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New Was it at least all the same union?
I spent a college summer (in the mid-1980s) working at a piston ring company. It was a multi-union shop, but as a temp, I wasn't required to join (thankfully!)

The machines, as machines do, would often need fixing and adjustment. The most common fix would have taken me about 3 minutes to perform. However, union rules prevented me from fixing it. First, I turned it off (surprisingly, I WAS allowed to do that). Then, the power cord had to be unplugged from the outlet. That required an electrical union person. Then, the hydraulics needed to be disconnected. That required another union person. And the water supply needed to be disconnected, requiring yet a third union person. Finally, the adjustments required a wrench and a fourth union person to turn it. Then, put it all back together required finding all the right union people again. And god forbid one of the unions was on break.

What I could have easily done by myself in 3 minutes required 4 people and anywhere from 30-90 minutes. Not because of real training or safety needs, just because of union rules formulated to keep otherwise unneeded people employed.

Now multiply this by a half-dozen machines requiring this type of work 1-2 times per week (possibly per shift, too).

Brian Bronson
New reminds me of the storey between the Raj
and the Majharreta. The brit leftenant looking down his nose at the lady ruler saying a single clerk was doing the work that her former staff of 20 babus could do. She said, yes and now they are beggars and theives in the market place instead of respected scholars. So effieciency is only a small part of the picture.
thanx,
bill
will work for cash and other incentives [link|http://home.tampabay.rr.com/boxley/resume/Resume.html|skill set]

You think that you can trust the government to look after your rights? ask an Indian
New Henry Ford
also learned that paying his employees enough to be able to afford to buy cars was good business.

Same principal. Send all the work and money overseas and you'll be a wealthy despot living in a slum.

Quality for all begins at home.
I am out of the country for the duration of the Bush administration.
Please leave a message and I'll get back to you when democracy returns.
New Fucking OF COURSE!
Why is that message so hard to understand???
-drl
New Prisoners dilema
Thats the driving management principle today.

Operating according to the Nash theory of equilibrium would produce a nicer world - but this (and I blame the idiot business press for this shit) is not a popularly received concept.

Example: Every single issue of Infoworld during the 90's until we left it en masse featured a headline using the formula "Product A vs Product B Can Product B survive?" Where Product A is usually a MS product.

This is of course, idiotic. But its been drummed into the popular psyche at large by the ink-stained know-nothing pundits. It will required a vast sea-change in thinking to undo this bit of propaganda.

I am out of the country for the duration of the Bush administration.
Please leave a message and I'll get back to you when democracy returns.
New Nice Exposition of PD
[link|http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/prisoner-dilemma/|http://plato.stanfor...prisoner-dilemma/]
-drl
     H-1B Reform / IT Union - (JayMehaffey) - (80)
         should be IBEW INHO that would handle retirement - (boxley)
         Good point about nervousness of real AFL/CIO motives. - (a6l6e6x)
         Why? Labor is labor. -NT - (deSitter) - (31)
             Why what? - (JayMehaffey) - (30)
                 Better a bad union, than no union at all. - (orion) - (29)
                     imnsho, no union is a good union. -NT - (jbrabeck) - (1)
                         Yup, let's go back to the days before unions. - (imric)
                     Beg to differ. - (hnick) - (6)
                         I did it myself - (orion) - (5)
                             How about? - (gdaustin) - (4)
                                 Yes I agree - (orion) - (3)
                                     Dreamers.... - (gdaustin) - (2)
                                         A question for you - (lincoln) - (1)
                                             Visit this website - (orion)
                     My experiences with the Union - (bluke) - (19)
                         Duplicate post. @#$@#&% computer! -NT - (jbrabeck)
                         Similiar - (jbrabeck)
                         Was it at least all the same union? - (bbronson) - (5)
                             reminds me of the storey between the Raj - (boxley) - (4)
                                 Henry Ford - (tuberculosis) - (3)
                                     Fucking OF COURSE! - (deSitter) - (2)
                                         Prisoners dilema - (tuberculosis) - (1)
                                             Nice Exposition of PD - (deSitter)
                         Good examples - (imric) - (10)
                             Sanity at last - but.. - (deSitter) - (9)
                                 Empty? - (imric) - (7)
                                     Re: Empty? - (deSitter) - (6)
                                         Here - (broomberg) - (4)
                                             BAHAHAHA - (deSitter) - (3)
                                                 Frog in the pot; works repeatedly via ego blindness - (Ashton) - (2)
                                                     Exactly - (deSitter) - (1)
                                                         'Shirking' not my point - (imric)
                                         The problem is imagining that Unions - (imric)
                                 At what cost??? - (bluke)
         All it means to me - (orion)
         We beat this to death - (broomberg) - (11)
             So? The issue keeps coming up - (deSitter) - (10)
                 Nahh - (broomberg) - (9)
                     Right! - (deSitter)
                     Uh, I don't get this: - (CRConrad) - (7)
                         Yup - (broomberg) - (6)
                             So you're assuming the second category doesn't need a union? -NT - (CRConrad) - (1)
                                 Yup - (broomberg)
                             Only if - (JayMehaffey) - (1)
                                 But it's appropriate - (broomberg)
                             Yup - (deSitter) - (1)
                                 Try it - (broomberg)
         H1-B Problem Taking Care of Itself - (gdaustin) - (31)
             Mostly cost pressure - (bluke)
             Wrong - (deSitter) - (21)
                 Is that really your dream? - (Arkadiy) - (19)
                     A dream shared - (orion)
                     Re: Is that really your dream? - (deSitter) - (17)
                         Unions kill productivity in many ways - (bluke) - (15)
                             Bad example - (broomberg) - (14)
                                 Duplicate post - ignore -NT - (bluke) - (1)
                                     HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! sorry couldnt help it - (boxley)
                                 Not really ... - (bluke) - (11)
                                     But remember this - (orion)
                                     You have the heart of it. - (static)
                                     Actually, there are ways around their rigid rules - (tonytib) - (8)
                                         How about we split the difference - (orion) - (6)
                                             Nice thought but unfeasible - (hnick) - (5)
                                                 Re: Nice thought but unfeasible - (orion) - (4)
                                                     Oh good, you mostly agree with me - (hnick) - (3)
                                                         Vote with your feet? - (orion) - (2)
                                                             Nothing is intolerable until you have a choice. - (hnick) - (1)
                                                                 Re: Nothing is intolerable until you have a choice. - (orion)
                                         Yes, the word Union blinds to - the possibilities in '02+ -NT - (Ashton)
                         Re: Is that really your dream? - (Arkadiy)
                 But, Greed is good... - (gdaustin)
             I disagree. A compromise needed - (tablizer) - (7)
                 Re: I disagree. A compromise needed - (gdaustin) - (5)
                     And what if they really can do the job ... - (bluke) - (3)
                         One of the major development costs is communication overhead - (ben_tilly) - (2)
                             Believe me I know ... - (bluke) - (1)
                                 Sounds like we are on the same page then - (ben_tilly)
                     Corporate lying, not individuals - (tablizer)
                 Your COBOL vs Java example is flawed - (broomberg)
         interesting note on HB1 my interview is with a HB1 supplier - (boxley)

*SHUN*
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