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New Red Hat 9.0 ("Shrike") First Impressions
Well, a cow-orker is expressing an interest in Linux.

He's got precisely no experience in UNIX-type operating systems, so we need a system that's going to go from zero to hero with the least amount of pain.

So I thought "Red Hat's the way to go" for a couple of reasons. Firstly, he's heard of it. Brand familiarity is important-ish when you're trying to advocate something. Two, it's a superslick installer. We need to get that out of the way and get on with the business of Linux.

OK, so I download the three ISO images from [link|http://www.mirror.ac.uk|http://www.mirror.ac.uk] (pulling a steady 220KB a second - *gloat*) and burned me some disks.

I've just vaped Windows XP on my home machine and claimed the space on the Big Fast Disk for Debian, so that's freed up a 10G disk.

polonius, my home desktop, is an Athlon 1800XP+ on a Gigabyte 7ZXE mobo, 512MB RAM, VIA Apollo Pro chipset, Creative Labs SBLive!, Nvidia GeForce 4 Ti4200, 3Com 3c05B NIC. In other words, there's precisely NO unusual hardware in there.

This box has successfully taken installs of Debian, Windows XP, and Windows 2000 with no drama.

OK, so we boot off the first CD. We whack <RETURN> for a graphical installation.

Choose language and keyboard, and then we come to the disk partitioning.

Now, I don't want to let the installer do it automatically because I've got a precious Debian installation on /dev/hda - however, I can zap the contents of /dev/hdb, so I choose the Disk Druid method.

I scroll down the list of partitions and select /dev/hdb1 (intending to delete it) and note how it's nice that when you select a partition in the list, it's highlighted in the graphical representation above. A good little bit of interface design, there, that's probably stopped much wailing and gnashing of teeth.

I double-click it, delete it, and return to the main interface. And wait. And wait. And wait.

I kill the whole shooting match and start over. This is safe, because Disk Druid doesn't commit your changes until you click "Next", at which point it goes off deleting partitions and making filesystems.

Well, that's the theory.

I went around this loop a couple of times, only to have the graphical installer hang on me every time I performed an operation.

At this point, I abandoned all hope of using the graphical installer and used the text one - which is the old familiar interface that's essentially unchanged since Red Hat 5.2 ("Apollo"). It's simple, it's basic, and it works.

I chose a "Workstation" installation, which gets you your desktop plus a pile of admin tools. I suspect the "Desktop" installation is a tiny bit bare for the likes of me.

OK, first boot [aside: there was some jiggery pokery here with bootloaders that I shan't bore you with, because most people don't dual-boot two flavours of Linux] and everything's working. There's a nice "first run" wizard that walks you through setting up a regular user, registering with and performing your first Red Hat Update, etc. All my hardware had been detected and worked.

One point that I was impressed with in the installation was the use of plain English explanations, button labels, and icon captions. At any point during the graphical installation you can click a button and read the release notes. Good idea.

RHU worked *really well*. I was surprised, as a common complaint is that the servers are either inaccessible or really slow. I maxed out my pipe as it downloaded about 40MB of update packages.

OK, The very nice GDM screen gives way to a very nice GNOME2 splash screen gives way to a very nice GNOME desktop. All the graphical polish that debuted with RH8 is here in RH9 in spades. Bluecurve has had a slight remix, the title bars being slightly shinier than in previous incarnations. It's still unmistakeably Red Hat Linux looking at you, though.

The application set is reasonable - OpenOffice.org installed by default, Evolution is the default mail client, Mozilla the default web browser - although Galeon is also present.

I like the menu - for each submenu, it has the front-running applications and then a "More <foo> applications" submenu. This reduces clutter.

There's a little accessory that runs on your panel and tells you when there are "criticial updates".

XFree86 4.3 is used, which means nice colourful cursors and the ability to change desktop resolution on the fly. The display prefs dialog is excellent - you pick your resolution and colour depth and refresh rate, and bingo. It Just Works. A functional fontconfig setup meant that I was able to download the Vera fonts, copy the local.conf to /etc/fonts, dump the fonts into ~/.fonts, and they were instantly there.

