Re: Considering buying new computer...

Post #115,579 by qstephens 8/27/03 3:59:44 PM Reply	Re: Considering buying new computer... Try Dell. Seriously. qts
Post #115,580 by admin 8/27/03 4:01:28 PM Reply	Why? I'm not trying to be antagonistic... I just don't see the value proposition there. Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
Post #115,585 by pwhysall 8/27/03 4:28:46 PM Reply	Humungously powerful systems at low prices... ...if you stay well, well away from OptiPlex systems. They're optimised for manageability which means they've got WOL, DMI and friends out the wazoo but they tend to suck hard performance-wise. The Dimension 8300 I'm going to be getting in a couple of months (3.2GHz P4, 1G RAM, 200G SATA disk, Radeon 9800 Pro, 18" digi flat panel yadda yadda) comes in at about \ufffd2K. You just can't do that by buying the bits; the screen alone would eat nearly half your budget. OK, I'll try: CaseTek case, \ufffd52.88 : [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=58927\|http://web6.scan.co....fo.asp?WPID=58927] 450W PSU, \ufffd36.43 : [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=59491\|http://web6.scan.co....fo.asp?WPID=59491] 3.2GHz P4 CPU, \ufffd546.75 : (Scan don't provide product info for this) MSI 875PNEO-FIS2R mobo with SATA, \ufffd149.81 : [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=61402\|http://web6.scan.co....fo.asp?WPID=61402] 1G PC3200 memory, \ufffd123.38 : (Scan don't provide product info for this) 128Mb ATI Radeon 9800 Pro, \ufffd281.94 : (Scan don't provide product info for this) SoundBlaster Audigy 2, \ufffd85.72 : [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=43842\|http://web6.scan.co....fo.asp?WPID=43842] 18.1" TFT Iiyama 4636D, \ufffd727.33 : [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=14342\|http://web6.scan.co....fo.asp?WPID=14342] Windows XP Pro, \ufffd246.74 : [link\|http://www.insight.com/uk/apps/productpresentation/index.php?product_id=MSSA026NS\|http://www.insight.c...duct_id=MSSA026NS] Altec Lansing 641 4.1 speakers, \ufffd217.96 : [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=28116\|http://web6.scan.co....fo.asp?WPID=28116] Western Digital 200G SATA disk, \ufffd189.16 : [link\|http://www.insight.com/uk/apps/productpresentation/index.php?product_id=WDGA03KVP\|http://www.insight.c...duct_id=WDGA03KVP] Total: \ufffd2534.72 And that's before shipping! I know you could do that spec for MUCH less if you were prepared to (a) economise on quality and (b) shop around and (c) assemble the thing yourself. However, what the Dell has that the above system doesn't is 3 years on-site warranty :) Peter [link\|http://www.debian.org\|Shill For Hire] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Blog]
Post #115,586 by pwhysall 8/27/03 4:30:35 PM Reply	Damn. Add another 100 quid or so for a DVDROM drive + DVD writer. Peter [link\|http://www.debian.org\|Shill For Hire] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Blog]
Post #115,590 by Another Scott 8/27/03 4:50:31 PM Reply	Apples and oranges. The Dimension 8300 has a 250 W power supply. Dell doesn't offer the Iiyama monitor. I'm not up on memory these days, but you spec'ed PC3200 DDR RAM while the 8300 uses 400 MHz dual channel DDR - I don't know if they're equivalent. Dell typically skimps on memory speed. I get about $3800(2400 pounds) for a 8300 per your specs (but the 200 GB drive is Ultra ATA, not SATA, the speakers are different, etc.) from Dell US. It often does cost a little more to built-it yourself. But it's important to compare apples to apples - i.e. you can probably get better parts for the same price as the big PC houses. My $0.02. Cheers, Scott.
Post #115,611 by pwhysall 8/27/03 7:28:50 PM Reply	PC3200 == DDR 400, if I'm reading things right. Peter [link\|http://www.debian.org\|Shill For Hire] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Blog]
Post #115,614 by Another Scott 8/27/03 8:29:05 PM Reply	Right. crucial.com lists them as the same. Of course, you can get 500 MHz DDR RAM now from Corsair. $378 for 2x0.5 GB from newegg.com For the kind of money that Dell wants for the 8300 I would buy a nice display and about 6 $400 Athlon machines and set up a Beowulf cluster instead. >:-D Why am I reminded of an [link\|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/content/show?contentid=104428\|LRPD] you nominated? ;-) I hope you get the box! Cheers, Scott.
Post #115,699 by inthane-chan 8/28/03 2:49:21 PM Reply	ICRLRPD I See a Recursive LRPD! Why am I reminded of an LRPD [*] you nominated? In that final hour, when each breath is a struggle to take, and you are looking back over your life's accomplishments, which memories would you treasure? The empires you built, or the joy you spread to others? Therin lies the true measure of a man.
Post #115,701 by inthane-chan 8/28/03 2:49:32 PM Reply	Re: ICRLRPD (new thread) Created as new thread #115700 titled [link\|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=115700\|Re: ICRLRPD] In that final hour, when each breath is a struggle to take, and you are looking back over your life's accomplishments, which memories would you treasure? The empires you built, or the joy you spread to others? Therin lies the true measure of a man.
