Headless virtual adventures on old hardware.
My stepmom has a (2014?) 21" iMac that she uses to run Win7 and Quicken for Windows using VirtualBox, among other things. It worked fine for ages, but then something happened in an update and broke it. I'd been helping her with it via e-mail, but hadn't really run Virtual Box myself in ages, so I wasn't much help fixing it.
One of my vacation plans was to get VirtualBox running again here and then send her an external NVMe drive with it and the VM so that she could at least have Winders on her Mac running again.
I've been experimenting with running my two home desktop machines (Bulldozer PC and mid-2010 Mac Mini Core 2 Duo 2.66 GHz) with TightVNC/Screen Sharing (when not connected to my work VPN) to have everything on the same screen and be able to use a single keyboard and mouse. So far, so good.
So, I fired up the trusty Mac Mini and downloaded the latest VirtualBox 6.1.16. Got the Win7 virtual disk installed and running and it seemed pokey, but Ok. I ran Windows Update and it was really slow, but it wanted to install about 1.5 GB of stuff, so Ok.
Of course, there were various problems with the last few Win updates, and it was never able to complete the last one (tried to install it again on every shutdown). Ok, the updates were just a waypoint on the way to installing Win10, annoying but not a show-stopper.
Win 7 in the VM was activated and legal, so I downloaded the Win10 Media Creation Tool to do the install. (Yes, one can still do that.) Had to login as Admin, of course. And after a few minutes, it complained that it needed 8 GB free on the C: drive. Shut down.
Expand the virtual disk in VBox, reboot the VM. Start the install, again it complains that it needs 8 GB free on the C: drive. Grr... Then [ lightbulb! ] - the VM being a dynamic drive doesn't mean anything to Winders - one still has to stretch the partition to actually make it bigger. Ok, do that. Start the install again. Ok.
[ long time passes ]
Yay, Win10. It says it's activated. Yay!
Run Windows Update, install 3 gigantic fixes, but it's really, really slow.
[ long time passes ]
Eventually, it complains that something went wrong and it needs to roll back the changes.
[ long time passes ]
Ok, shut down the VM. What to do? The 20H2 update and fixes worked fine on all the other machines I've installed it on...
Decided to copy the VM to my Bulldozer PC. Install VBox 6.1.16 there, load the Win10 VM and start it. It starts and runs fine, but now says that I need to Activate it. Grrr!!! I run Windows Update, let it install the fixes, everything's fine. CPU load in Winders once it settles down is ~ 5%.
Ok, shut the VM down, copy the VM back to the Mac Mini.
Fire up VBox and the Win10 VM. It's still really slow. But it eventually settles down to an idle load in Win10 of ~ 10-15%. But it's still really slow. Even after checking that the Extend Pack (with USB3, etc., support) and the VM Additions (for installing in the VM with drivers, etc.) were installed.
Thinking about it some, being only able to the VBox 1 CPU of the Core 2 Duo is probably killing the performance. (The mini is maxed out at 16 GB of RAM.)
I also tried VBox 5.2.44 with the same result (as expected).
I copied the 6.1.16 installer on the NVMe drive, threw in a 8 GB stick with the Media Creation Tool files (in case she wants to upgrade her Win7 PC) and stuck it in the mail. Maybe it'll be fine for her on her iMac.
So, it's potentially Mac upgrade time for me. I got J a new 2018 Mac Mini last year and it's a nice fast machine, but I don't really want to spend that much right now. Orcacle/VBox says they won't port it to the M1 (or at least have no plans now), so that won't help if my stepmom wants to keep using VBox.
Once things settle down, I'll talk with my stepmom about activating Win10 in the VM (if necessary) if she wants to go that route.
(Or potentially think about having her use a Win7 PC on her network and Remote Desktop/Screen Sharing/TightVNC to run Quicken Win that way. I'll mention that to her.)
To get this out of my head here at home, and to not have to spend a bunch of time fighting with hardware (installing RAM and an SSD myself), I decided to get a cheap mid-2012 Mac Mini (2.6 GHz quad core i7, 16 GB, 1 TB SSD for $556 all up on ebay). The extra 2 cores make it more appealing than the 2014 dual-core i7s for being able to run VMs. It too maxes out at 16GB, but by the time that starts becoming a real issue, maybe the M1 will be even faster and have more native software. ;-)
The "new" box is supposed to be here by early January. We'll see how it goes.
