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New Re: And you add ANOTHER layer of excuses.
What a welcome relief, someone who actually takes some time to think and come up with some serious discussion. Someone who isn't focused on the war for the sole purpose of claiming it is going according to prediction.

You bring up many excellent points. I cannot argue about what happens in a war, I cannot argue that our media leaves much to be desired. I am not basing my opinions on the accounts our media provides, nor am I swallowing everything al-jazeera says.

The only part I take issue with is this:
Those grapes were sour anyway. If you want to shut him up, find something that contradicts his prediction. The problem is you can't, yet.

Cybermace, you're the one that looks like you're living in a dreamworld to me. Watch... even after Saddam falls, western soldiers will continue getting killed in Iraq. Do you think that the Iraqi are going to start dancing in the streets when Saddam falls? What's your prediction about what will happen when Saddam falls?

...simply because it is not over yet, and I do not believe anyone can truly predict what will happen in the next few weeks. I hope that the Iraqi people will be able to recover from decades of demoralization and oppression, but that will depend on what the rest of the world does.
New Hey, that's my prediction
Whether I'm right or not, only time will tell. That is my take on the likely outcome in southern Iraq, that's all: after Saddam is killed and his regime falls, I think the Shia in southern Iraq are going to turn on the coalition in a very big way. Time will tell whether I'm right.

I should perhaps underscore the fact that I have little doubt that Saddam's regime is going to fall. The question is, what happens after that? That's going to be the hard part... and the serious death toll in and blockading of Basra (no electricity or water now for over 72 hours, ongoing bombardment) is not going to help with how the locals (no friends of Saddam in southern Iraq) see the continued presence of US and UK forces.

As for Brandioch, so far his predictions have been borne out by the facts. He'd probably be more convincing if he didn't gloat about that so much, but then again, he's military; exulting in victory is what they do:]

/me puts on the asbestos suit.

Don't forget, the further into central Iraq the coalition goes, the more difficult it's going to get... Saddam's regime is Sunni, and so is the area around Baghdad. The local population is going to be even more hostile than it is in the south.

--\n-------------------------------------------------------------------\n* Jack Troughton                            jake at consultron.ca *\n* [link|http://consultron.ca|http://consultron.ca]                   [link|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca|irc://irc.ecomstation.ca] *\n* Kingston Ontario Canada               [link|news://news.consultron.ca|news://news.consultron.ca] *\n-------------------------------------------------------------------
New That is because you do not understand.
The only proof is prediction.

...simply because it is not over yet, and I do not believe anyone can truly predict what will happen in the next few weeks.
Well I can.

#1. Saddam will STILL not use nuke/chem/bio.

#2. US forces will take MORE hits as they fight through the cities.

#3. Within the next month, Saddam will be killed and the US will declare "victory".

#4. The fighting will continue in "isolated" incidents attributed to "terrorists".

The only proof is prediction.

Those who cannot make accurate predictions do NOT have a sufficient understanding of the situation.

Which results in the need for them to makes excuses when events do not unfold "correctly".
     Bingo... - (gdaustin) - (59)
         ROFLMAO! - (mmoffitt) - (15)
             we might well find legit sh*t, we havnt found it yet -NT - (boxley) - (14)
                 We stood a better chance with inspectors. - (mmoffitt) - (13)
                     Re: We stood a better chance with inspectors. - (cybermace5) - (12)
                         Nice lampoon. - (jake123) - (1)
                             Re: Nice lampoon. - (cybermace5)
                         Reasoned rebuttal. - (jake123) - (1)
                             Re: Reasoned rebuttal. - (cybermace5)
                         Re: We stood a better chance with inspectors. - (dmarker) - (7)
                             Another of Marlowe's friends from school? - (Brandioch) - (6)
                                 Re: Another of Marlowe's friends from school? - (cybermace5) - (5)
                                     Yep, another of his high school friends. - (Brandioch) - (1)
                                         Exactly, you finally are kind of getting it... - (screamer)
                                     Saddam's not dead - (jake123) - (2)
                                         which sadaam, there is several you know -NT - (boxley) - (1)
                                             One Dubya is one Dubya too many <grin> -NT - (dmarker)
         It was not immediately clear what chemicals were being - (boxley) - (3)
             Not sure what legit chemical factory would need... - (admin) - (2)
                 US has been bombing Iraq since Gulf War 1 - (jake123) - (1)
                     I'll accept that... - (admin)
         So why haven't they used any yet? -NT - (Brandioch) - (37)
             bingo...maybe not - (rcareaga) - (36)
                 I like this quote. - (Brandioch) - (35)
                     Re: I like this quote. - (cybermace5) - (34)
                         Marlowe should have briefed you better. - (Brandioch) - (33)
                             Re: Marlowe should have briefed you better. - (cybermace5) - (32)
                                 It's better to leave live agents with the enemy? - (Brandioch) - (31)
                                     And more. - (Brandioch) - (1)
                                         Re: And more. - (cybermace5)
                                     Re: It's better to leave live agents with the enemy? - (cybermace5) - (28)
                                         So, you pile excuse on excuse on excuse? - (Brandioch) - (27)
                                             Re: So, you pile excuse on excuse on excuse? - (cybermace5) - (26)
                                                 Vietnam - (Brandioch) - (24)
                                                     Big difference - (cybermace5) - (23)
                                                         Parallels... - (ChrisR) - (4)
                                                             And one other thought... - (ChrisR) - (2)
                                                                 And another... - (ChrisR) - (1)
                                                                     +10 for insight. - (Brandioch)
                                                             Re: Parallels... - (deSitter)
                                                         How many WOULD have been sufficient? - (Brandioch) - (15)
                                                             The biggest difference.... - (ChrisR) - (3)
                                                                 :) But if no one watches it on TV, does it matter? - (Brandioch) - (2)
                                                                     Afghanistan has been a good theatre for us. - (ChrisR) - (1)
                                                                         My problem with Afghanistan is..... - (Brandioch)
                                                             Re: How many WOULD have been sufficient? - (cybermace5) - (10)
                                                                 And you add ANOTHER layer of excuses. - (Brandioch) - (9)
                                                                     Re: And you add ANOTHER layer of excuses. - (cybermace5) - (8)
                                                                         Like I said, another layer of excuses. - (Brandioch) - (2)
                                                                             Re: Like I said, another layer of excuses. - (cybermace5) - (1)
                                                                                 And even more excuses from you. - (Brandioch)
                                                                         Re: And you add ANOTHER layer of excuses. - (jake123) - (4)
                                                                             the 4th Estate is heard (or not, as may be) - (rcareaga)
                                                                             Re: And you add ANOTHER layer of excuses. - (cybermace5) - (2)
                                                                                 Hey, that's my prediction - (jake123)
                                                                                 That is because you do not understand. - (Brandioch)
                                                         absolute horse sh*t - (boxley) - (1)
                                                             boxley brings us truth in labeling! - (rcareaga)
                                                 welcome to khassim :0 -NT - (boxley)
         The only proof is prediction. - (Brandioch)

It's Microsoft clearly boiling the frogs...
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