not really and heres why

8) Ordering indefinite detention of non-citizens in the United States and elsewhere, and without
charge, at the discretionary designation of the Attorney General or the Secretary of Defense.

under the immigration laws non citizens have no rights under the constitution so holding them indefinately is not against American Law

9) Ordering and authorizing the Attorney General to override judicial orders of release of
detainees under INS jurisdiction, even where the judicial officer after full hearing determines a
detainee is wrongfully held by the government.

read the imeeigration law, Justice department can do that. Not pretty but legal.

10) Authorizing secret military tribunals and summary execution of persons who are not citizenswho are designated solely at the discretion of the Executive who acts as indicting official,
prosecutor and as the only avenue of appellate relief.

not against american law, precedent galore. Not pretty not good but neither a crime or a misdemeanor.
thanx,
bill

Post #94,844 by boxley 4/7/03 3:14:43 PM Reply	not really and heres why 8) Ordering indefinite detention of non-citizens in the United States and elsewhere, and without charge, at the discretionary designation of the Attorney General or the Secretary of Defense. under the immigration laws non citizens have no rights under the constitution so holding them indefinately is not against American Law 9) Ordering and authorizing the Attorney General to override judicial orders of release of detainees under INS jurisdiction, even where the judicial officer after full hearing determines a detainee is wrongfully held by the government. read the imeeigration law, Justice department can do that. Not pretty but legal. 10) Authorizing secret military tribunals and summary execution of persons who are not citizenswho are designated solely at the discretion of the Executive who acts as indicting official, prosecutor and as the only avenue of appellate relief. not against american law, precedent galore. Not pretty not good but neither a crime or a misdemeanor. thanx, bill will work for cash and other incentives [link\|http://home.tampabay.rr.com/boxley/resume/Resume.html\|skill set] questions, help? [link\|mailto:pappas@catholic.org\|email pappas at catholic.org] Since corporations are the equivelent of human but they have no "concience" they are by definition sociopaths
Post #95,026 by jb4 4/8/03 11:21:08 AM Reply	Reading is a skill...I need to learn it I missed the "non-citizen" part of the 3 articles. I guess I need to increase the font on my browser. Nice catch. jb4 "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." Rich Cook
Post #95,027 by boxley 4/8/03 11:23:47 AM Reply	My eyes are getting shot also :-) will work for cash and other incentives [link\|http://home.tampabay.rr.com/boxley/resume/Resume.html\|skill set] questions, help? [link\|mailto:pappas@catholic.org\|email pappas at catholic.org] Since corporations are the equivelent of human but they have no "concience" they are by definition sociopaths
Post #95,183 by ben_tilly 4/8/03 9:11:15 PM Reply	But you forget the million dollar question... What safeguards are there in case an actual citizen is accidentally imprisoned? Without some level of public scruitiny, the practical effect is that none of us - citizens or not - have any protection. However this issue is not new to Bush. See the broad powers of unaudited incarceration that the border patrol has enjoyed for a long time now... Cheers, Ben "good ideas and bad code build communities, the other three combinations do not" - [link\|http://archives.real-time.com/pipermail/cocoon-devel/2000-October/003023.html\|Stefano Mazzocchi]
Post #95,186 by boxley 4/8/03 9:15:22 PM Reply	safeguard is riding on the Padilla case winding its way thru the courts as we speak. He is a rat but as a citizen he has rights and there is a team working on it. thanx, bill will work for cash and other incentives [link\|http://home.tampabay.rr.com/boxley/resume/Resume.html\|skill set] questions, help? [link\|mailto:pappas@catholic.org\|email pappas at catholic.org] Since corporations are the equivelent of human but they have no "concience" they are by definition sociopaths
Post #95,188 by ben_tilly 4/8/03 9:22:54 PM Reply	He was publicized What is scary about the Border Patrol is that they never bother notifying anyone, nor do they let you do so. If you cannot talk to anyone, and nobody is told that you are held, how can there be any guarantee that anyone will find out that you are a citizen and do anything about it? In fact the cynical ones among us will note that if they did discover a mistake, human nature would say that they should just let you rot to avoid the publicity of having to publically admit to the situation, and make other people think about it... Cheers, Ben "good ideas and bad code build communities, the other three combinations do not" - [link\|http://archives.real-time.com/pipermail/cocoon-devel/2000-October/003023.html\|Stefano Mazzocchi]
Post #95,232 by Simon_Jester 4/8/03 10:40:20 PM Reply	The Padilla case is nice...what about Mike Hawash ? And what are you going to do when (if?) the court finally decide, ya know...the government was wrong? Does that give him back time with his family?
Post #95,238 by boxley 4/8/03 10:48:21 PM Reply	or Leanard Peltier still in prison its the sacrifice of the innocent to save the guilty I know but its the best we can do at this time. thanx, bill will work for cash and other incentives [link\|http://home.tampabay.rr.com/boxley/resume/Resume.html\|skill set] questions, help? [link\|mailto:pappas@catholic.org\|email pappas at catholic.org] Since corporations are the equivelent of human but they have no "concience" they are by definition sociopaths

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