Which leads me nicely to the next point. Evolution and GAIM are the GTK1.2 editions. Now, Evolution 1.3, which is ported to GTK2 and takes full advantage of fontconfig, is a beta product. GAIM 0.60, however, is not. I would have liked to have seen the initial application set of RH9 be fully fontconfig enabled - and that means GTK2 or QT3.

There's a bunch of nice tools for diddling with your system settings, adding and removing software (although, for one coming from Debian, the selection of software available was tragically small). Red Hat have done a lot to integrate it all together.

This is an ideal desktop operating system for someone coming from Windows.

It's also an ideal desktop operating system for someone who doesn't know computers at all.

It's incredibly claustrophobic. It's alien. I downloaded the nVidia drivers from [link|http://www.nvidia.com|http://www.nvidia.com] and installed them. Restarting GDM, I spent about five minutes cursing about "stupid bloody /etc/rc.d/init.d/blah bollocks" when I remembered "telinit 3 && telinit 5". There's no "apt-get" tool. I can't find out how to get the "Add/remove software" tool to look at an internet source, rather than the CDs. The graphical installer hangs on my machine.

In short, it's still Red Hat Linux.

If you'd never seen any Debian-based distribution, you'd be impressed. For sheer desktop polish, it's head and shoulders above everything else. Mandrake tries too hard. SuSE is a bit dour. Red Hat has visual class.

What this thing would look like a year down the line, I don't care to guess. The fact remains that for an experienced user, Debian Linux is the PC operating system of choice, and that's the end of that.


Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
New Well done.
Didja Grab the themes foff it?

8-)
[link|mailto:curley95@attbi.com|greg] - IT Grand-Master for Anti-President
[link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry/|REMEMBER ED CURRY!]
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----\nVersion: 3.12+\nGAT d+ s+:++ a C++++ UBHLO++++ P+ L+++ E---/E---- W+++ N+ o--\nK--- w--- O+ M+ V-- PS-- PE Y+ PGP++ t+ 5++ X+ R tv+ b+++ DI+++\nD++ Q2+++ Q3A+++ UT+++ UT2K3+++ G e* h--- r+++ z+++*\n------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
New Thanks for your review - hadn't realised ...

9.0 was already available.

Am hoping to get established in new apartment next week & have a spare computer to try it on.

Last week managed to purchace a MEDION special (it has win/xp home on it but I can *easily fix that*).

If time permits will add my impression of install.

Cheers

Doug


Spectres from our past: Beware the future when your children & theirs come after you for what you may have been willing to condone today - dsm 2003


Motivational: When performing activities, ask yourself if the person you most want to be would do, or say, it - dsm 2003
New My update RH8 -> RH9 was quite smooth.
Alex

Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. -- Blaise Pascal (1623-1662)
New That's what I'm hearing.
Red Hat version upgrades have had a deservedly bad reputation in the past. Whilst poking around on various web sites, I've seen a number of comments to the effect that the 8->9 upgrade seems to be a viable option.

A notable issue might be the Ximian GNOME desktop package. In the release notes it talks about the Ximian GNOME packages causing problems. The solution seems to be to remove Ximian GNOME, perform the upgrade, and then reinstall it.


Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
New Second Impressions.
One big surprise this morning. Got around to mounting up my extant home partition so I could spin some tunes, and lo! XMMS as shipped by Red Hat doesn't support MP3 playback out of the box. There's a dialogue box with an excuse about patents and source code, which is nice, and all, but I can't play roughly 50% of my playlist. ogg is supported straight off the bat. A quick trip to [link|http://xmms.org|http://xmms.org] produced the required RPM file to add mpg123 support to XMMS.

In the Add/Remove Software configuration tool, I still can't determine how to make the package source something other than the CDs. This is frustrating now, as they're at work and I'm at home.