Post #115,606 by orion 8/27/03 7:12:40 PM Reply	Huh? I thought you didn't like SoundBlasters? Or am I remembering [link\|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/content/show?contentid=114690\|your post] differently? Thing is I've had zero issues with Creative Labs audio cards. Your milage may vary. *"Lady I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element"*
Post #115,609 by pwhysall 8/27/03 7:28:11 PM Reply	Oh hush. Just comparing like for like. Peter [link\|http://www.debian.org\|Shill For Hire] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Blog]
Post #115,641 by folkert 8/27/03 11:06:35 PM Reply	Yurz and Minz and Dellz Yours: [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=58927\|CaseTek Case CK-1018-B] \ufffd45.00 ex/VAT [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=59491\|450W CWT + SATA] \ufffd31.00 ex/VAT 3.2GHz P4 CPU, \ufffd465.32 ex/VAT [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=61402\|MSI 875PNEO-FIS2R 800fsb i875] \ufffd127.50 ex/VAT 1G PC3200 memory, \ufffd105.00 ex/VAT 128Mb ATI Radeon 9800 Pro, \ufffd239.95 ex/VAT [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=43842\|SoundBlaster Audigy 2] \ufffd73.00 ex/VAT [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=14342\|18.1" TFT Iiyama 4636D] \ufffd619.00 ex/VAT [link\|http://www.insight.com/uk/apps/productpresentation/index.php?product_id=MSSA026NS\|Windows XP Pro] \ufffd209.99 ex/VAT [link\|http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=28116\|Altec Lansing 641 4.1 Professional] \ufffd185.50 ex/VAT [link\|http://www.insight.com/uk/apps/productpresentation/index.php?product_id=WDGA03KVP\|Western Digital 200G SATA disk] \ufffd160.99 ex/VAT \ufffd2.143.82 == Total Line Item Cost \ufffd??? == Shipping \ufffd??? == Extended Warranties \ufffd395.90 == VAT \ufffd2,658.15 == Total Cost plus \ufffd100 for a DVD/CD Writer Mine: [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16811186029\|CaseTek Case CK-1019-2B] $49.00 ex/TAX [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16817153008\|Thermaltake W0013 Silent Purepower 480W] $63.99 ex/TAX [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16819116164\|Intel Pentium 4 3.2GHz 512k 800MHz FSB Retail] $635.00 ex/TAX ($476.25 ex/TAX OEM no fan or heatsink) [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16813130414\| 875P Neo-FIS2R] $174.00 ex/TAX [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16820145449\|CORSAIR MEMORY XMS, With Black Heat Spreaders.Retail] $248.00 ex/TAX [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16814102297\|ATI RADEON 9800 PRO 128MB DDR 8X AGP] $389.00 ex/TAX [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16829102154\|Creative Labs Sound Blaster Audigy 2] $112.00 ex/TAX [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16824006045\|Sony 18" Black LCD TFT Monitor, Model SDM0S81R/B ] $515.00 ex/TAX (This one has way better specs too) [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16837102143\|Microsoft Windows XP Professional with Service Pack SP1a] $143.00 ex/TAX (OEM Pricing when purchased with Hardware) [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16836113130\|Altec Lansing 5100 5.1 6-Piece Speaker System] $130.00 ex/TAX [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16822144153\|Western Digital 200GB SATA WD2000JD 7,200 RPM 8MB Hard Drive] $238.00 ex/TAX [link\|http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=N82E16827109204\|TDK Indi DVD+/-RW Drive AID+440N] DVD+R, DVD+RW, DVD-R, DVD-RW, CD-R, CD-RW $239.00 $2,905.99 == Total Line Item Cost with a $30 instant Rebate on TFT Display $40 == Shipping $123.12 == Extend Warranties 1 year past Original on all parts except TFT Display (shucks) $174.36 == 6% Michigan Sales Tax $3,079.36 == Total cost shipped to my door Dell Dimension 8300 Apportioned Much alike the previous: $3,617.00 == Total Machine Cost with priority Support for full 3 year term $90.00 == Shipping $222.42 == TAX $3,929.42 total cost shipped to my door. Yurz:\t$4,413.04\t\ufffd2,758.15\nDell:\t$3,929.24\t\ufffd2,455.78\nMine:\t$3,079.36\t\ufffd1,924.60 I don't know... but I am seeing a bit of a trend. -- [link\|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net\|greg], [link\|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry\|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ *i_wethey* Your fingers are as divine as the pope's nostril hair.
Post #116,859 by qstephens 9/6/03 5:07:19 AM Reply	Re: Yurz and Minz and Dellz Aren't you forgetting the cost of all the software that comes with it? You don't just get XP Pro, you get Works and other bits and bobs. And your prices seem way OTT. For a 2.8 GHz Dell with XP Pro, 1 GB RAM, and a 120 GB HDD I get a total cost of \ufffd1450 + \ufffd219 for Office Pro. A 3.2 GHz Dell Dimension 8300 with identical options is \ufffd1743 All prices include VAT. Both systems include TFT monitors. qts
Post #116,864 by folkert 9/6/03 9:16:00 AM Reply	Please compare Apples to Apples Please. If you'll note... EVERYTHING on the machine and proper Hard Drive Specs... and so on. Including the Upgraded Video and the lavish Hard Drive space, the sound system the ... well you understand. Please compare The equivalently apportioned 8300 as compared to mine or peters. Thanks... oh and also take into account the prices are continuously falling, were as Dell's are not typically going to until they feel like it. -- [link\|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net\|greg], [link\|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry\|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ *i_wethey* Nits, Nats, GNITS, GNATS, always to many to choose from.
Post #115,643 by Arkadiy 8/27/03 11:21:28 PM Reply	I did Dell last time... In mid-to-low-end machines (which seems to be all I can afford), Dell appears to be $100 or more premium over no-name computers. 25% difference. No good. -- Less Is More. In my book, About Face, I introduce over 50 powerful design axioms. This is one of them. --Alan Cooper. The Inmates Are Running the Asylum

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