Post #198,034
3/11/05 9:59:54 AM
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Now I'm hungry for a Rueben
Think I'll visit [link|http://houstonpress.com/issues/2000-06-29/cafe2.html|Kenny & Ziggy's] this weekend.
Darrell Spice, Jr. [link|http://spiceware.org/gallery/ArtisticOverpass|Artistic Overpass]\n[link|http://www.spiceware.org/|SpiceWare] - We don't do Windows, it's too much of a chore
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Post #198,184
3/12/05 10:33:19 AM
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Now I want some green beer.
It's like, "How much more black could this be?", and the answer is none. None more black.
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Post #198,388
3/13/05 7:08:31 PM
3/13/05 9:56:51 PM
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Well, my first attempt at a Reuben . .
. . was reasonably successful, but the rather heavy bread I used (dark Ukranian rye) overwhelmed it a bit, so I think I'll try it open-face (as in your restaurant review) next time. A little Croatian horseraddish I used on part of it didn't hurt either.
The menu from Reuben's in New York indicates the original New York Reuben (1914) used ham, not corned beef and cole slaw rather than sauerkraut. The current Reuben with corned beef and sauerkraut seems to have been created in Omaha's Blackstone Hotel in 1925, but any differences with the New York version have been equalized since. Russian dressing is proper for either but thousand island is now often used.
"Reuben" is correct for either origin (Arnold Reuben vs. Reuben Kulakofsky), but the name is now often spelled "Rueben".
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #198,398
3/13/05 9:08:39 PM
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What's the difference between Russian and Thousand Island?
I've always seen them used interchangably. Which probably means you rarely find Russian, and everyone just uses Thousand Island. How different are they?
===
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Post #198,400
3/13/05 9:35:33 PM
3/14/05 12:06:30 AM
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Depends (corrected)
Some consider Thousand Island to be a derviative of Russian as it is commonly formulated ("a mixture of mayonnaise and ketsup"). Older recipes do not use mayonnaise and may or may not use tomato paste, so they are not as similar to Thousand Island.
I don't generally have mayonnaise so the recipe I used doesn't call for it, nor for tomato paste, but only oil, lemon juice, red wine vinegar, garlic, onion Dijon mustard, chili sauce, salt and pepper. It's quite good and it's reasonably thick made in my little mini-prep food processor - it's been hours and it shows no signs of separating.
So basically, it's hard to compare. Thousand Island's origin and formula are well identified, but what Russian dressing is is quite another matter. Some even say it was called "Russian" because it originally included caviar.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #198,468
3/14/05 10:11:54 AM
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Doesnt Thousand Island have more chunks?
What are those? Pickles or something?
It's like, "How much more black could this be?", and the answer is none. None more black.
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Post #198,510
3/14/05 12:04:15 PM
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Yes, it's supposed to have pickles . . .
. . and pimento and the ketsup in Russian is supposed to be replaced by chili sauce. Russian is supposed to have pimento but not the other stuff.
Interestingly, Russian Salad (said to have been invented by French chef Olivier in his Moscow restaurant) does have the pickle and similar ingredients, but the dressing for it isn't made separately.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #198,512
3/14/05 12:08:00 PM
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Wow.
First mention of the Olivier Salad from an American. Ok, Andrew, fess up. How did you come by this sacred knowledge? In Sanct-Petersburg no holiday meal is completed without a huge bowl of what we call "Olivier". IT probably has nothing to do with the original recipe, but the name survived.
--
And what are we doing when the two most powerful nations on earth -- America and Israel -- stomp on the elementary rights of human beings?
-- letter to the editor from W. Ostermeier, Liechtenstein
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Post #198,525
3/14/05 12:26:23 PM
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At this point I can't really say.
While I have a substantial stack of books on Russian, Ukranian, Lithuanian and Polish cooking I don't recall if I learned it from them or from some more general source. I did, however, know about its holiday importance.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #198,401
3/13/05 9:36:29 PM
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the freedom fries of sald dressing
All tribal myths are true, for a given value of "true" Terry Pratchett
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 48 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #198,407
3/14/05 12:02:13 AM
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Well, kind of anti-freedom fries actually . .
. . as shown by [link|http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/images/blpic-russiandressing.htm|this sign].\t\t\t
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Post #198,420
3/14/05 2:19:35 AM
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IN SOVIET RUSSIA
Salads dress YOU!
Peter
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Post #198,493
3/14/05 11:27:44 AM
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didn't make it
Found out mom's arriving today for a 3 week visit. It's one of her favorite restaurants so I held off to go with her. We normally split a reuben so we have room for desert. Kenny & Ziggy's make a killer coconut cream pie - they coat the crust with a layer of melted chocolate which hardens and prevents the cream from making the crust soggy.
On the spelling I was thinking "rue the day". Spelling's complicated enough w/out adding foreign words to the mix :-)
Darrell Spice, Jr. [link|http://spiceware.org/gallery/ArtisticOverpass|Artistic Overpass]\n[link|http://www.spiceware.org/|SpiceWare] - We don't do Windows, it's too much of a chore
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Post #198,513
3/14/05 12:08:31 PM
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But, but . . . .
. . English doesn't have anything but foreign words!
Start with some Old North German and mix in a liberal dash of every other language you can get your hands on and you have English.
English is hard to spell because the dictionary was invented righ smack in the middle of a major spelling transition, so it's half of one and half of the other.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #198,901
3/15/05 11:58:45 PM
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That's a cogent summary.
English is hard to spell because the dictionary was invented righ smack in the middle of a major spelling transition, so it's half of one and half of the other. Extremely succint. And accurate. I like. Wade.
Is it enough to love
Is it enough to breathe
Somebody rip my heart out
And leave me here to bleed
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Is it enough to die
Somebody save my life
I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary
Please
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