Anyone using Eclipse?

Post #70,671 by bluke 12/24/02 11:13:43 AM Reply	Anyone using Eclipse? I just started trying it out, it has some interesting features but 1 thing really annoyed me. Every time you change code and save it it tries to incrementally build your project. They obviously took this from Smalltalk however, while this makes sense for Smalltalk it doesn't for Java. In Smalltalk, because it is dynamically typed, I can partially write a method and it will probably compile, I can write a method that calls non-existant (yet) objects and it will compile, etc. However, in Java, because it is statically typed, if I write a method that calls a method in another class that I haven't written yet, it won't compile, if I partially implement an interface it won't compile, etc. It is idiotic to try to compile every time I save a method in Java as many times it won't compile for obvious reasons, I am still in the middle.
Post #70,677 by tuberculosis 12/24/02 11:29:44 AM Reply	The WebObjects victims are using it on Windows and Linux because Apple's non-Mac tools suck. I personally hate it but then the Mac version is pretty far behind the PC one. I am out of the country for the duration of the Bush administration. Please leave a message and I'll get back to you when democracy returns.
Post #70,721 by tjsinclair 12/24/02 6:11:18 PM Reply	We're going to be using it in class I'm teaching Java next term to a bunch of students who have already had C++. Since our IT budget for anything non-MS is effectively nil, I've been looking at various cross-platform Java IDEs. I settled on NetBeans and Eclipse (so that we have a choice) and am running the class on Linux. I'm giving students the Win32 versions of all of our tools on CD the first day, including the Sun JDK. I suspect some folks like JBuilder. However, it didn't make the cut for a variety of reasons, most personal. - I don't like the hoops Borland makes you dance through to get a (free) limited function IDE. - I tested JBuilder from the perspective of a C++ student coming from a Visual C++ 6 environment and decided I would spend too much time explaining the differences. (As I said, it's probably not that objective a decision.) Eclipse certainly isn't perfect, but it's continually improving and the interface is fairly straightforward. At least it appears to be a tool that might reasonably be found in a Java development shop and we try to use these kind of tools if possible. The command line tools are there as well and I don't discourage any of my students from using them. (The textbook, in fact, assumes you're using the command line.) I'd be interested in hearing about experience with Java IDEs in 'real-life' from the folks here, though. Particularly from the standpoint of someone who already knows how to code but is looking for a tool they can grow into. (Like my students, for example.) Tom Sinclair "Everybody is someone else's weirdo." - E. Dijkstra
Post #70,756 by bluke 12/25/02 3:29:31 AM Reply	I have been using Forte/Netbeans Once you understand it's philososphy it is very powerful, but it has a large learning curve. For example, in other IDE's (like JBuilder, VisualCafe) you set the classpath explicitly, in Forte you don't, you need to mount the filesystems, this is not obvious. Eclipse as I mentioned is less like any C/C++ tools as there is no explicit compile cycle, you save a method it is compiled. IMHO, what is missing from all these tools is a good class browser. Coming from Smalltalk I lived in the class browser, where you could see the hierarchy and each method individually. A very good free tool is Teikade, which is a nice (albeit old) browser. You can find it here [link\|http://www.pfu.co.jp/teikade/1.9/\|Teikade] I use it extensively to look at source code such as the JDK source etc.
Post #71,029 by johnu 12/26/02 10:35:53 PM Reply	Re: Anyone using Eclipse? I've been using Eclipse for over 1/2 year. I love it. Coming from PowerBuilder, I really appreciate the incremental compilation (you can turn it off if it bugs you). I also am addicted to the built in refactorings. Regards, John

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