nit... - (Simon_Jester) - (2)
                                     I can best that. - (mmoffitt)
                                     Re: Minor nit... - (jb4)
                 Re: Your property tax burden. - (mmoffitt) - (8)
                     Part of it. - (bepatient)
                     Depends on the state.... - (Simon_Jester) - (6)
                         And who is responsible for the collapse of the shell game? - (mmoffitt) - (5)
                             also the responsibility of the 401k kids - (boxley) - (1)
                                 Agree. - (mmoffitt)
                             Didn't take econ in school? - (bepatient) - (2)
                                 Unfortunately I did take econ in ug school. - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                                     But they weren't, right? ;-) -NT - (bepatient)
         A rising tide lifts all yachts. :) -NT - (a6l6e6x)
         Who else? - (mhuber)

Better get a sitter for the kids and spend our waning hours dry-humping amongst a bunch of stalagtites.
110 ms