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New My point on all this is...
...that while I want there to be some semblance of a level of Grammatik in a language (even in a "slut" like English...again, nicely said), I believe that attempts to freeze a language at a fixed period of time is a fool's errand. Note that there hasen't been a dearth of fools that have wanted to take that errand on (Hitler in the 1930's, L'Academie Francaise currently, China at various times in it long and checkered history). Like everything else, if a language doesn't evolve with the times, it dies; it is supreme arrogance to even consider that a language has a mechanism to express every experience (and thing, for that matter) that its speakers will ever need to express.

That said, I find myself increasingly irritated with some of the bastardation of English that is going on. My two all time favorites:

"A apple" (Using "a" instead of "an" preceding a word that starts with a vowel).

"There is some..." (Using a singluar verb as the predicate for a plural subject).


I could care less about the further/farther debate (although I believe a literate person should be able to tell the difference).

[Edit: changed the "dearth of fools" sentence to make something resembling sense...]
jb4
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning."
Rich Cook
Expand Edited by jb4 April 11, 2003, 05:35:52 PM EDT
New Another for you, with my complements.
"The point is is that..."

Grrr!

I don't think I can hear any TV or radio political commentary/debate without that being mentioned once.

Cheers,
Scott.
New fools' errands
Indeed, the only effectively frozen language I can think of offhand is Latin (we used to call it a "dead" language, which puzzled me when I was growing up), although there are probably analogues in other cultures. In the "natural" state of humanity--before, that is, mechanized travel and mass media, particularly radio onward--languages tended to differentiate and finally speciate according to geography, and those centrifugal forces still exist, as I was reminded while attempting to chat up an Australian in Amsterdam a few years back. Particularly with television and films we see an opposite, homogenizing tendency with respect to the differentiation of language over distance, although these technologies may also serve to accelerate the development (or devolution, if you're feeling jaundiced) of language over time. The brief, explosive vogue a couple of decades back of the "Valley Girl" argot could be considered to demonstrate both those premises.

The goal of freezing language is perhaps foolish; certainly unattainable. The attempt, however, might be worth while--serving, as I said, to retard its headlong rush into incomprehensibility for anyone not in the first blush of youth.

I don't really get upset when further and farther are commingled in popular use (I suspect that "farther" will be pushed out over time), but I bristle at the (exclusively written) confusion over its and it's, and as for "lie" and "lay" (as in "I think I'll go lay down")...well, if necessary I'll form bands of partisans in the hills, all of us in civilian clothing and with plenty of grenade launchers to go around, before I yield on that one.

militantly,
"Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist."
New Or in the immortal words of Captain Kirk
(suitably er altered to suit the occasion)
-Hey..! poetic licentiousness; that's involuntary wordslaughter.

Yes, Spock: we Are language murderers!
But... each day I can say..
Today!
[I will not dither a dipthong.. pontificate with a preterite.. make an absurd surd..]
Today I-Will-not-murder language!!



Live Long and Prosper
     Grammar error in NYT headline? - (deSitter) - (20)
         Distinction without a difference, I think. -NT - (a6l6e6x) - (13)
             Hey, I think DRL is on to something here - subtle but there - (dmarker) - (1)
                 Farther is upperclass fer yer Da -NT - (boxley)
             DeSitter is correct on this one - (rcareaga) - (10)
                 OK. So, I check my Merriam Webster's Collegiate Dictionary. - (a6l6e6x) - (2)
                     Although the moon is smaller than the Earth, - (Ashton) - (1)
                         the serendipitous LRPD for this post, - (rcareaga)
                 Nicely said. - (jb4) - (6)
                     Re: Nicely said. - (rcareaga) - (5)
                         It seems that the French are the cleaner and still have more - (Ashton)
                         My point on all this is... - (jb4) - (3)
                             Another for you, with my complements. - (Another Scott)
                             fools' errands - (rcareaga) - (1)
                                 Or in the immortal words of Captain Kirk - (Ashton)
         Secret Message Encoding? - (andread) - (5)
             The flick "A Beautiful Mind" has a bit of that too... -NT - (Another Scott)
             Now that you've stumbled onto the nature of Ashton's posts.. - (imric) - (3)
                 OT: "Omniscient LRPD" more sinister than previously thought? (new thread) - (CRConrad)
                 Re: Now that you've steganographed - (Ashton) - (1)
                     *chuckle* -NT - (imric)

Go into the light!
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