Cheers,
Scott.
One of my vacation plans was to get VirtualBox running again here and then send her an external NVMe drive with it and the VM so that she could at least have Winders on her Mac running again.
I've been experimenting with running my two home desktop machines (Bulldozer PC and mid-2010 Mac Mini Core 2 Duo 2.66 GHz) with TightVNC/Screen Sharing (when not connected to my work VPN) to have everything on the same screen and be able to use a single keyboard and mouse. So far, so good.
So, I fired up the trusty Mac Mini and downloaded the latest VirtualBox 6.1.16. Got the Win7 virtual disk installed and running and it seemed pokey, but Ok. I ran Windows Update and it was really slow, but it wanted to install about 1.5 GB of stuff, so Ok.
Of course, there were various problems with the last few Win updates, and it was never able to complete the last one (tried to install it again on every shutdown). Ok, the updates were just a waypoint on the way to installing Win10, annoying but not a show-stopper.
Win 7 in the VM was activated and legal, so I downloaded the Win10 Media Creation Tool to do the install. (Yes, one can still do that.) Had to login as Admin, of course. And after a few minutes, it complained that it needed 8 GB free on the C: drive. Shut down.
Expand the virtual disk in VBox, reboot the VM. Start the install, again it complains that it needs 8 GB free on the C: drive. Grr... Then [ lightbulb! ] - the VM being a dynamic drive doesn't mean anything to Winders - one still has to stretch the partition to actually make it bigger. Ok, do that. Start the install again. Ok.
[ long time passes ]
Yay, Win10. It says it's activated. Yay!
Run Windows Update, install 3 gigantic fixes, but it's really, really slow.
[ long time passes ]
Eventually, it complains that something went wrong and it needs to roll back the changes.
[ long time passes ]
Ok, shut down the VM. What to do? The 20H2 update and fixes worked fine on all the other machines I've installed it on...
Decided to copy the VM to my Bulldozer PC. Install VBox 6.1.16 there, load the Win10 VM and start it. It starts and runs fine, but now says that I need to Activate it. Grrr!!! I run Windows Update, let it install the fixes, everything's fine. CPU load in Winders once it settles down is ~ 5%.
Ok, shut the VM down, copy the VM back to the Mac Mini.
Fire up VBox and the Win10 VM. It's still really slow. But it eventually settles down to an idle load in Win10 of ~ 10-15%. But it's still really slow. Even after checking that the Extend Pack (with USB3, etc., support) and the VM Additions (for installing in the VM with drivers, etc.) were installed.
Thinking about it some, being only able to the VBox 1 CPU of the Core 2 Duo is probably killing the performance. (The mini is maxed out at 16 GB of RAM.)
I also tried VBox 5.2.44 with the same result (as expected).
I copied the 6.1.16 installer on the NVMe drive, threw in a 8 GB stick with the Media Creation Tool files (in case she wants to upgrade her Win7 PC) and stuck it in the mail. Maybe it'll be fine for her on her iMac.
So, it's potentially Mac upgrade time for me. I got J a new 2018 Mac Mini last year and it's a nice fast machine, but I don't really want to spend that much right now. Orcacle/VBox says they won't port it to the M1 (or at least have no plans now), so that won't help if my stepmom wants to keep using VBox.
Once things settle down, I'll talk with my stepmom about activating Win10 in the VM (if necessary) if she wants to go that route.
(Or potentially think about having her use a Win7 PC on her network and Remote Desktop/Screen Sharing/TightVNC to run Quicken Win that way. I'll mention that to her.)
To get this out of my head here at home, and to not have to spend a bunch of time fighting with hardware (installing RAM and an SSD myself), I decided to get a cheap mid-2012 Mac Mini (2.6 GHz quad core i7, 16 GB, 1 TB SSD for $556 all up on ebay). The extra 2 cores make it more appealing than the 2014 dual-core i7s for being able to run VMs. It too maxes out at 16GB, but by the time that starts becoming a real issue, maybe the M1 will be even faster and have more native software. ;-)
The "new" box is supposed to be here by early January. We'll see how it goes.
Cheers,
Scott.