It's still Not Debian. It's amazing, given a fat internet pipe (I have 1MBit cable), how used you get to "apt-get install blah" and Everything Just Working. [0]

The base application set for a Workstation install is really quite strong. Palmpeople will be pleased to see Gnome-pilot present, and digital snappers will likewise be heartened by gtkam, the GUI for the nifty GPhoto2 camera suite. All but the most demanding graphical needs are met by The GIMP. In addition to OpenOffice.org, there is Dia and MrProject.

In terms of perceived performance, the system seems at least as responsive as the Debian GNOME2.2 desktop, which is, for me, a fluid and tactile environment.

I'm sure at least some of this comes from a very modular kernel, as you can see from the output of lsmod(8):

[root@polonius root]# lsmod
Module Size Used by Tainted: P
loop 11928 0
emu10k1 68136 1 (autoclean)
ac97_codec 13544 0 (autoclean) [emu10k1]
sound 73108 0 (autoclean) [emu10k1]
soundcore 6276 7 (autoclean) [emu10k1 sound]
agpgart 46752 3 (autoclean)
nvidia 1672480 10 (autoclean)
parport_pc 18756 1 (autoclean)
lp 8868 0 (autoclean)
parport 36480 1 (autoclean) [parport_pc lp]
iptable_filter 2380 0 (autoclean) (unused)
ip_tables 14648 1 [iptable_filter]
autofs 12948 0 (autoclean) (unused)
3c59x 30416 1
sg 35980 0 (autoclean)
sr_mod 17912 0 (autoclean)
ide-scsi 11984 0
scsi_mod 106200 3 [sg sr_mod ide-scsi]
ide-cd 35196 0
cdrom 33472 0 [sr_mod ide-cd]
keybdev 2880 0 (unused)
mousedev 5428 1
hid 21700 0 (unused)
input 5792 0 [keybdev mousedev hid]
usb-uhci 25868 0 (unused)
usbcore 77696 1 [hid usb-uhci]
ext3 69984 3
jbd 51220 3 [ext3]


CD writing is supported, but I was really quite disappointed to see the aging GnomeToaster (The last official release was last September) instead of either XCDRoast or, better, K3B. K3B is the gold standard for UNIX CD writing programs, due to two main things - its excellent interface, and the fact that, as far as I'm aware, it's the only CD writing software on UNIX that supports writing ISO 9660 Layer 3 CDs. Joe Average won't care about this, but you might - without Layer 3 support, you can't write CDs containing filenames longer than 31 characters.

I was also disappointed to see the menu entry for this buried in System Tools->More System Tools. It's not a "system tool". It's an end-user application!

As you might expect from a major release of Red Hat Linux, all the applications supplied are a rev or two behind. Mozilla is version 1.2.1, Evolution is version 1.2.2, X-Chat is 1.8.11, and so on. However, Mozilla is fully xft-enabled, so beauteous fonts are available. Interesting omissions include no Java and no Flash, which you'd expect to see in an end-user distribution.

So far, I've added 5 packages that are not included with the distribution:

  • NVidia kernel driver for fast hardware-accelerated 3D graphics.
  • Bitstream Vera fonts - [link|http://www.gnome.org/fonts|http://www.gnome.org/fonts]
  • XMMS MP3 support
  • Flash
  • Java

It would have been helpful for Red Hat to place a README somewhere, or even have on the homepage a note: "As we can't distribute some browser plugins and add-ons, here's links to package download pages", rather than having the user figure it out.


Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
     Red Hat 9.0 ("Shrike") First Impressions - (pwhysall) - (5)
         Well done. - (folkert)
         Thanks for your review - hadn't realised ... - (dmarker) - (2)
             My update RH8 -> RH9 was quite smooth. -NT - (a6l6e6x) - (1)
                 That's what I'm hearing. - (pwhysall)
         Second Impressions. - (pwhysall)

The revolution will not be televised. You can apt-get it from the usual mirrors, however.
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